Not singling you out but guys this post right here is why Safe Sport is necessary. How F’d up is this?
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I do agree that victims should NOT be named publicly, however I absolutely am against anonymous reporting. Keep the names confidential, but they need to be attached to the report.
No one is saying Safesport is a bad concept. We can all agree that athletes need to be protected. But I do think the way it was implemented is flawed. It’s a system that lends itself to abuse because accountability only goes one way: on the accused. Accountability needs to be on the accused, the accuser, and Safesport equally. Assumption of guilt isn’t protecting people. By the time the investigation is complete? It’s far too late for those found innocent.
Do I think false reports are a minority? Yes. But I also recognize we’re in a sport with a lot of money involved, more than a little crazy, and several people with questionable ethics.
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It is an interesting cultural phenomenon…and why so many abuse victims never come forward. The victim shaming that happens to abuse victims is mind blowing. Yet, no one victim blames the alter boys when they have been molested by priests, no matter how many years ago it happened. Hearing people speak about abusers in this fashion, “S/he was such a nice person” and “S/he would give you the shirt off their back” and “My god it was 35 years ago. Really.” only proves the mindset of our society.
No other crime is questioned in the same way by society - what were you wearing, how much did you have to drink, did you lead them on? Imagine questioning a convenience store clerk who had just been held at gun point - what were you wearing, how much did you have to drink, did you lead them on?
It shouldn’t matter whether it happened 30 years ago or 3 days ago. Abuse is abuse, and for some people, the healing process doesn’t start until they go public and their abuser is brought to justice and they can finally close that chapter of their life. To belittle someone by saying, “I hope whomever decided to report a 35 year old incident is still happy with their decision” is so beyond heartless and misinformed. I don’t know the details of Mr. Gage’s case, but if a sexual assault did happen, the victim has a right to report the abuse, a right to tell their story and a right to bring their abuser to justice, regardless of how long ago it happened.
And I’m sorry, a 17 year old dating a 25 year old is considered statutory rape (if sex was involved) in most states and countries! A person under the age of 18 cannot consent to sex because they are not mature enough to make those kinds of decisions. I’m sorry but a 17 year old and a 25 year old have nothing in common. Just because everyone turned a blind eye to it 30 years ago doesn’t mean it was OK.
Reading the comments on that disgusting Facebook thread and seeing the true mindset of people tells me we need an abuse reporting system in place more than ever. Sexual abuse/assault is the one crime were the accused is considered guilty until proven innocent…but it is also the one crime in which the victim is constantly blamed for the criminal’s actions.
The biggest problem for USEF right now is that members don’t know enough about SafeSport and that has created a lot of assumptions in regards to how SafeSport is managed and how accusations are investigated. As a result, it has created a rumor mill and instilled fear. I think it is something USEF needs to address if they want positivity, going forward.
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Thank you, Daventry. Well said and necessary.
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What the heck does money have to do with anything? Gage wasn’t found innocent. He was however appealing the ruling. Do you realize that victims rights are a new concept?
Those people with questionable ethics are giving cocaine to horses and sleeping with minors amongst other things. And as per one poster she was interviewed by Safe Sport. THEY know who she is. YOU don’t need that information. It’s a third part investigation. By all means if you know someone who has made false accusations report them.
Again. Y’all are mad name dropping won’t get you a free pass.
Am I the only one that finds it funny that the one discipline that will never be under the FEI or an Olympic sport is THE only one complaining rabidly about Safe Sport?
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On the questioning about drinking/what you were wearing…
From a law enforcement officer? These questions ARE relevant. The reason clothing is asked about is to make sure everything is collected for evidence. Drinking is asked about to determine the possibility of the victim being drugged. If the victim did see the drink prepared? The odds something was slipped in it are much smaller than if they didn’t.
The problem is that people who aren’t law enforcement think they also have a right to ask these questions, and completely misinterpret the reason they’re being asked. These questions are absolutely not ok when asked by anyone other than law enforcement.
Again, I’m not against the idea of Safesport. I’m against having a completely different legal standard when the repercussions are so far-reaching. I’d be much less concerned if this was a “turn over to law enforcement for investigation and act on the results” setup. I agree that convictions should automatically be acted on by Safesport. But I’m not comfortable with the investigation/suspension process as it stands currently.
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So law enforcement DOES NOT ask those questions in the manner you presented. Not if they are remotely ethical and if they do, people file grievances.
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I have to agree with @MyssMyst here. I am also for the implication of a policing measure to stop abuse of minors. I have NO problem with bringing attention to predators and protecting young people. I am a survivor myself (though not from equestrian activities). I understand what a victim goes through on a very personal level. I also understand that 98% of reports are made by people being truthful and without malice. HOWEVER, we also have to accept that, in its current form, there is room for abuse in the Safe Sport format. To deny that and beat our breasts indignantly will not help SafeSport to become the most effective tool it can be. We need to address issues and refine and improve the process.
My example in my earlier post was of a female trainer who was losing clients. She threatened a male trainer that if he accepted any of her clients she would claim that he used an abuse of power (she was not a minor) to induce her into a sexual relationship. He did not accept the clients because he understood the “guilty until proven innocent” timbre of Safe Sport.
We must remain open minded and not just shout each other down when we present opposing views.
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@Didi did you report that trainer threatening to make a false accusation? Because that’s reportable and punishable under Safe Sport as well.
It goes both ways. But if one knows of such things and stays silent… I would hope you stay silent on the rest of it.
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Having already watched this happen once, since I’m a big figure skating fan, my feelings about this are honestly the same as they were in January: what has happened here is tragic, and I’m not discounting the tragedy, and the people who knew him absolutely have the right to mourn as they see fit.
With that being said, though, the tragedy of it also doesn’t eliminate the validity of an accuser’s right to report or be heard, or the potential severity of whatever may have happened to that person. The emotions get complicated, and I honestly felt sick to my stomach when I saw this come up on Twitter last night, but I still stand by the importance of having a mechanism like SafeSport available to people, especially if law enforcement will not (or cannot) do anything of consequence for a victim but their organization may be able to provide some support.
We obviously don’t know all of the details regarding accusations in this situation and otherwise, but it’s been my understanding that SafeSport doesn’t just open a full investigation or levy a suspension against someone (temporary or otherwise), or publicly announce any suspensions, unless they have a legitimate reason to believe it’s necessary. Some people may feel that it happens willy-nilly, but that’s not the impression that I’ve gotten. Is there room for improvement? Absolutely, there always is, but I don’t think eliminating SafeSport is really the answer here either.
(It also speaks to the climate of vitriol surrounding these discussions across a lot of social media platforms that I even feel uncomfortable posting this much of an opinion, but so be it.)
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Nope. I noticed that too.
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Next question, am I also the only one that finds it humorous when hunters carry on about their trainers, idols and friends losing business when PV is just fine, LG and KF are just fine and RG probably would have been just fine despite killing horses for money, drugging horses constantly, and diddling kids?
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From my professional opinion working in the Mental health field, your statement is too simple to be validated. Realize the chain of events that occurs from a “single, determining factor”, a downward spiral in this case. It’s a butterfly effect. The same way in which someone who goes to jail kills themself while incarcerated before trial. Doesn’t mean that they have a long list of “reasons”. The single act of the safe sport allegations have created a detrimental chain of events. From tarnishing someone’s name, ruining their career, labeling them as a predator, causing financial stress from the lack of a job, emotional stress, public humiliation. All without investigation, evidence, etc. Your statement is ignorant at best.
SafeSport is flawed and unconstitutional. It needs to be revisited, revised, then reimplemented. There is no way in which abuse of a minor should occur, ever. But this quickly implemented, witch hunt of an organization is crap to say the least. No due process, no statute of limitations, guilty until proven innocent. It is a scare tactic and also being used maliciously. It’s ruining the livelihood of others, victims and the accused.
I have many issues with SafeSport. We are not like other sports, so the daily “communicate with the minor athlete and parent, another adult, 2 additional minors” is irresponsible. If a student is texted to get on their horse 15 mins early, does there really need to be another adult to hound them as well? It’s the “let’s hold your hand through life” society. Zero responsibility, zero accountability. Horses are a lifestyle. SafeSport is not the answer.
I’m waiting for USEFs press release on this one, or will there even be one?..
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The idea of Safe Sport is not the problem.
But when they take on the roll of judge and jury before all evidence is in, is the issue.
The process needs to change. I agree they need to investigate. But to put a person’s life on hold when accused while they do, is wrong. Especially in a situation that is over 3.5 decades old!
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Amen
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Who here complaining about Safesport has actually gone through the process with them?
Someone I know has, and trust me, they don’t just take someone’s word for it. They do a lot of leg work and investigating before they even begin investigating. Seems a lot of posters here are blabbing on about something they don’t even have the slightest clue how it works. It is a legitimate process that no innocent person should ever be concerned about.
@Didi that situation can happen any time, not just with Safe Sport, that is just something a shady person would do, and when they investigate they will see the truth pretty damn quick.
I have heard many UL eventers applouding SS. Saying it will help keep kids safe and actually make things easier and more organized for them especially regarding contacting their minor students.
I get the vibe people have seen things and know who might be next on the hit list, and thats what truly bothers them.
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Here is my solution for all the show hunters. Split from the USEF like the AERC and the ADS. Petition the USHJA to be its own entity separate from the USEF. Hunters are not an FEI sport. They are not an Olympic sport. Therefore y’all have no need to be apart of the USEF. This will allow you freedom from SafeSport and go back to business as usual.
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Ok, but there is investigations, and a process. Not really sure why everyone keeps saying there isn’t.
If a rider (minor) needs to be texted to get on their horse at time XYZ - maybe they can become an actual horseman and learn what to do themselves. Talk about hand holding, we grew up showing without cell phones and amazing, made it into the ring just the same to win the same prizes. Ridiculous.
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The option are not 1. Safe Sport or 2. Let Predators Get Away With It.
Asking for an examination of Safe Sport’s practices does not mean anyone wants more Larry Nassar’s in the world. Many of us lost a friend today. I lost a friend today. The horse world lost decades of knowledge and devotion to the sport, the animals, and the people strive to become horsemen.
We lost a man who was always quick with smiles and encouragement to everyone.
It is right to ask if Safe Sport is truly doing its job. It is American to question the agencies that govern us. It’s time to find a way to do this better.
Saw the above I’ve posted on Facebook. My thoughts exactly. Nobody here is “complaining about safesport” per se, just the way it has been arbitrarily and capriciously implemented.
also Dani many of those looking at it with a critical eye are jumper riders, too. 
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Nailed it.
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