Are not FEI rules stricter?
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Yes, but they are still not the same. For instance there are two forms of a platinum performance skin supp. Per an FEI discussion we had with our FEI vets we learned one is FEI legal (and labeled as such). The other is usef legal. Each one has a prohibited substance under the otherās rules. Fun times. What is and isnāt prohibited is developed by each organization, itās not just āeverything is prohibitedā under FEI.
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I know better than to disagree with you 
From my medical training (which, was a long time agoā¦) we were told selenium was considered a trace element electrolyte.
Trace mineral, yes.
But trace minerals are not necessarily or even usually electrolytes.
The major electrolytes are sodium, potassium, chloride, magnesium, calcium, and phosphate.
Dissolved in water (plasma), they ionize and carry an electrical charge, hence the name.
Cell membranes regulate their passage in and out of the cell, and that pretty much makes life possible.
Trace minerals are needed in much smaller amountsāthings like selenium, iron, copper, cobaltiodine, etc. They are frequently needed to form enzymes/componds that perform necessary steps in metabolism.
Seleniumās major function is as part of the proteins that prevent free radical accumulation.
Also plays a role in the thyroid and in DNA synthesis.
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This x1000
The rest of us vacillating back and forth about a tube of PP and they are INJECTING all of this.
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Thank you for sharing that, very helpful
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USEF: āRules for thee but not for meā
The adult ammy canāt have her gelding on depo but the international jumper that is under the care, custody, and control of USEF for FEI competition is given some off label concoction at the direction of the USEF vet.
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I am still DUMBFOUNDED by the people here arguing that a horse jumping 1.60 shouldnāt be getting legend or adequan. That is honestly the BARE MINIMUM of what horses jumping at that level should be receiving.
I can understand people not understanding why traumeel or arnica is used as it is not common to give unless in FEI.
Selevit, I can agree with not being a good choice.
I would love to know at what level people are competing at whose horses donāt get any medications or anything at shows. And how sound their horses are.
At the very minimum, Legend and Adequan are doing preventative work for joints that are being stressed. Not because the horse is lame or unqualified to jump that big, but because it is HARD WORK.
Some people seem to be looking at this like the horse was asked to go for a āfun 1 mile raceā when in reality it was asked to do more like an Iron Man triathlon. There is a huge difference in what these horses are being asked to do compared to the average horse jumping 2ā6-3ā6 at an A show. They have to be maintained differently because of it.
Medication is not a bad thing.
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I donāt see anyone on this thread saying these upper level horses shouldnāt be gettin legend or adequan. Please feel free to correct me if there is a post that explicitly states that.
What people ARE pointing out is the hypocrisy that USEF can administer pretty much whatever sketchy concoction they want without prior auth from the owner for the national team (in this case, Selevit is the real sketchy thing here). And yet they come after USEF members for less mundane items (Depo, PP, other NSAIDs to help creaky horses).
I am all in favor of adequan and legend. I am all in favor of better living through reactive and proactive chemistry to help horses have healthy, pain-free careers so that they have a purpose in a life and stay in good homes (vs being unsafe and/or unusable and ending up in bad situations).
I am not a huge fan of tossing the kitchen sink at horses when it comes to medications. I am not a huge fan of administering medication that masks issues that could pose harm to human or horse later on.
Especially if one of those drugs (like Selevit) has highly questionable data out there that shows significant risk of death.
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This is what i was referring to along with several others who have said the same @Ponyplusaninch
I agree USEF banning depo etc is not helping the sport. There are several comments on this very long thread stating horses shouldnt need any kind of help, no bute/banamine etc. They were also stating that they shouldnāt need legend/adequan and that it was potentially āmasking soundness issuesā; there was a whole debate on off label use of adequan and legend above as well.
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Maybe weāve been reading a different thread, but what I recall, is that most people have a problem with the cocktail that was given to this poor horse, especially the massive dose of selenium, which if memory serves, would only have been appropriate if he was a 2K lb horse with a huge deficiency. People just questioned the Legend and Adequan being given at the same time as all the other things.
Even then the āteam vetā should have done better and run it past the horseās owner who the groom reach quickly, but not quickly enough to stop it due the USEFs release form. Lucky her, she got there on time to watch the horse she bred and raised DIE. And why wasnāt the team vet keeping an eye on things in case there was an adverse reaction to said cocktail?
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I think thereās a difference between drugs being used off label for physical maintenance (ie more regular Adequan/legend than the label calls for), and drugs being used to alter a horseās behavior. IMO, there is never any place for any substance that alters a horseās behavior, but there can be a lot of places for things that keep our horses comfortable and things that actively prevent wear and tear.
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Iām dumbfounded thatās how you read the comments here.
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Then respond to them.
.
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You seem to imply that we peons donāt understand Traumeel and that only FEI people do. Itās homeopathic ffs, itās not real medicine. And you can buy it on Amazon. I would assume the injectable arnica is also homeopathic. Homeopathy is a) magical thinking and b) far less regulated in itās production than actual real medication.
If the horse needed an anti inflammatory there are plenty of safe, tested options to choose from.
Homeopathy has no place in a modern, science based regimen but at least topical is usually harmless. Injectable homeopathic medications are risky. Period. If I saw a doctor who suggested I use it on myself Iād walk out of their office and never return.
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It is, IMHO, unethical to use behavior modifying pharmaceuticals to produce the desired demeanor in the showring.
Whether that is local horsemenās association or FEI.
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Traumeel is herbal, despite being labeled as homeopathy. But it does contain real actual ingredients, rather than the āvibrationā or whatever of non existent ingredients that homeopathic stuff does.
I really donāt get why itās labeled as homeopathy. Maybe the labeling rules are different in Germany, where itās madeā¦? 
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Homeopathy and herbal are not mutually exclusive, despite what many on this thread believe. Herbal just means it contains herbs. Homeopathy is a crazy irrational medical theory invented 200 years ago that has no basis in reality but that may also contain herbs.
All homeopathic products list ārealā ingredients, at incredibly diluted concentrations. They are 99.99999999% carrier product, some are 100% carrier product. Testing has shown over and over that many homeopathic products contain zero molecules of whatever active ingredient they advertise.
Thatās not a bug, itās a feature of homeopathy. Itās part of the magic. One of the two main tenets is that " the lower the dose of the medication, the greater its effectiveness." The other is that ālike treats likeā . Homeopathy is underpinned by the theory that giving very small, often undetectable doses of a product that produces a reaction similar to the disease will somehow cure it. Many āingredientsā are poison, like belladonna.
Any beneficial results are likely from the carrier or additional ingredients like magnesium or from much higher concentrations of ingredients than advertised, like arnica which IS an effective anti-inflammatory at higher doses. They are certainly not because someone waved the bottle at some belladonna in the production facility.
You may as well be treating your horses to balance their humors or reset their chakras. Itās all magical thinking.
Also these products are not produced to the same standards as medications.
At best you waste money and at worst you get a contaminated product or an allergic reaction.
I will and have immediately fired vets or doctors who suggest this kind of non science based āmedicineā.
Germany is notorious for the widespread belief in āalternativeā medicine, it is embedded in their culture. That does not mean it is real or works or that itās some European secret sauce that gives them an advantage. It is pure superstition.
Here is a link for more information: https://www.nccih.nih.gov/health/homeopathy
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Iām not disagreeing with you there, but if you remember USEF banned depo not because of its effects on demeanor but because of its risks. Excerpt from the press release from USEF at the time:
On October 22, 2019, following reports of equine fatalities and anaphylaxis related to the use of MPA, USEFās MPA Panel met to further analyze the use of MPA in horses competing at USEF-licensed competitions. The Panel reviewed a recent petition by numerous veterinarians requesting that USEF ban the use of MPA which was supported by documentation citing 23 fatalities associated with MPA use over the last three years, research on the efficacy of the substance, and the results from the collection of MPA medication reports."
Which makes this case of apparent anaphylaxis related to the injection of Selevit even more egregious.
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Yes thatās true, but thereās still no reason to ever use it to alter behavior. Comparing it to bute/banamine (edit to correct the meds mentioned in the previous comment Iām referencing) and saying they both should be banned is apples to oranges.
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