Saddle fitter's posts about chair seat/alignment and using no thigh blocks

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

Believe me, I’m done them! I’m almost ashamed to say how much yoga I require just to move like a human being, much less ride!

To not do a full thread derail…no rider is anatomically perfect, but I’m sure (especially for amateur nonathletes) stuff like blocks (as well as improving fitness off-horse) helps some more than others and is necessary for some more than others.

Again, this reminds me of debates in the running world of how an “ideal” runner doesn’t need orthotics or heavily cushioned shoes. Maybe that’s true, but we’re all trying to make the most of what we have and have fun.

[pluvinel]

The position of the leg should come from the seat. The seat comes from balance.

I suggest doing what an old cavalry colonel had me do to see if you are riding from balance or by gripping anywhere in your leg…calves, thighs. You put your legs in front of the flaps and sit on your behind.

We had to do Walk - Trot - Canter like this. You will soon find out if you are gripping anywhere in your legs or hips.

Here is a picture.

The image comes from Wendy Murdoch’s site where she describes how to do this.

I personally can’t stand thigh blocks.

[BigMama1]

@pluvinel

I personally can’t stand thigh blocks.

And that’s ok, because you don’t have to use them. I find it odd when people think nobody should ride with thigh blocks because they don’t personally like them.

I’m old enough to have done plenty of riding in flat as a pancake, hard as a rock dressage saddles - with white string girths and an overgirth on top, no less! But nowadays I like a little more comfort, a deeper seat and a decent sized block. I have very large thighs and short legs, so the long blocks and angled blocks don’t work for me at all. They are never in the right spot for me. My Paramount saddle has Velcro blocks, which is ideal, because I can move them or take them off completely if I want. My Trilogy saddle has large blocks but they are positioned just right so I feel like they add stability without locking me in or making me brace.

Whatever floats your own boat.

[CanteringCarrot]

I quite like velcro or otherwise adjustable blocks. I can swap mine out for 4 different sizes/shapes or have none at all. It’s interesting to experiment and I do believe that our preferences can change over time.

[pluvinel]

@BigMama1

@pluvinel

I personally can’t stand thigh blocks.

And that’s ok, because you don’t have to use them. I find it odd when people think nobody should ride with thigh blocks because they don’t personally like them.

How does saying that I personally don’t like thigh blocks get twisted to mean that NOBODY should ride in thigh blocks?

You can’t be balanced if you are defending yourself against a saddle that gives you a wedgie or puts you into an uncomfortable position.

Ride in what you like and what fits you and your horse. If you like thigh blocks…go for it.

I was addressing @Impractical_Horsewoman comments about being a runner…and perhaps a highly toned athlete might have muscle tightness that they are unawares they carry.

The exercise I described will help a rider develop awareness if they are “tight” in the hips or legs and how that can affect their seat.

[rothmpp]

@MapleBreeze

If you leg is slipping back youre in a fork seat and gripping with your calfs instead of balancing. Youre tipping forward with the front of your pelvis. You have to lift up from your upper thigh and bring it behind your hip and adjust your stirrip length - youre either too long or too short. This is the opposite problem of a chair seat. Also scoot up and get your crotch against the pommel before fixing your legs and base.

But im sorry if youre a pro and i said that. I didnt read the whole post.

Or - the saddle is completely the wrong configuration for her personal structure & anatomy. Which was my point in an earlier post. It’s not always sitting differently in the current saddle - it can be about getting a saddle that you as a rider are not constantly fighting because it is and will always be the wrong shape for your body.

If you’re riding leased horses you don’t always have a huge say in the matter, but just saying someone is in a fork seat and reposition your leg is not always useful or even correct information. Forcing your leg to hang in a way that may physically cause the rider pain can make a rider hate dressage.

[BigMama1]

@pluvinel

How does saying that I personally don’t like thigh blocks get twisted to mean that NOBODY should ride in thigh blocks?

Sorry I didn’t mean you personally were saying nobody should. I meant I don’t understand why some people (g you) do, and get so bent out of shape about the fact that some people prefer blocks.

[eightpondfarm]

@BigMama1

I meant I don’t understand why some people (g you) do, and get so bent out of shape about the fact that some people prefer blocks.

Who does? Here in this thread? or that internet/facebook saddle-fitter in the OP?

[sascha]

@eightpondfarm

Who does?

Saddle fitter and some big name riders/trainers who propose that everyone should be able to ride their best in a flat, flat, no knee rolls saddle.

[pluvinel]

Chair seat…schmair seat. The question is can your ride effectively?

Here is a video of Alycia Burton…how I wish I could ride like this

Alycia Burton- WHO is she? extreme bareback jumper

And for the DQ’s here is Nuno…

Nuno Oliveira lipizzan

Both these riders are very effective riders…

[Mondo]

Agree 100% Pluvinel! First, when bareback, you absolutely have to be in a “chair seat.” So I think that rider is wonderful.

In my opinion, at no time is Nuno in a chair seat. He’s sitting so quietly on that horse as to not interfere with its way of going at all. Poetry in motion. Thanks for posting those!

I am not going to opine on the thigh block debate because I think it is purely a rider preference.

[pluvinel]

Then there is the unconventional…but effective…chair seat.

https://www.facebook.com/manuelborba.veiga/videos/3651610821731322/

[BigMama1]

@eightpondfarm

Who does? Here in this thread? or that internet/facebook saddle-fitter in the OP?

People in general in horse discussions on the internet. Particularly those who believe everything about “modern dressage” or “competition dressage” is atrocious. There are a few Facebook groups I used to frequent where riding in a saddle with thigh blocks is considered a cardinal sin and a surefire way to determine someone is a terrible rider…even if some of those “someones” are amongst the most accomplished riders in the world lol.

I don’t follow that saddle fitter in the OP so don’t know where they stand on the issue.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

Their descriptive hashtag is Team #noblocksnoproblems. So I assumed they were anti!

[pony_baloney]

A few of the riders at my barn (middle aged women who don’t compete) ride with stirrups that seem a bit too long; when posting they go into a chair seat trying to reach their stirrups.

I ride in a very old flat minimalist Passier and have my stirrups quite short. Also I’m a big fan of Mary Wanless/biomechanics which encourages shorter stirrups and shoulder/hip/heel alignment. If anything I’m guilty of having my feet a bit too far behind me.

What’s interesting is that as my pony warms up and his back lifts, he puts me in a more correct position. My knees are at the edge of the saddle flaps and the tiny bit of a roll acts as a buffer. Having shorter stirrups, my thigh isn’t very vertical. In the past when I tried longer stirrups or tried a saddle with a thigh block that held my leg more vertically, it made my lower back arch a bit and caused pain.

I gotta say that if I was riding a big-moving larger horse, I’d definitely feel more secure with some blocks or rolls holding me in the saddle. My pony moves like a horse, but a big cushy saddle would look like he had a Lazy Boy on his back.

[mvp]

Yanno, everyone, one thing to consider is the angle of the bottom of the pelvis on folks.

What I mean is the relationship between your spine when you are sitting in balance on a horse,…

how your spine joins your pelvis (with that swung underneath that spine or back out, like the proverbial duck’s ass)…

and how the pelvis is itself is built. Compared to, say, the top of those wings of the pelvis in front, is the line drawn from the underside of the pubic bone to the back of the sitting bones closer to horizontal or closer to vertical?

Do you know how yours is built? I don’t know that. I did have a Rolfer once tell me that I had one of the most neutral pelvises she had seen. I think that means that the way my pelvis joined my spine was not fore- or aft. I don’t know if she could tell me about the shape of the bottom dimension. And Rolfers get their hands way up on your business there, so if anyone would know, they would.

It seems to me that the shape of the saddle you like will depend a whole helluva on this mysterious, no-one-measures-it orientation of the bottom side of one’s pelvis. So until we can figure that out, I cut people some slack. So long as they sit in a position that lets them ride by balance and allows them to “just let their legs hang,” unless they mean to use them, I’m good. But that might mean the relationship between their upper body and legs that we see from the outside will differ.

[Mondo]

Did anyone watch the video of Charlotte Fry winning individual gold (on the front page here)? Just wondering if you anti-thigh block guys think she is a poor rider who can’t sit properly without those HUGE thigh blocks on her saddle. Because I assure you, she didn’t get to where she is by having poor equitation. Just a thought.

[Bogey2]

excellent post! I was told I have “freakishly” long thighs by a saddle fitter…LOL. I have a difficult time in some saddles. I often get a size 18 to accommodate even though I am a size 6 and 5’4.

[BigMama1]

I’m with you on the shorter stirrups. For me they provide more stability and help keep my short fat legs in the right place without putting too much strain on my tight aged hip flexors and arthritic lower back. I dream of having that long, vertical draped leg, but for some of us that’s never going to happen.

[cnm161]

Pretty rough treatment of your friend there.

I see too many people reduce their horses’ gaits to what they can ride comfortably (vs. what is actually work for the rider but improves the gaits) to subscribe to your second paragraph. If blocks help a rider get out of the way and let their horse really swing, more power to 'em. Better than bottling up the horse to a jog.