Your horse is a flatter type, not a curvy type. To be fair, we were fitting knowing that he lost a lot of weight so the right padding/shimming is essential until he fills out again. It’s often said you can only fit what is in front of you but you don’t want to fit a horse to the size you know is short lived and that means messing around a bit with shimming and width.
[QUOTE=Synthesis;8611881]
I’ve had several Perch/TB crosses that inherited the big shoulder/wither combo. The Passier PS tree is something I’ve found consistently successful. The shape, cutback pommel and the very short tree points seem to be a winning combination without having to go custom[/QUOTE]
Sorry to hijack, but I will be saddle shopping for a similar type TB as well, and always loved Passier dressage saddles, so would like to try the Passier close contact saddles. Do you know which models have this PS tree? Is it only the old PS Baum or are there others?
Maybe some of the tree experts can come on here but Black Country can get you a flat tree, there must be other brands that work. Black Country’s are available in a myriad of options that are custom so I would not personally ever rule that brand out; one of the few that doesn’t just have 1 generic tree shape.
I have a thoroughbred who looks very much like yours and after waaayyyy too much time and money and lots and lots of help from an independent saddle fitter, I ended up with an Albion (the Kontact lite.) The key for him was that he really needed something with gussets. Good luck!! I know how frustrating the search is.
Another relatively less-common brand is Borne (made by Sanky). I just recently discovered them, and they have a wide variety of tree shapes to fit many backs and wither combinations. Not just standard N, M, W tree points, but actually built with different tree designs, lengths, and curvatures to help provide a glove-like fit.
I test-rode several of them today and the difference was remarkable. I never knew a saddle could fit my horse so well. They are very well made, but expensive, and I will need to do some serious budgeting to afford one…but I am really motivated to make it happen. Customer service is outstanding-- they guarantee to make you a saddle that fits and performs as you want it. Can’t wait to get one.
[QUOTE=laurendrew;8616068]
I haven’t minded the Albions I’ve sat in, but sadly the only ones I ever see for sale are all 17.5/18 seat or a wide tree. I was able to try one of their medium dressage saddle on Enzo back in October and it was a pretty good fit, but I was swimming in it as it was a 17.5". I often wish my butt wasn’t non-existent so that finding a saddle that fit us both would be easier!![/QUOTE]
I have found the Albion twist to be uncomfortably wide and I cannot ride in one for longer than 5 minutes.
Same with me as to lurking and now commenting haha 
I’ve never heard of the S1 but will definitely look into it! I’ve had people recommend Prestige to try for a dressage saddle, not sure if the paneling on their jump saddles will work for him (I think he’s going to need wither gussets, or at the very least a shim pad to fill in the hollows). Thanks!!
[QUOTE=goodmorning;8618332]
Maybe some of the tree experts can come on here but Black Country can get you a flat tree, there must be other brands that work. Black Country’s are available in a myriad of options that are custom so I would not personally ever rule that brand out; one of the few that doesn’t just have 1 generic tree shape.[/QUOTE]
Yes, Jay’s been helping me with wither tracings!! She’s been awesome. The flatter trees on the BC’s I’ve tried on him have sat better than the curvier ones, a tiny bit of bridging but not horrible.
[QUOTE=Winding Down;8618850]
I have found the Albion twist to be uncomfortably wide and I cannot ride in one for longer than 5 minutes.[/QUOTE]
I had the exact opposite experience! Everything I had sat in felt like it was splitting my pelvis (compared to my older Crosby). I bought my Albion and immediately felt incredibly comfortable and secure within minutes.
[QUOTE=laurendrew;8619544]
Same with me as to lurking and now commenting haha
I’ve never heard of the S1 but will definitely look into it! I’ve had people recommend Prestige to try for a dressage saddle, not sure if the paneling on their jump saddles will work for him (I think he’s going to need wither gussets, or at the very least a shim pad to fill in the hollows). Thanks!![/QUOTE]
You should definitely take a look. There are two trees - one sits essentially behind the wither while the other sits over the wither but doesn’t touch it. It’s the only way I can accurately describe it but I’m probably not doing it much help haha. I would consider getting a dressage saddle of the same saddle if I decide to keep this guy. Bought him as a confidence boost while my mare is in training but may end up keeping him instead :winkgrin:
Here’s a good link: http://www.olsonstack.com/blog/2012/05/24/the-revolutionary-prestige-s1/
Like I said - pricey. But my local rep had a demo I was able to purchase, so you may be able to find a deal!
Uuuugh. Because he had been acting so uncharacteristically, on the ground and under saddle (he’s picky about saddles, but he’s never been THAT expressive about it), I had the vet take a look at him. Poor guy has a broken tooth (long story short, when I bought him he had just turned 9, horrible mouth + infected tooth, vet is fairly sure he had never had his teeth done. This tooth may be the same one, couldn’t get a close enough look) and hind gut ulcers. I had treated him for normal ulcers and had him on UGard but had the vet test for both anyways- glad I did!
Hopefully he’ll feel much better soon and we can resume trying saddles Dentist is coming out ASAP and he’s been started on treatment for the hind gut ulcers. We are tentatively entered in an event (King Oak) on May 7, so hoping to sort everything out sooner than later haha
To preserve what’s left of my “good name” I should probably post this under an alter. I have a horse that shape and Wintec worked better for him than a lot of much “nicer” saddles… I guess you could upgrade a bit and try a Bates…
Agreed - our 2* TB is currently being fitted for a new Prestige to replace his existing one as his withers have got more prominent as he gets older and also because he gets to the super fit stage more quickly and easily now. The very new Prestige trees and flocking seem like they will address his shape issues very well.
[QUOTE=riverinthewoods;8617554]
New to the forums but have been a lurker for quite a bit
I just purchased a 10 year old OTTB gelding almost a month ago. I’m hoping to get into eventing with him and I’m hoping his laid back attitude will help to boost my adult ammy confidence issues!
Unfortunately, right off the bat we realized we had saddle issues. My Ovation Evolution that has fit literally every horse and pony I’ve tried it on, was definitely not a good fit for my new guy. I also knew it was time for an upgrade (to something, newer and a little bigger) and had a saddle fitter come out.
My guy has probably one of the biggest withers I’ve ever seen, and while I don’t think his shoulders are very big - the way he is built the shoulders definitely worried me in terms of finding a saddle fit. I knew that due to the above and his ‘long’ body type, whatever saddle I may end up with would probably sit farther back on him and I would more than likely need a breastplate.
The first saddle I tried was a cutback pommel. No thank you…it didn’t fit me well and I felt like I couldn’t even sit properly in it. But the next saddle I tried was a Prestige S1. I’m not sure of your budget, as these get pretty up there in price, but this saddle was an eye opener for me and needless to say, I fell in love with the most expensive one! It actually has two trees, one that sits farther back on him and then the typical tree. We have lots of clearance in the wither and the shoulder and the saddle is basically guaranteed to fit my other horse, a bulkier OTTB mare, and pretty much any other horse. It’s definitely worth taking a look at. I was able to contact my Prestige dealer in my state and he (thankfully) had a 2015 demo that I was able to try and purchased for less than the full price for an essentially brand new saddle.
So far - I love it. I’m hoping to possibly get a dressage saddle for him in the future and would definitely consider the same brand.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=laurendrew;8610010]
I’ll preface this by saying that I’m going to send some photos to a saddle fitter as she isn’t able to come out until the end of the month, and may take wither tracings to bring with me and/or send to Pelham Saddlery and/or Trumbull Mtn (they’re both within driving distance for me).
But, I know there are some saddle gurus who lurk here so I figured I may as well post this to get feedback, or suggestions from anyone who’s had a similarly built horse/who might be a good person to go to with this.
Some background: Enzo is an almost 10 year old OTTB. I bought him last May and at the time already owned a Devoucoux Chiberta. Long story short, even after having it custom reflocked with wool, it caused him back pain so I sold it back in November.
Thus began my saddle search nightmare. I’ve tried many, many saddles on him, and any that fit his wither would be way too tight on his shoulder. He doesn’t have a shark fin wither, but it’s still substantial, I finally found one that sat nicely and was a little tight but better on his shoulder than anything I’d tried, an Antares Evolution. The girl who owned it wasn’t selling it and just lent it for me to try on him, but the barn I moved to ended up having one that I borrowed for a few weeks.
Enzo went down to Aiken for training February and March, during which I looked for my own Evolution. While in Aiken he was ridden in my trainer’s serge-backed Black Country monoflap, which was custom-made for one of her horses that had a similar shape to Enzo. I went down for a week in late March and got to ride in the BC, which I really didn’t like, so didn’t consider it as a model I should look for to buy.
Before Enzo came home I finally tracked down an Evolution with the same panel specifications as the one I had been riding him in (M15 T1), and had it shipped to the US from Sweden.
To my dismay when trying it on, it was very snug on his shoulder when I felt for his shoulder point under the flap. It sits alright, but there’s a little space under the back panels that causes some rocking. I tried a sheepskin Mattes as well as a LamiCell and Supracor with it, but any additional padding makes it extremely tight on either side of his withers and on his shoulder.
ETA: I heard back from my region’s Antares rep and although the panels are the same modifications, the tree on the one I had been borrowing is a degree deeper than the one I bought. I had no idea Antares had further customized trees other than the standard M/MW/W, so that’s on me for not comparing the two stamps with a rep. Lesson learned the hard way.
Here are some photos I took tonight of Enzo:
http://s1123.photobucket.com/user/BeFashionMag/library/Enzo%20conformation
Apologies for the poor lighting, and as a note he lost a ton of weight being shipped- we’re working on adjusting his diet and supplements to bulk him back up ETA and just discovered he has hind gut ulcers, which I’m sure weren’t helping him keep weight on 
I’ve resigned myself to the fact that the saddle I have will never fit him, so I’m looking for other options. I can’t do much until I sell it or am able to trade it in, but I need something before our first event on May 7.
Are English-based brands like County and Black Country the only brands that make saddles to fit this type of build/add wither gusset modifications to paneling, or are there any others? I’m ok with using a shim pad to fill in the hollows if there’s a saddle out there that fits his back + shoulder shape.
Any and all help/suggestions are greatly appreciated! Thank you!! :)[/QUOTE]
Check out Stubben. I just got their mono-flap saddle,custom made for my two older horses that make your horse look like a treat to fit. They seem to provide plenty of shoulder clearance while being more narrow in the withers. They have some models with curvy trees,some with flatter. Mine needed very narrow and curvy.
I’m not sure which of their dressage saddles are best for that but I got the Zaria Optima eventing saddle and it is truly a work of art.
@ Doctracy, I’m not sure if Stubben will be a feasible option because I’ve spoken to their reps and they wouldn’t be able to give me enough for my Antares as a trade-in for me to be able to afford getting him custom fitted, and with how many tree and custom specifications they have, I think trying to fit a used or demo one may be a gamble. Once Enzo feels better I may see if someone has one I can borrow just try on or for me to sit in though!
I’m curious, which model of Black Country did you try, what didn’t you like about it, and what modifications did your trainer get on the saddle that helped it fit your horse? With that information I may be able to recommend a different model of Black Country, or an appropriate model from Frank Baines or Harry Dabbs. It does sound to me like you are likely to need the adjustability and depth of wool panels.
From photos, it seems like your horse is similar in shape to mine, who is very happily going in a county stabilizer xtr medium tree, with wither gussets, but not quite full skid row panels.
I’m not jumping big sticks or big XC fences though, so the minimalist aspects of this saddle don’t bother me. Just another vote for an English made saddle, as the trees seem well suited to that back shape.
Another high withered, wide shouldered thoroughbred who loves his Albion SLK.
She tried a Vinici with the standard dressage tree and two quantum saddles that worked and a Baines Pirouette. Her horse is very underweight and would do best with panel support and wither or full front gussets. A flatter panel is better for this horse, longitudinally.
As Lauren mentioned above, it was not a good time for trying the saddles as her horse was very reactive due to a broken tooth and ulcers, as she just had diagnosed a couple of days after trying the saddles. Her horse would need to recover from this before being able to really assess saddles effectively in my opinion.
Haven’t logged in in awhile- wanted to thank everyone for their responses and input!
I had Enzo looked at a second time by my vet and on top of the hind gut ulcers (which are being treated, 2 more weeks left of those meds and teeth were fixed), he was super back sore and foot sore. We believe the foot soreness caused the back soreness, as he was done by a different farrier in Aiken and he can be challenging to trim and shoe properly (slight club RF).
So it’s lunging with a Pessoa system and being spoiled with Back on Track products until he’s feeling better. Leaning towards pursuing Black Country once I can start saddle shopping again, but it will be dependent on if I can sell my Antares or they can do a trade in.
Also, want to recommend Jay at Trumbull Mtn for anyone else needing saddle help… She really knows her stuff and was definitely worth the 3 hour drive for me to meet with!
