Riding race horses in their stalls

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by mht:
All the stories above are the reason I send all of my babies to private facilities to be broken-as if they are going to be riding horses, not race horses. When they go into the track, they already know what is going on and the trainer and the exercise riders are quite grateful. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually, you can cooshy the environment your horses are in all you want, but that doesn’t mean you are going to avoid injury or mishap.

And by the way: Yep, I’ve been banged up (as my mom mentioned in one of the “stories above”) but our babies learn pretty much everything before they go to the track, INCLUDING working from the gate. Sometimes, manure just happens.

They’re horses, for crying out loud, and no matter how much you baby them, they are still unpredictable animals.

Well I have Hunter Ponies. I start them in the stall. I also tie their bits on the halter but I use yarn. I halter break them on day 3 after they are born. When they are two they learn how to do some lounging. They learn hor to tie to a ring in the stall. They get tacked up in a stall. They learn to have the bit in their mouths. I then stand on a small step and then stand above them. I then lay on their backs. I get to where I can swing a leg over and stay low on their necks. Then one day I sit up. When they are being good and I can get on and off in the stall and walk in a circle we move to a round pen. They then learn to walk, and stop. When they master that I stop for a year and start them back when they are 4. Start over in the stall then move to round pen, and walk and trot. Then move to a ring where they w-t-and canter. I also try to teach them how to ground drive while they are 3 and have the year off. I have never had a problem and most just come along.

Timex,
I also deal with many horse people who think that their trainer’s way the only way. It drives me crazy. I believe that there are many ways to train, groom, or whatever when it comes to horses. What works for one, may not work for another. I quite often have changed the way I do something when I see that, perhaps, it could be done better another way. And, many times, they were not what my various trainers taught me to do.

llt – I appreciate your sence of humor!!!

Timex,

No need to be sorry, I really need to edit my statement to say that I have learned the most from Race Horse people versus any of the other disciplines.

Reading Two Simple’s post brought back years of repression and angst, all originating from getting on horses in stalls.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>I’ve seen little kids get in trouble for mounting up in the aisles. To do so was punishment of mucking stalls, getting a phone home to the parents, and kicked out of lessons on a “timeout” until the lesson was learned.
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I too suffered, from breaking horses in stalls. It led me to bedwetting, and a mild case of tourette’s. Please friends, do not mount horses in their stalls, the consequenses can be severe.

It’s been a while since I have looked at this thread, but…mht, how many “public facilities” can you send a horse to to be saddle broke, as opposed to the “private facilities” you opt for. And race horses ARE riding horses, I doubt that you have had race horses for longer than I have been on earth, but if indeed you have, I am impressed you can remember that far back. The race horses owned by my family have always been saddle broke, in the privacy of our farm, safe in their stalls.

e who think that their trainer’s way the only way.[
Whenyou areworking foran owner or trainer their way IS he only way, I have been very slow to learn this, but, it’s true, unless they ask you for a better way.don’t ofer any suggestions., or new fangled way of doing things; It frightens the humans, too much. The horse may like it but.the owners, and, trainers get very frightened, after all, What id IFit WORKED?

First of all, you have to consider that most(certainly not all) baby trainers want the babies broke quickly, in the least amount of time possible. This doesn’t allow for lunging in a round pen, or line driving, or anything else even remotely time consuming. Generally, this type of breaking involves turning the each rider loose with a horse in a standard 12X12 stall, and letting him or her go at it. This allows for breaking six or more horses at a time, depending on how many riders are available. By the end of the morning, every baby in the barn will have had a rider up and turned in the stall.

The first day, the rider will usually sack the horse out, put on the bridle and the saddle, and hold the girth tight with one hand, not actually fastening it yet. Then he turns the horse in the stall, with a rope shank attached to the bit or to the halter. By not fastening the girth, if the horse comes unglued, the saddle can be removed quickly, instaed of sliding under the belly, as it might if just loosely fastened. Once the horse accepts the girth, then it is tightened by degrees, turning the horse both ways at every step. Then the rider will jump up and “belly” the horse, until he accepts the weight, then he will get astride and sit. Next comes turning with a rider. Some trainers will have a groom turn the horse on a shank with the rider up at first, some let the rider do it themselves, using the reins, their stick and their heels. Most riders I know would rather tough it out themselves rather than risk their neck to a groom who might flip the horse if it acts up. This often all happens on the very first day, with two or three more days of turning in the stall, and then straight out to the shedrow and/or paddock. If a horse is particularly bad or nervous, the rider may take longer, but the average horse gets that far in a single session at most training centers.
The idea of having the horse in a stall for all of this is that not only is a horse usually more comfortable in his own stall, instead of out in the open in a strange place, but a round pen gives them way too much room to get away from you, and it gives them way more room to buck. Trying to do all that in an open round pen all at once would be far more dangerous than in a stall, as long as the rider knows what he’s doing. I personally cannot imagine climbing on a brand new baby the first day in an open round pen. Give me a nice enclosed stall any day of the week. We used to break around 130 babies every season, and in 7 years I only remember two riders getting hurt. One was when the groom did manage to flip the baby over on top of him by yanking down on the shank while he was up, and the other was a rider who refused to put a shank on the horse at all, and it got away from him when he put the saddle on the first time, breaking hs finger.
It’s all what you’re used to. You just have to be able to adapt to the situation.

I’m with foundationmare on this one. Starting horses can be dangerous no matter where/how you do it. In my opinion, the best way to do it is the way that makes the one in the dangerous position the most comfortable - as the horse can sense whether they are confident or not and will feed off of it accordingly.

I’m the most comfortable in a bigger arena. That’s not to say that’s the safest place to be. It just makes me comfortable to have space to move should there be an issue. I’ve started about 100 horses and my methods work for me. I have a friend who has started just as many, and she does it in the round pen and w/t/c the first day she backs them. Her method doesn’t work for me. It does work beautifully for her.

The gist? If breaking babies in a stall works for you - no reason to change it If it doesn’t work for you, there’s no reason to knock those who it does work for.

Unfortunetly I do not have the time nor the patience to read five pages on this thread - so I’m unsure to the reaction of this question. I’ll just imput what I know.

I am an exersize rider and therefore around many baby breakers at the race track. It is completely true that they are broken in the stall - but it really depends on the person who’s breaking and their prefernce.

BWhy?[/B]

A smaller area the horse can go - the more the rider can focus on the baby. The baby is normally comfortable with the stall already. The rider can make use of the walls to their advantage and the horse generally can’t start a broncing fit inside. In a round pen - if control is lost - a run around it can be hard to get back. Also - time spent long-lining is only a few days. Generally speaking - horses that are on the lunge and worked on the ground for months have the ability to be first “bellyed up” in the round pen because they’ve had much more done to them and they have more trust built up. When the race horses are shipped to the stalls - long lined for a few days and then got on - they dont have time to think.

BWhat safety precautions are taken to avoid injury to rider?[/B]

The same as any - it’s their own risk. All the stalls at the barn have roofs that are 20 feet above them - so there’s no slamming into a low roof. The groom is always outside the stall ready to help as needed.

BDo you feel this is a perfectly safe practice that poses no more danger to the rider than mounting a horse in an arena?[/B]

Mounting a baby for the first time ANYWHERE is a danger. Each rider is DIFFERENT and more comfortable and safer in different places. If a baby-starter of 20 years had broke them in a stall with hardly any problems and then was asked to get on them in an arena - the risk of something bad happening is increased. Either way - the rider should know what they’re doing. There is always a risk and always a danger - so I naturally find the stall a dangerous place just as an arena. In both areas bad things could happen in equal severity.

BWhat size are these stalls?[/B]

roughly 12 x 12

I don’t have first hand experience with backing in stalls, but I have heard it is the way most people do it.
I know at Keeneland for the sales when we had yearlings that were fractious for baths, we bathed them in a stall! Out in the open they were HORRIBLE. Put them in a stall and they were calm as can be.

Hey Rapid Run!! Merry Christmas…haven’t been over here in a while…hope all is well. It IS amazing the number of yearlings one gets on over the years without incident…and the Rokeby crew probably WAS riding them in from the fields every day as weanlings…LOL!!
…and thanks to everyone who helped me find my new guy’s win pictures. The TBD photographer was super nice…and my Prairie’s impressive MSW win photo is on it’s way!!!

seems like a stall would be safer than the way I got on my guy the first time- bareback, no rope on the halter, from a big round bale in the middle of a field.

LOL.

Fact of training life: Horses are ridden out of & back into their stalls. Yes, it is a sin under Pony Club rules, but this is not Pony Club. Ducking in/out of the stall is the least of a riders worries whilst upon a youngster.

For grooming and presentation…the shakey tail world of course!..and surprisingly, for corrective shoeing innovations…the jug heads!
…sorry…gaited and trotters

LOL. Wow. I didn’t realize that my post over in H/J’s started such a big deal. Let’s see, I agree with all the racetrackers on here. At first I was kinda nervous to get on in the stall, but I really trusted my ground person. Now, I don’t know that I would do it any other way…when it comes to breaking racehorses. My paint on the other hand, is trained completely differently as she is a show horse and I’ve taken a different approach with her, so I wouldn’t be completely turned off to getting on her in a round pen/arena.

I think it’s funny that two step, or whatever the name is implied that I don’t value my life and I don’t feel it’s precious. Well, that’s the opposite of what’s true and I also value my career. So being able to learn from people with so much more experience, and different ways of doing things to me is very important. However, I wouldn’t exactly jeopardize my safety. I felt comfortable 90% of the time. And the ONE time I didn’t feel safe I was on this filly in the ROUND PEN and she reared straight up in the air. She was quiet and fine in the stall mind you. But when she almost flipped over, I told the trainer that I was getting off of her. A man I respect a whole lot told me after this, because I was upset with myself for not being able to ride her, that I did the right thing. He said, “There are thousands of babies to break, and only ONE of you.” So yeah, if I don’t feel comfortable, I’m getting off. However, I think it’s a perfectly acceptable and common practice.

And also, sorry if I didn’t clarify…the horse wasn’t “wild”. He was just terrified of people because he was beaten. There are tons of ways to do things, and tons of ways that work for tons of people. It’s unfortunate that some people can’t be open minded when it comes to training ideas, learning from one another and getting more insight as to the thing that’s supposedly so imporant to them, the horses.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Originally posted by Meadow36:

I love racing, I always have, but I really wish they would switch the Triple Crown and make it for four year olds. I think we’d see a lot less injuries then. It’s too bad it will never happen. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

FWIW, there’s a TC, of sorts, for 4YOs - The Handicap Triple Crown. The Metropolitan, Brooklyn & Suburban Handicaps. I don’t know if the JC officially recognizes it as a formal package. At any rate, they’re all run in NY so they don’t make much news around the country.

I live in Ocala. A: Standard stalls here are 16x16, including for yearlings. B: I do not know a farm w/o a round pen. C: Yes, youngsters are started in stalls.

We always rode into the stalls after shedrowing, galloping, etc. - the trainer claimed it made it easier to gate train them, as they were used to walking through a narrow opening with someone on their back, as opposed to stopping outside of it.

I was never nervous bellying/backing the babies in the stall, as long as I had one of the “good” grooms at the horse’s head.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>I hope that one day you have the opportunity to tour a true Thoroughbred facility. Mixing yearlings in with racing and breeding stock as you described on the other thread is not SOP for most facilities. The yearlings have their own section of the farm (or their own farm!) and a manager just for them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Amen. Now, off to win friends and influence people elswhere!..LMAO!!!