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Sensitizing Horse to the Whip

Dressage
#1

Yes, that’s right, sensitizing him to it, not desensitizing. I am in the process of fixing all of the holes I inadvertently put into my gelding’s training. He is a quiet, solid, amiable guy, and I’m grateful for that. But he is and has always been dead sided. I can get him to w/t/c and even leg-yield a little, but it takes a lot more work on my end than it should, and because I’ve ridden him his entire life (he’s 12, and I’m the only person who has ever ridden him) I am entirely to blame for this. I ride with spurs most of the time, as this makes it easier for both of us, because I have to nag him less…though I still have to nag and he’s still really dull to leg aids.

I’ve tried the whip in the past, but he’s just as unconcerned about it as my leg and the spur, unless I haul off and truly “whip” the snot out of him. Then he’s all “What’s your problem, woman??” for about two and a half steps and goes back to his lazy ways.

Do I need to just keep at it. I feel like I probably need to be more consistent and work on my timing. I think in the past I’ve just continued dogging him with my leg and spur and then gotten tired of that and whacked him with the whip as a sort of “Wake UP!” thing, in an ill-timed, emotional fashion that means nothing to him except, “Gee, what’s her problem?”

Should I work with him on the ground for a bit with it? He’s equally lazy when being led. I have to drag him everywhere (except out to hand graze, then he’s quite cooperative…huh.)

I think I’m answering my own questions, but I’d love some feedback or suggestions! I feel bad that I’ve created this issue that I’ve allowed for all this time…and now I’m going to punish him for it? Seems unfair. We have such a great rapport and he’s such a good boy in every other respect.

Thanks for any tips!

#2

What is his energy level like usually? What is his work schedule?

If you have a horse that bucks and bolts in play in the pasture but sucks back under saddle, then you have a training issue that probably goes back to rider error, tack problems, and pain.

How is he for other riders, like your coach?

If you have a horse that is mehhh at all times, if he won’t give a sparkling trot or canter playing loose, then you need to consider his overall diet and health.

I have been problem solving on my mare ever since I crested some ring sour and canter problems in my first year on her when she was green.

She also would have long stretches of being low energy generally.

I finally figured out that she needs a day off after about every five rides. She was just getting tired. I also started trying to capture her “up” days for riding rather than let her run it off in turnout or longe as I did at the start. Also I eventually became a smoother rider and wasn’t pissing her off all the time. I worked on all possible areas of discomfort, including saddle fit, hoof boots, and body work. Diet did not seem like a huge part of it though I feel she usually did better on at least a pound of whole oats in her mash. And I switched to riding in a hackamore which has made her more forward.

Our problems were more complex than yours because maresy was giving me a strong no and balking, as well as having low energy days. Whips and spurs were pointless.

At the moment we are mostly riding trails and enjoying big canters and hand gallops in open spaces, and she usually has a big ground covering walk. She still needs her rest days.

I would say specifically for a dressage horse, they are often ridden with strong contact that can impede forward impulsion. Without knowing why your fellow is sluggish, I would say it is always worth backing off the schooling for a while and riding him on a loose rein on trails to get some natural impulsion happening.

So anyhow in my experience these global attitude problems are not about just sensitizing to the whip. The whip doesn’t solve long term body pain, or diet and health issues, or mental boredom, or a rider that is effectively asking the horse to suck back.

2 Likes
#3

https://practicalhorsemanmag.com/training/laura-graves-selfgoing-horse-53583

Since I’m holding off riding for the time being, I’ve also been working on this general principle with groundwork and lunging. Just firming up expectations, particularly in regards to “forward” aids. Like your boy, mine has a brick-like response to all but the most vigorous whip applications, and then he’s all “Ok, FINE.” Like your boy, I KNOW mine “knows” what I’m asking. He understands the general meaning of the aids, he just chooses to be slouchy about it if he’s been out of work for a while or I slack off in expectations.

The way it looks on the ground lunging, I hold my whip pointed back behind me (yes, I know this is against the principle of “framing” the horse between the line and the whip, I’m not trying to frame him at the moment, I’m just trying to get his pudgy butt to move promptly when I ask, first time, every time). I set him off at a walk, then brightly say “trot!” If he doesn’t immediately strike off in a trot, I swing the whip around, if he’s not trotting by the time the whip reaches his butt, I “whistle” it vigorously, slap the ground with it, eventually smack him with it (I’m not competent enough with whip use to really give a stinging lash), move myself in his direction making angry growling sounds. All in really short order. I want him to really get the “WRONG ANSWER” message, not learn the typical school age child lesson of “OK, I don’t really need to stop playing and come downstairs until Mom uses all three of my names.” Instant cessation of the negative as soon as the new gait is picked up, even if it’s slouchy and lazy (for now). Didn’t take long before he would trot off as soon as the whip started swinging, and eventually with the voice cue alone. Spontaneous downward transitions are also IMMEDIATELY addressed with vigorous “WRONG ANSWER”. No repetition of the “trot”, no clucking. I’m trying to establish that he darn well better move forward at the gait and speed I tell him to, and stay there without additional input, pending further instruction. It’s been going fabulously, I’m really pleased. I used to have to “nag” him constantly with the whip to keep him in canter on the lunge, and now he’ll lollop along like a vaulting horse with me just standing there. Now we’re working on increasing energy within gaits, and that’s been a little trickier. I’ll cluck and if he doesn’t speed up promptly I’ll swing the whip in, less energetically than “WRONG ANSWER” and just kinda gently waggle it at him. Of course, with the earlier sensitization he tends to strike off in trot and I’ll let him go a stride or two and gently say “walk,” trying to get the message across of “forward good, yes, but not quite what I want right now.” If he does speed up within the gait I’ll give him a hearty “good BOY”, let him continue a few more strides (so he doesn’t associate “good boy” with stopping), ask for a halt and go give him a pet (or a food reward if he had a really nice prompt halt). Also working on concepts like “the default gaits are a nice marching walk, an energetic bouncy trot, and a true three beat canter”, as part of the speeding up within gaits work.

Hopefully at least some of this will carry over into riding and we won’t have to go through our usual, “No, kiddo, you’re NOT RETIRED” exercises whenever he comes back after not being ridden for a bit.

3 Likes
#4

Just reading this now after getting back from the barn. You must’ve been sending me these wavelengths because this is exactly what I did today! I didn’t go out on the trails, we rode in the arena, but I can tell you that I honestly feel like it was the best ride this horse has ever had in his life. To make a long story short, I’ve been riding him all wrong…totally “front to back” instead of the correct “back to front”, and he’s gotten tired of it. Another thing I didn’t mention in my original post is that he has a slight roar when he’s working. Never had him scoped and it doesn’t really bother him too much, but it is definitely exacerbated by me basically cramming him into a frame and booting him along with my spurs every stride.

I think back and could kick MYSELF (I’d deserve it) for what I’ve done to this poor animal, and I guess the one saving grace is that he’s only 12, and for the 10 years of his life that he has been under saddle (yes, I broke him at 2yo…ugh), he’s had at least 3 of those years off (the last three years before I moved him last October to our new barn), and was ridden very sporadically in the years before that. He gotten ridden fairly regularly as a 3, 4, and 5 year old and shown lightly then (just open shows and schooling dressage shows). Then I piddled with him now and then and didn’t do much.

Until now! So today I decided to ride him like he was a real green bean who just needs to practice “GO” (because “whoa” is confirmed! We got that!) I gave him his head, never once tried to “take hold of his mouth” which I’d been so bad about trying to force him into a “headset” basically.

Oh my gosh. I was liberal with the whip use, but he didn’t seem to mind and totally “got it”. I didn’t wear spurs at all, and it was, without a doubt, the EASIEST ride I’ve ever had on him. Like…he cantered around and around the arena ON HIS OWN! I just sat there! That doesn’t happen!!!

We have a mirror at one end of the arena, and I was so impressed every time I looked. He was swinging along, relaxed, ears up, happy as a clam, reins all looped and flopping. And guess what? By the end of it, he was stretching out to find the contact HIMSELF! And he had foamy lipstick on his mouth! Hooray!

I’m so thrilled. It’s supposed to rain most of the day tomorrow, so he gets a day off, but hopefully I can ride Tuesday.

Thank you so much for your reply and great advice!

11 Likes
#5

Yes! I read this last night, and it’s what got my wheels turning about giving the whip another try! I’m so glad I did!

Thank you for sharing your groundwork experience too! Lunging, like everything else with my guy, always turned out to be more work for me than him! Me chasing, cracking the whip, clucking, kissing, growling…whew! And him: “Huh?” LOL.

I’m not the biggest fan of lunging (I’d rather just ride), but I may revisit it now. I did do some in-hand stuff just coming in from the pasture today though. Got him marching along beside me quite nicely. I realized when I was leading him out of the barn tacked up to go ride that he was walking much more obediently and then realized I had the whip with me. Aha!

I think the bottom line is his person needed to take responsibility and actually follow through with the use of the whip. He’s a smart (and wonderfully forgiving) horse. I just wasn’t holding up my end of the bargain.

Thank you for your reply!

1 Like
#6

What a great update.

He can feel a fly on his side. He does not need a stronger aid than that.

So what is your aid for halt to walk?

What is your aid from halt to trot?

What is your aid from walk to halt?

What is your aid for trot to canter?

How do you collect?

How do you lengthen?

You want the littlest aid possible.

But don’t forget that he has been training you for 10 years, that you do the hard work and he doesn’t. My instructor says novice riders work too hard.

Me? Knees off and tummy forward for halt to walk. This is invisible, someone watching should not see any change. It is a slight change of pressure. Not shoving a kitchen chair across the floor. If I did the same thing on a kitchen chair it would not move.

Knees off and tummy up and forward for halt to trot.

Knees on and drop weight for downward transitions. Be careful as it is very powerful, you don’t want to ground them, you want forward downward transitions.

For canter I lift the inside seatbone. Sure the rest of my body is asking for forward and bend and flexion.etc.

For collected trot you lift with your tummy. Keep the bounce.

Collected canter I also lift. I sit down and forward for forward.

I do not wear spurs.

2 Likes
#7

Hi Toblersmom,

I really enjoy lunging and do most of what you said. He must go the moment I say, not next stride, not in the next 2 strides,not after half a circle and not tomorrow!

Mine are taught to go forward with leading from a single click. Once in side reins I do not walk them, they must trot immediately. I am near them from changing direction and if they do not trot the moment I say, a little tap on the rump with the handle of the lunge whip means now, not next week.

With the trot and canter when they are in it it is not used. If they break I do what you do behind them until they are back in that gait again and the whip is not used again. That way they learn to go without the whip.

Next they are taught slow and quick. The rein and the whip are lifted for quick as I want the poll the highest and them going forward from behind. I lower the whip and the rein for slow. These are not abrupt movements as my hubby seems to do. I am not shouting they are simply aides.

Lunging can be as fascinating as riding.

1 Like
#8

Wow, Suzie, that sounds great! We’re a long way from me being able to get those kind of responses from such subtle aids, but maybe we’ll get there.

I’m not going to lie, I had to rely on the whip a lot today and used it strongly a few times. But he was definitely starting to make the connection. I’m just grateful he’s such a good sport about it all.

Hopefully someday I’ll be able to use subtle aids like you do. I know exactly how it feels and what it’s like to have a horse like that. My first horse (my dressage/eventing partner from 30 years ago) was much more sensitive and forward thinking. He was a nutty green-broke 4yo trail horse when I got him, and I was in the saddle for every bit of his training under the guidance of some great coaches. I could literally think “canter” (or whatever) and he’d do it. He wasn’t a big flashy horse at ALL but we had some great dressage scores (only through 1st level, but hey!) because we had such a good partnership.

So, I’m glad I’ve had that experience, because I know first hand just how “invisible” the aids can be on a horse that is truly tuned in and willing. My current fella is a lower energy horse than that horse from long ago, but he’s a good boy, so I’m sure if I’m patient and consistent, he’ll get there.

#9

Look up Dr. Andrew McLean or Equitation Science on YouTube. He also has books.

I restarted an OTTB last year using entirely his methods. The whip can be a very important tool for providing cues. I would start on ground, facing horse and tap tap tap behind shoulder where your leg would be until horse walks. Halt praise and repeat. Do this until he will walk forward from either side from just 2 taps. You never increase intensity of hitting. You just keep tapping until they respond. You cannot stop tapping until they respond and the second they move, stop tapping. Even if it’s only one step or half a step. I was shocked at how long it took my horse (who certainly would’ve known what a whip meant) to sensitize to this. Once he’s got that, work on using same idea to move hind end. Tap tap tap on hindquarters or hocks until horse crosses the leg you are tapping underneath his body and steps over. Halt praise repeat. Do this until he moves from either side from just 2 taps.

Once you’ve established that 2 taps means forward, start under saddle. From halt using no leg, tap tap tap right behind your leg until horse walks. Halt praise repeat. Keep working until horse goes from 2 Taps on either side. Once he can do that consistently, go from walk to trot just using whip taps. Then you can work on going from halt to trot using just whip taps.

Horses really don’t understand a ‘tune up’ hard whack behind the leg. This method will truly sensitize a horse to whip with no stress or discomfort.

1 Like
#10

Thanks for the tips, DunByMistake!

#11

I sometimes let myself get lazy with my riding, and after a few rides can tell my horse is getting into the habit too. So then I set the intention that I will have my horse moving sharply; ask quietly with my leg and if he doesn’t respond then will reinforce with a tap-tap of the whip behind my leg. And usually just having that intention is enough I end up not even having to use the whip! Not sure if that helps, but just wanted to mention it.
I recently took a few lessons with an instructor who is big on using “chi” (energy). Same concept, kind of using your breathing and raising or lowering your own energy level for up and down transitions.

#12

I haven’t read the linked article, but I always start whip action from the ground. I teach that the whip signals “move your leg”. I also walk the horse on the ground and teach that the whip “whipping in the air” (as little as possible) means “step forward and walk actively next to me”. I do this at the trot, too, and use the whip “in the air” or tapping the hind leg if the horse is really lazy to move when I move. Tapping. Try to teach your horse that the whip is just an aid. You could also try “whipping the air” and making noise at the butt of your horse to catch your horse’s attention. But if you don’t follow this up with letting your horse go whatever kind of forward your horse does (even if it’s a bit of a bolt) or let your horse ignore you, none of this will work.

I suggest work on the ground and teach your horse that whip means pick up or move the hind leg. Teach him what the whip aid means in terms of his body. If you have to whip the snot out of him, your whip aid is useless. Teach him what it means and reinforce it.

#13

The whip can be incredibly useful. I also get more in depth with lunging and can lunge my horse on a 20 meter circle in an open arena with just voice and body language. I carry a whip, but do not need it so much. Drives me a bit batty when someone is lunging a horse and constantly active with and cracking the whip.

So, start on the ground. I’ve used my long dressage whip and a tap on the leg means pick it up. I can now stand and point to the leg and the horse picks it up. I just move myself accordingly and the horse follows suit with his body. I basically used clicker training. You can start small here. If you use the whip and the horse shifts weight odd of the limb, reward. Next hold out for a small raise of the limb. Then for them to hold the limb higher or for longer/until you say to put it down. It’s about building up to things, keeping the horse looking to do what you’re asking, raising your expectations (reasonably) and them meeting your expectations. This can help build sensitivity and emphasize responding to pressure.

The problem is that sometimes people ask the horse and keep asking (which is fine, ask/tell until you receive) after the horse has given them what they’re asking for. This can create a dull horse. The moment the horse gives you what you’re asking for, stop asking. Maybe it’s a bolt forward, but it’s forward.

I’ve seen people have to apply pressure with spurs every step of the walk (just meandering around on a loose rein) and I wonder why. My leg is there but I don’t need to be nagging every step. Maybe I’m just lazy, but I hate horses that feel like I’m riding a bike up a hill to no where.

As you said, OP, taking responsibility and following through is a huge component. I was just telling a friend the other day it’s much easier to communicate with horses if you say what you mean and mean what you say. If you don’t follow through once, trust me, they’ll remember :lol: especially those that have tendencies to be lazy. Horses are opportunists. Best of luck in your training. I’m excited for you as I think you’ll experience some nice break-thru moments.

2 Likes
#14

My boy, Stars, is exactly like yours. To teach him to stand for a halt was the easiest thing in the world. To be praised for doing nothing was Heaven to him!

Sim was also similar, but he is more forward thinking in that halt was harder to teach because he didn’t want to stand. It really made me think the day my instructor said that Sim now had the confidence to go forward. I had never thought about it like that before.

I had to go back to my trainer with Stars as I have always ridden fairly hot horses who want to go forward. The transitions within the gait have been key. You want them so as when you say quick they pull forward for 4 strides and are wanting to do so and waiting for the command.

Although from your post your horse does sound more forward than my boy. It is just that you were as you said riding back to front.

You can start now, I would if he came here. It is harder to retrain than to train but horses learn a LOT quicker than riders.

1 Like
#15

Don’t discount boredom. Cantering round and round the walls of an arena isn’t very interesting. Pole work is really very beneficial for both rider and horse and infinitely variable.

Just as a comment, Laura Thomlinson (GB gold medal at WEG and Olympics) in a Horse & Hound interview recently said she starts all her warmup work in a canter because horses in the wild rarely trot. An interesting thought.

2 Likes
#16

I did use “sword whip” with one of my horses years ago to liven him up. He wasn’t dead to the leg or seat just a bit laid back and my trainer used the ground whip to quicken the hind leg .

1 Like
#17

This reminded me of something. I follow an equine pole work group and have seen so many fab ideas for poles and pole work patterns, worth a shot to liven things up.

A friend has a mare that rides much better, more forward and engaged if she randomly throws a jump (just a small one will do) in here and there. She’ll work on something for a bit, pop over the jump, work some more on the flat, pop over the jump, seems to keep her mare more keen to work.

Some horses do work better with canter work first/early on in the ride. So that is worth noting too.

2 Likes
#18

Some great stuff in this thread! Thanks guys.

I find myself envying the people whose horses will respond to a change in their “energy” or the lightest whisper of a whip.

But then, I’m also glad that I have a horse who I can pretty much count on not to do anything silly with me on his back. Even on his worst days…he might be a little spooky/tense and “on his toes”, but those days are few and far between and usually have some very obvious reason (like a change in feed). 99.999% of the time he’s the most chill, laid back, reliable dude. He would never intentionally hurt anyone, and maintains a happy attitude all the time.

Yesterday after our ride, he took a nap in the cross-ties while I clipped his legs, muzzle, bridle path, and even ears. That’s when his lack of sensitivity is an asset!

I’m going to read back through this thread more carefully and any new posts that come in, and take all of this great advice to heart. I’m hoping to go ride tomorrow once these thunderstorms move on out of here today, and I’m excited to put some of this newfound knowledge to work!

#19

Some of the dead-to-whip horses respond really well to whip noises, not whip touches. Hold your whip as per normal, but instead of flicking your wrist in towards the hindquarters, flick out/up. May have to flick back towards the haunches to get real whip noise but stop before the whip touches the horse.

Takes a bit of practice, I’ll grant. But when you do it, be prepared for a bit of a scoot reaction. Make sure that you don’t get left in the backseat or hit his mouth at all or you’ll be undoing the go-forward motivational work you’ve just tried to install.

And finally-- once you get a reaction (and any appropriately forward reaction is good enough to start), stop with the whippy noises and proceed as per normal until you need the whippy noises again.

1 Like
#20

As long as trainers are aware that if they ask for too much, too soon the horse can’t give them what they’re asking for, and all the “asking” in the world isn’t going to get it.

Continuing to ask and ask and ask when a horse can’t find the answer creates a dull horse in about the same way that continuing to ask after the horse complies does.

Too much too soon can take the form of the horse not understanding the request, or can be more about lack of physical preparation and/or fear, but either way the horse can only give us what we want if he understands and is physically and mentally able to do it.

I think there’s a strong tendency among trainers to think that a horse knows what they’re asking because the trainer knows what they’re asking. Those trainers need to try some clicker training at liberty with a horse who really wants to know the answer because he really wants the treats, and it’ll soon become apparent that 1) horses don’t always know the answer even when trainers think they’ve been clear, and 2) trainers are not always very good at explaining what they want.

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