I asked a plain question, you evaded it for reasons all your own.
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It could be a lot of things, but it’s highly unlikely that its lack of practice or overlooking the utility of the movement. You need a very forward thinking horse to work at that level (without a whip). Many are even more amped up by the atmosphere, lack of turnout, travel, crowd, lighting, score board, etc. It’s easy for the horse’s attention to slip towards any outside distraction for a split second as you try to quiet all that energy to the halt - then when you ask for the rein back your horse hasn’t remained, and isn’t, in front of the aids. So you get a poor rhythm, hind legs losing engagement, or horse coming off the bit. Happily, no one movement defines the test.
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There is a notable difference between a general “reinback” and what is considered a proper dressage reinback. In the strictest, traditional training programs the horse is not taught to back under saddle until a much higher level than in other disciplines. I personally do not teach more than a few backing steps at the basic training level, because like over-schooling the walk or allowing front-to-back lead changes, once you screw it up it’s incredibly difficult to undo.
Here is the relevant portion of the rules RE: reinback.
DR106 The Rein Back
- Rein back is a rearward diagonal movement with a two-beat rhythm but without a moment of suspension.
Each diagonal pair of legs is raised and returned to the ground alternatively, with the forelegs aligned on the
same track as the hindlegs. A four-beat rein back that is not clearly two-beat and diagonal, if done without
resistance, could also be scored marginal or better. - During the entire exercise, the horse should remain “on the bit”, maintaining its desire to move forward.
- Anticipation or precipitation of the movement, resistance to or evasion of the contact, deviation of the
hindquarters from the straight line, spreading or inactive hind legs, and dragging forefeet are serious faults. - The steps are counted as each foreleg moves back. After completing the required number of steps backward,
the horse moves immediately forward with a fluid, direct transition to the required gait. In tests where a rein
back of one horse’s length is required, it should be executed with three or four steps. - Rein back series (Schaukel) is a combination of two rein backs with walk steps in between. It should be
executed with fluent transitions and the required number of steps.
As a non-GP rider myself, I would speculate that the reinback is a movement that gives away whatever tension or lack of submission may be lurking under the surface.
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You would be correct. But then, although you might not be a GP rider, you do know something about dressage, as demonstrated by your entire post.
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I’m iffy on even commenting now, being a non-GP rider myself, but its my experience that like another poster has pointed out, the reinback is where any lingering tension or apprehension really comes to the forefront for several reasons.
In most tests it comes up rather ‘abruptly’; you go from 60 to 0 and then to -15. It’s a movement that requires the movements leading up to it to be fluid and harmonious; in the most basic words, if your downward transitions aren’t good, the reinback usually isn’t either. I’ll actually go against what a few other riders have said and say that in my experience I don’t see this movement practiced as much as others, either. I’ve audited in several big clinics from Training to GP and I can’t think of a time I’ve seen the RB practiced in them. Just one person’s tiny perspective.
That being said years ago after watching Land Rover Kentucky’s 5* test, where many of the reinbacks were rushed and the horses appeared above the bit and hollow, I took it upon myself to really work on this at home with my horse. The odds of us ever galloping a 5* tract or going down the centerline in a GP test is slim, but I think the reinback is one of those moments that is just not practiced as much at home by those in my sport. My horse is always looking ahead trying to figure out what I’m going to ask of him next - dressage comes easily to him but I have to make sure to not make things predictable - I can’t ride a test twice or he’ll be piloting it for me. For him, the reinback really forces him to sit back and think before he does something - which is just not how he operates normally. It’s not an easy movement to master even when you are The Master of your class.
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Yes. It’s more about your mount sitting confidently and raising, inflating his front. You and your horse must remain in forward drive. I believe many riders think it means shifting.or rushing into reverse. It is not a backward movement, although it’s backward moving steps, if that makes sense.
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And the test if I recall makes it very very difficult to set up the RB. It opens with an extended canter, (in an absolutely electric atmosphere), then quickly moves to changes…almost impossible to get softness for the RB, which comes up quickly.
I will just chime in and say that my mare can do a beautiful rein back in the saddle or on the ground if she’s in the right frame of mind. But she loses her form if she’s thinking too forward or just doesn’t see the point. I expect that having a rein back in the middle of a high energy test is there for the same reason as halt square. It shows the flaws in your submission and balance.
But the GP is a very high energy test, and the top horses need to put an extravagant amount of energy into forward. I think it’s going to be a challenge to get a relaxed RB on cue. I also think that you might not want to do anything to hinder forward on your overall training.
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Yup, we’re thinking of the same test! It did them absolutely no favors, and that RB came up so fast.
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Forward, straight, uphill, on the bit, and balanced are already difficult when you are moving forwards. If you can’t maintain those into the halt, then you have a lackluster halt. If the halt is not good, then good luck trying to get any of those back without impulsion and forward momentum. And so now your rein back will be dodgy.
Edited bc I can’t spell.
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Remember Andrew Hoys’ one year at Badminton? He almost ended up at X! They graciously gave him a 2 or 3. The grey gelding that did the High Ho Silver move at final salute.
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No. That’s dressage bafflegab that makes this already difficult sport harder to get one’s head around and does no favours to anyone, let alone those hoping to move up the ranks from beginner.
It’s absolutely 100% a backwards movement that uses different muscles than any of the forwards movements. The only thing forwards about it is that the horse should immediately respond to forwards aids and not get stuck running backwards or, just as bad, show a marked halt before moving forwards.
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This is an important clarification. A regular “back” is not the same as a reinback. The former is a regular move, useful for everyday riding and handling. In the former the head is lowered, and you might even lighten your seat a tad to lighten the hind end, particularly in greenies. It is critical IMO to teach.
A dressage reinback is a specific movement. You do not want a reinback, say, when unloading the trailer or backing up over poles or in the wash rack etc. I go internally primate when I see someone “back” their horse by poking them in the chest. First thing, up goes the head. (One of these days I’ll get collagen implants in my lips from biting them and MIMB.
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And halts are often not a strength of many GP tests. Immobility is often lacking at that level when the horses tend to be quite electric and amped up. Another reason the RBs are often not great.
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So not an expert and never was able to show GP with my older horse before lameness ended our show career, but I schooled all of the GP for several years (and in fact will ride him tonight and see what he currently thinks of the trot-rein back-trot from the GP test).
The piaffe is a coefficient score with multiple occurrences in the test and the rein back is 1 score without a coefficient, so it’s probably not schooled as much as the piaffe and p/p transitions. Schooling the piaffe a lot can make a horse anticipate in the walk, halt, etc. and can make “hotter” horses have difficulty with immobility and settling into a halt.
The reason you see “bad” rein backs in GP tests is because it’s a difficult movement and going from backing directly to a trot is really challenging and shows the judge if the horse was sitting in the rein back or on the forehand.
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Adding to your already great post–
Additionally, schooling lots of reinback can end up manifesting itself as backwards tendency in the piaffe, too. If you’re choosing between big scores on piaffe (no backwards steps, but very on the spot, regular, etc.) and big scores on reinback, you’d pick piaffe every time.
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Some trainers/riders us rein back as a punishment. Sad, but true That can result in tension during a test as the horse anticipates. I sense that in horses that rush backwards.
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There are several really informative posts here, thank you! It really speaks to the complexity difficulty of performing the movements together in a test format, vs being able to do one or two at a time at home.
My mare and I are only approaching 2nd level, and I don’t take a ton of lessons, but can’t remember ever being instructed to RB in a lesson. I kind of have to keep a list of what to work on on my own. Which reminds me I’ll have to ask to practice ToH at my next lesson, because that seems to fall through the cracks too.
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I think maybe reinbacks just aren’t ‘sexy’ enough for people to enjoy training them? Maybe they seem too mundane? I dunno, but i still think that if it’s the case that they are often not-great, it’s probably because they are overlooked/not practiced much.
I use them because a) i learn everything at a walk first, so i’m not usually thinking in the mode of big forward. I want perfect slow first. I think i must train strangely. But this mare is like a yoga student. so flexible, and she really likes anything ‘noodley’. We are working on travers and renvers and also shoulderin…all at a walk. We do leg yields to and from the quarterline also (at a walk) And a step or two turn on the fore and full turn on the haunch.
Currently, we still halt first before taking a reinback, but occasionally go from a walk straight back. (a step or two) We do walk/halt/reinbacks…one or two, during our warm ups and we also practice just full halts then too in various places around the arena. All when she’s still fresh from the trailer ride. This is when we work on our lateral movements at a walk too. Early in the session. To collect her renegade brain with thought-envoking moves. If i find her not completely in the zone later on, when we are working her in trot, i’ll throw in a wrench. Could very well be a full halt and reinback. Could be more laterals. Something she likes and that relaxes her and gets her focus back on her body.
i doubt i’ll ever show in grand prix, not even sure i’ll show at training level! But i will be training my horses up through the exercises with an eye toward using the tests as a training tool.
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Doing a collected trot - halt - rein back is completely different than doing a walk - halt - reinback.
If I had to guess, when you reinback your horse probably comes down with the nose lower? That’s the horse coming on the forehand and pushing themselves backward.
Making a forward transition from trot to halt, pausing to show immobility, and then going rhythmically backward to a forward transition to collected trot requires you to basically “ride the clutch” as you would in a sports car.
I’m sure you practice it a lot. The problem is it’s not the same movement.
Also as others have said, getting the halt instead of the piaffe transition can be tricky and training the reinback can get the horse going backward in the piaffe while they’re learning. All things you would not experience if you’re at the place of leg yielding at the walk.
For example, using the reinback to try to put the horse on the aids in trot work is a good way to produce a bad reinback because the horse has already learned to drop into it and back up.
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