seven games/training scale

[egontoast]

Mr Zettl said this within his lengthy ad I mean post on the UDDB. You can go read the whole thing there if you wish. I don’t post there so can’t reply there.

I’m scratching my head over this statement:

The “Seven Games” are really not very different from our six steps in the Training Scale, we are just trying to be more aesthetic.

Hmm. The seven games are just a bunch of groundwork exercises, aren’t they?

Are dressage trainers ‘just trying to be more aesthetic’ with their fancy schmancy training scale which is really no different than someone’s PATented groundwork exercises?

Is this THE TRUTH or is it all about kool aid or hogwash or just plain ole greenbacks?

[Eclectic_Horseman]

ka-ching

[PiaffeDreams]

The 7 games are a “form” of groundwork and groundwork is definitely part of how one achieves the aims of the training scale. However, to imply that the only difference is a matter of aesthetics is absolutely ridiculous! Such a statement really is just about putting a ‘spin’ on classical principles in order to argue one’s claim. It is so far from the truth that tuning into the training scale is aesthetic only. So, is he saying that when we put preserving the natural gaits of the horse first we are simply doing it for good looks? How about because that is what is NATURAL for the horse? or because a horse out of balance and moving with impurities is tense, blocked and therefore not only physically uncomfortable, but mentally stressed? Balance, correct biomechanics and a horse moving with pure and natural paces feels good in mind and body. I guess that might mean classical dressage owns the claim to being a natural form of horsemanship.

It might be nice I guess if the 7 games held some magical key to attaining those things. But, its just lunging and leading correctly. If one takes the time in those things to address, tension, submission, rhythm and balance, it does help the ridden goals. But, you don’t need anything special. Just take your time, pay attention to your horse and be his mentor.

[InsideLeg2OutsideRei]

oyy, I want to see someone attempting to ride a horse in good collection at all gaits after having trained it to do the 7 games only. Maybe Walter is just getting a bit too old for long blogs. :no:

[monstrpony]

I would chose to be kind to Mr. Zettl and say that he meant that the seven games are a scale in the same sense that the training scale is. I don’t think he meant that they accomplish the same thing. The aesthetic comment meant that the training scale accomplishes more, takes the horse further toward being aesthetically pleasing.

I wouldn’t interpret it as him saying they were in equivalent in what they accomplish, just in form–they both are scale.

The 12" ruler in your desk is a scale; the mile markers along the interstate are also a scale; no one would equate them in terms of their ability/usefulness to measure the distance from Seattle to Jacksonville ;).

[siegi_b]

Mr. Zettl has sold out - it’s as simple as that. He saw the Horse Whisperer and then met the Parellis and figured he wanted some of that easy money, too. For Walter to be posting on horse BB’s just adds to the circus quality of his actions.

[egontoast]

monstrpony, I think that’s a very…um… creative and generous interpretation of the rather odd comment " really not very different from our six steps in the Training Scale, we are just trying to be more aesthetic. " which suggests there is little of substance in there to distinguish it and feeds into a certain misguided view of dressage demonstrated by the Parellis.

What does “trying to be more asthetic” mean? Trying to be more asthetic than the Parellis? I knew the egos were huge, but even so…

I don’t care what L and P think but I wouldn’t expect WAZ to buy into their oddball views of dressage.

PS I love WAZ ’ first book but won’t be shelling out any cash for Parelli/Waz products.

[fiona]

er, what are the 7 games?

[egontoast]

FIona, they are exactly like the training pyramid. The training pyramid was copied from the Parelli games by a bunch of snobs trying to be more asthetic. Schwung, for example, means porcupine in swahili.

[Eclectic_Horseman]

@egontoast;2984913

FIona, they are exactly like the training pyramid. The training pyramid was copied from the Parelli games by a bunch of snobs trying to be more asthetic. Schwung, for example, means porcupine in swahili.

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Cracked me up. :lol:

[monstrpony]

Well, I confess it really threw me when I first read it; I just assumed he couldn’t find the word he really wanted and threw “aesthetic” out there as some approximation. But when my mind had to try to make some sense out of the comments, the idea of “scale” was what it came up with.

There’s no other way I can create that extensive a connection between the seven games with the dressage training scale.

And I even dabble in so-called natural horsemanship (BUT NOT PARELLI).

Color me puzzled

[JB]

It’s not really that difficult once you really understand the 7 games. And no, they are not SOLELY groundwork - they can all be done ridden as well. Dressage-proper has one dictionary, Parelli has another. Neither is rightor wrong because they aren’t the same, on the surface, as the other, they just are, and if you understand the very basic principles of both, they are not at all dissimilar.

[Foxtrot_s]

Egg - I speak Swahili and I can categorically tell you that you are wrong, but funny

[STF]

@siegi b.;2984888

Mr. Zettl has sold out - it’s as simple as that. He saw the Horse Whisperer and then met the Parellis and figured he wanted some of that easy money, too. For Walter to be posting on horse BB’s just adds to the circus quality of his actions.

My thoughts as well.

[egontoast]

montrpony, I’m not anti so-called NH at all. I learned some things from Andrew MacLean and Chris Irwin that helped me immensely with a difficult horse but I just find the Parellis offensive.

WZ can do what he likes, obviously, and I’m sure he won’t lose any sleep if he loses respect from some people when he jumps on that particular gravy train. Funny, the O’connors are pretty silent these days on their former love in with the Parellis, aren’t they?

Savvy marketing. Flatter and seduce $$$ someone well regarded in a particular discipline, expand your fan base and watch the money flood in. Eventing, dressage, who will be next? Makes the ’ target’ look worse than them , though, for either falling for it or , worse, only caring about the money.

[egontoast]

Foxtrot, please translate the training scale into swahili for us. I think it’s worth a new thread, actually.

I have a feeling that you will not find the swahili word for ‘porcupine’ because it’s from a very obscure archaic dialect from an isolated little known community where there are only a few extremely elderly classical masters.

[DressageGeek_Ribbon]

Well,

I can’t speak German or Swahili, but I can make up NH crap too (but lack the creative marketing talent which is so critical to the success). Does this mean I’m still stuck at
First Level? Will jumping a picnic table bareback replace tempi changes?

[JB]

It’s so comforting to see that those who don’t know PNH in particular can still so easily make fun of it and anyone associated with it.

[InsideLeg2OutsideRei]

[QUOTE=DressageGeek “Ribbon Ho”;2985126]
Well,

I can’t speak German or Swahili, but I can make up NH crap too (but lack the creative marketing talent which is so critical to the success). Does this mean I’m still stuck at
First Level? Will jumping a picnic table bareback replace tempi changes?[/QUOTE]

Yes, that’s what that means. But I can teach you German for a very reasonable fee, and throw in some German breeches, too, which in turn will make you a candidate for the 2012 Olympic team.

Oh and JB, I own the 7 Games video from his Parelliness and have watched it.

[fiona]

But I can teach you German for a very reasonable fee, and throw in some German breeches, too, which in turn will make you a candidate for the 2012 Olympic team.

SOLD!!! I’ll learn swahili from a book if it helps.

Meanwhile, Olympic dreams aside, what are the 7 games? The only information i have gleaned so far is that i need a porcupine, a carrot shaped like a stick, a big bouncy ball and a large plastic sack.
The above being a serious question. Please tell me i’m all agog.