Sigh - more designer breeds

[Rackonteur]

Yes.

This morning I watched a program segment about a young woman and her two Malamutes who go skijoring together. That segment was followed by a man describing Malamutes and the care they require, and their characteristics. I thought about my sister and ex-BIL who bought a Malamute 50 years ago – they lived in the deep south and the only skiing they ever tried was water-skiing. That poor door seemed so miscast to me.
I mean, how many people can afford to get up every morning and drive into the mountains to spend the day skijoring, as this woman said she did? How many have that kind of time, or that kind of money?

[GoodTimes]

Absolutely. I’m lucky in that I live less than a kilometer from a 17km trail system, and less than a km from a large body of water that freezes in the winter. Once the snowmobiles have been out I can go for as long as the dog wants.
This is part of the reason that a high energy GSP would work as my next dog. Lots of ways in the summer and winter to tire them out.

My BIL and SIL have two husky x lab mixes. They got two so they could “entertain” each other. head desk. They live on 20 acres but the dogs get tied and if they’re lucky they get to walk a short loop around the yard. Both are overweight, one has thyroid issues that are poorly managed. They’ve run away multiple times. Both dogs talk and whine nonstop, which is typical of huskies, but is made worse by the fact that they don’t get any mental or physical stimulation.

[ThreeWishes]

What the actual fudge!? That’s the weirdest cross I’ve ever heard of. Wow. So you couple breathing issues with back issues in two completely diverse dogs? What could go wrong? /sarcasm.

[LiberalSnowflake]

Couldn’t agree more. Unfortunately the “breeders” don’t really care what could go wrong - as long as they’ve got the money, the dog is your responsibility. We have friends that relocated to Australia from the UK, took their absolute idiot of an English Bulldog with them (what could go wrong, moving from a cold country to a state where it’s 40c+ in the summers) and now have the bright idea of breeding it to make some money. It’s one of the stupidest dogs I’ve ever met, zero training (not his fault, their fault), has already had the laser operation so it can actually breathe, has NOTHING to recommend it except it’s “rare”. They are VERY upset that the ANKC won’t let them breed him (for papers) without their okay - thank heavens for the ANKC!

[AltersAreUs]

Oh, I have so many angry feelings about pomskys! Especially since dogs that look like that ALREADY exists. A klee kai, a finnish lapphund, various spitzs, buhunds - that look exists without making a franken-mutt that crosses a pulling dog with a breed genetically prone to tracheal collapse!

[ThreeWishes]

I owned an English Bulldog decades ago, sweet lovely boy but he seriously struggled in hot weather. Couple that with the skin issues from his face and tail fold/wrinkles. Never again. And he lived in the A/C, in Florida.

[S1969]

@AltersAreUs

Oh, I have so many angry feelings about pomskys! Especially since dogs that look like that ALREADY exists. A klee kai, a finnish lapphund, various spitzs, buhunds - that look exists without making a franken-mutt that crosses a pulling dog with a breed genetically prone to tracheal collapse!

But it’s more likely the person wanting the cross wants a “miniature Husky” for a cute house pet.

Except they forget about the part of the standard that says “His body proportions and form reflect this basic balance of power, speed and endurance.”

So, now they have a little dog with power, speed and endurance. Because that’s exactly what they wanted…oh wait, they wanted a pet.

If only there was a small breed with fluffy coat, erect ears and a happy disposition, but one that was more suited to be a pet…searching…searching…searching. Oh wait - here you go

[AltersAreUs]

Yes but pomskys get up to 40lbs. They aren’t toy-sized dogs. A german spitz is the same basic “shape”, comes in husky coat patterns and tops out around 25lbs

[ThreeWishes]

I’ve never been a small dog lover but somehow a Pom found me years ago. That dog was my A tiny little fluffy boy with the heart of a lion. When he got older he did get the intermittent trachea issues. I’m not sure I’d ever seek one out again but Hootie was a pretty freaking cool fellow.

[Jenerationx]

Maybe in the US where they are sometimes horribly bred crosses of Rottweiler, Neapolitan Mastiff, and god knows what else thrown in. People working with “old American lines” are now calling them “working Corsos” or “rustic Corsos” and some of them have anything but an actual Italian Corso in their lines. The European dogs have a standard, and meet it more often than not because they have been bred to type for years, not just throwing a mix in there and calling it a Corso if it vaguely looks like one.

[strangewings]

Shoot, i did get the breed wrong then. Was thinking of Dogo Argentino, not Cane Corso.

[S1969]

OK. Then Keeshond:

Another spitz type breed that has been around for a long time. Bottom line is there is at least one breed (many times several) that usually already exist and meet the criteria of the mix but is more predictable.

[RaeHughes]

From NZ - I am a fan of BCs, Labradors, Huntaways and NZ Heading Dogs.
All of the dogs that I have had in my life have been one of those.
If I am looking for another Lab or BC - I do look at the breeding and if it has “AKC” in it’s ancestry, I will admit a little bias and want to see some good strong English, Australian and Canadian, New Zealand lines as well . It is more a type for me.

Now to Doodles etc - anecdotally so not a scientific sample - I haven’t met one I actually like and I have had quite a few bites from them. I lead a CGC class at our local dog training club and usually have the larger dogs in my group. The doodles are terrors - even with exercising, mental stimulation etc all week. So much so, in one class the handlers of the two (self-proclaimed) pit bulls asked if they could be moved away from them so that they didnt give their dogs bad ideas!!!

[Jenerationx]

Wow… these are local to me. Apparently Golden Doodles and Bernedoodles.

@strangewings

Shoot, i did get the breed wrong then. Was thinking of Dogo Argentino, not Cane Corso.

Dogos were brought to the US in the 1970s and there have been very few of them, but they’re growing in popularity. I really like them for athleticism, but they are way more high energy than I’m looking for. They were started in 1928 in Argentina. The main issue I have with them aside from the energy level is that they have a very high incidence of deafness in one or both ears.

[Mara]

I am unfortunate enough to live in Georgia, where every hick fan of the national championship college team wants a Bulldog. The guy whose breeding program supplies the mascot dogs is one of the parties responsible for the mess that the breed has become. They’re not very smart, have the aforementioned breathing and skinfold problems, and they tend to not live very long. They ARE sweet, though.

My mom’s next door neighbor had one, and the dog never learned his name. Sweet, but definitely low IQ. He would occasionally get out and wind up on the wrong porch, looking to be fed and let in for the night.

[MsM]

You shouldnt be surprised that Cockers are used by Doodle breeders. Cockapoos were perhaps the original Doodle! I dont really know why - lots of hair needing clipping and ear problems from both sides! I once had a dog that was the product of a Cockapoo mom and a Cocker dad. She mostly looked like a buff Cocker but somehow had a fairly thin coat. Her littermate had curly thick hair. Both had ear problems of course. My little Muppett was a great pet. Remarkably tolerant and extremely smart and trainable. The Aussie I got after her showed me how easy she really was!

[DMK]

I’m sorry, in what universe was the cocker spaniel craze short lived? It was at the top of the list for decades!

My primary complaint with doodles, after the problem with owners*, is that after the very uncommon, carefully bred F3 or F4 labradoodles that started the craze, the vast majority are F1 crosses generally produced from breeding stock that in no way represents the best/ideal standard of the breed (generational management of form as it relates to function as well as hereditary conditions) because you damn sure know they didn’t put the work into it and any breeder who does damn sure isn’t selling their stock to a doodle breeder. So your chance of getting a litter that is all over the place, temperament wise is pretty much the definition of an F1 cross. It gets even more interesting when they cross phenotypes like the Bernie doodle. I’m sure someone must have the low energy high obedience version, but of the 6 or so I have to deal with regularly, every one is high drive/high energy with all the indifference of a Bernie when it comes to responding to owner commands (mostly on their own schedule, which works out well with Bernie personality, poodle? Notsomuch).

And to the point about creating a new breed, that’s fine, but let’s be real here. A new breed isn’t a bunch of repeated F1 crosses, which is the doodle business. A new breed is somewhere down around F7 and becomes repeatable entirely within those subsequent generations. But the unfortunate reality is there are a lot, I mean A LOT of culls on the way whenever someone starts a new breed. How you ethically handle the culls is pretty much the exact opposite of how the current doodle business is playing out these days.

• The other complaint is they do seem to disproportionately attract the worst owners for their brand of high energy, probably because the vast majority of well adjusted owners are sticking with a breed that meets their needs or getting an F1 cross that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg, you know, one from your local shelter.

[DownYonder]

Re Bulldogs - I also live in GA. I boarded for a while at a barn where the BO’s daughter and husband needed to save money, so they moved out of their house and into the 2-bedroom barn apartment. She bred Bulldogs from the same lines as the UGA Dawg. She had five adult Bulldogs (all unaltered), then decided to get another adult male who didn’t get along with her other male, plus bred a litter at the same time. All the dogs except the mama bitch and puppies were then relegated to living in crates in the (small) tack room. They were sweet dogs but it always sounded like Darth Vader x5 lived there. And the tack room always stunk. Not to mention that the poor barn cats (who usually hung out in the tack room) were in terror all the time even though the dogs were in crates. The cats took to sleeping on people’s saddles, and occasionally would miss the jump to a saddle and ended up clawing their way up. They ruined the seat on one of my saddles and I basically had to give it away. No apology from the dog owner (because it wasn’t her dogs that caused the damage, don’t you know.) And a lame apology from the barn owner, who was the one who took in the cats. I have had an intense dislike of Bulldogs and their owners ever since.

[Texarkana]

@DMK

I’m sorry, in what universe was the cocker spaniel craze short lived? It was at the top of the list for decades!

I guess I should have said the cocker spaniel revival.

It was super popular back when people had animal sense, sort of fell out a favor for a bit, then went gangbusters again in the 80s.

But I don’t know if it was the more ignorant animal owning population or what had happened to the breeding or both, but after nearing the top of the dog bite list, it fell out of favor for less, uh, snappy pets.

At least that’s how I remember it going down in my lifetime.

[DownYonder]

Labradoodles and Golden Doodles - the breeder “elevator pitch” is that 1) the Retriever temperament will mellow out the rollicking, high-energy temperament of the Poodle; 2) the Poodle genes makes them . “hypoallergenic” and “non-shedding.” 3) they won’t be as big and substantial as a Retriever, so maybe more suited to families with young children.

People fall for that swill, along with the fact that the puppies are usually pretty cute, and the dogs are usually people friendly and as someone said, “tolerant of operator error.”

I have to say though that the golden doodle belonging to a family member is a hot mess. God, that dog is so hyper I want to slip it some ace or something every time I have to be around it.