My colt is from that rather rare Byerley Turk sireline (Indian Ridge):
Does it matter at all if I have him gelded or should I be giving that decision some second thought?
what, besides that one point, makes him a stallion prospect? quite honestly, if you even have to ask, the answer is probably ‘geld him’.
Nothing has been done with him yet so I have no idea if he is good at anything.
Why did you buy him?? were you looking for your next riding horse??
Not that rare. Geld him unless he is an incredible mover with fantastic conformation and you’re independently wealthy.
Geld!
[QUOTE=Highflyer;8005082]
Not that rare. Geld him unless he is an incredible mover with fantastic conformation and you’re independently wealthy.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know how rare the Indian Ridge (Byerley Turk) sireline is in Europe, but it’s incredibly rare in North America–only 3 such stallions over here that I know of–Legal Jousting, Final Row, Ben’s Ridge.
As someone who’s trying to concentrate those BT lines in TBs, albeit in a small way, it’s getting harder and harder to find BT sireline stallions, or even stallions (like Proudinsky for example) who aren’t BT sireline but otherwise have lots of BT lines.
I consider myself lucky that I was able to get one foal (filly) by French Seventyfive (Ambiorix sireline) before he died. He was the last of his line in North America.
That said, Elles, I do agree with some of the other posters–depends on your colt’s intended use, your capabilities for keeping/boarding/standing a stallion, and if–BIG IF–he’s got the conformation and disposition to remain a stallion.
Seems to me that as long as he is easy to work with and train there’s no harm in keeping him entire as long as your boarding situation allows. For your guy, it’s not just the Byerley Turk line that is promising; he’s got so much Sir Gaylord packed in his pedigree. He’s still very young and untrained, and until you see what he promises as a sport horse, my opinion is that it’s too early to geld. As long as he’s mannerly and trainable, why geld? If he were a conformation or temperament disaster, then I’d say geld.
Remember that, AFAIK, the Byerley Turk lines do not have a reputation for being particularly early maturing. He’s got a long time yet to grow and mature.
Viney/Elles: Where is his pedigree? I’d love to see it.
FWIW, my French Seventyfive filly was quite slow to mature, only reaching adult height and proportions in the last year (she’s a short 5 now). I think she still has some filling out to do and possibly another inch in height (she’s about 15.3). Then again, we don’t push our youngsters at all. It’s been worth the wait.
He is very slow maturing. This is his pedigree: http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=11038674
He is in the Netherlands and still in a group of youngsters I put him into one and a half years ago.
He is still quite sweet and cool headed for as much as I can judge. The people who take care of him say he is easy going and not difficult.
I must say that most of his diet has been hay and only a small portion of cubes. So he has not been pushed at all.
I have to move him from this farm at the end of april because they do not want to have three year old entires on the pasture. The horses are inside now in large stalls that hold about four to six youngsters and they have a number of outside paddock hours a day.
He has Turn To six times in his pedigree. He has Djebel seven times in his pedigree, three times through My Babu. Court Martial he has eight times and his sire Fair Trial sixteen times. And there is more of course.
I am not sure if these can be considered outcross horses in Europe, I do not think so really.
https://howgoodridersgetgood.wordpress.com/2011/12/29/sport-horse-pedigrees-7-outcross-lines-princequillo-tom-fool-forli-others/
I like his pedigree and if you want to keep him intact for now to wait and see and he is easy enough to handle I don’t really see the problem with it. But in my opinion, the marketability he has as a stallion is going to depend a lot on what you do with him.
My guess would be for him to be of any interest for race breeders as an outcross stallion he would have to race.
For sport horse breeders he is going to need a performance record. I can’t think of any breeders I know that would be terribly interested in breeding to an unproven stallion simply because of the line back to BT and the rest of his pedigree is nice but not overwhelmingly rare.
Additionally, for sport horse breeders looking for a TB outcross stallion you will have competition as there is at least one out there who traces to BT and I would consider a more complete outcross stallion based on his pedigree and also happens to be eventing at the 2* level in the UK I believe. http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10633772&blood=10"a=
If you (or whoever is taking care of him right now) doesn’t mjnd handling a stallion then I don’t think you have to geld him right now, and diversity is good, but I woild plan on the fact that he is going to have to be a successful competitor to have value as a stallion and just his pedigree, in my opinion, isn’t enough to warrant a breeding.
weixiao, very well said. In order to market a TB stallion in Europe you have to present him to the public. I think a very good example right now is Asagao xx. He never raced but is competing in jumping competitions.
It is always tough with a TB stallion regardless of his quality so you need to believe 200 % in him. If you don’t, he will not make it. I admire everybody who is trying because I think TBs are important for breeding Warmbloods.
So if you still believe in him don’t geld him right now if he is manageable. He is still very young and probably deserves a chance…
Quick search popped up these four race TB stallions standing in France that seem (on brief search, couldn’t find a stud farm page for one) to be of an attainable stud fee for sport horse breeders as well who also are direct sire line to BT. If I can find these quickly, I’m guessing there are others out there “hiding” too that could be found. Not to discourage you, just to encourage my point that you’re going to need a good sport career with him (on top of correct conformation, etc, obviously) for a marketable stallion.
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10691338
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?d=Captain+Chop&x=0&y=0
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?d=Kap+Rock&x=0&y=0
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?d=Linngari&x=0&y=0
My intention was and is to try some sort of career. I have saved up money for about the first two years of professional training but after that I should be making some money off him or someone else should jump on the bandwagon with me. Because by that time my savings will be spent.
I definitely wouldn’t go into this having an expectation of making money off of it. I think it is very, very hard to have a money making stallion. I think in general, if you’re lucky, you’re breaking even. Definitely wouldn’t be enough to offset the costs of producing him to a marketable level and that is going to take a lot more than 2 years.
Few more stallions:
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=COMPTON%20PLACE
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=INDIAN%20HAVEN
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=LINNGARI
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=SLEEPING%20INDIAN
http://www.bloodhorse.com/stallion-register/stallions/168001/dabbers-ridge-ire
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=INSATIABLE
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?d=Dunaden&x=0&y=0
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=RESPLENDENT%20GLORY
http://www.stallionguide.com/home/Stallion_page.asp?StallionName=VINNIE%20ROE
Many of the stallions that weixiao has posted are at least one full generation older than this colt, some two or more. The youngest is a nine year old with a 3k Euro stud fee. He has a wonderful race record, but is apparently not thought to be a “hot” racing stallion prospect.
Many of the stallions that weixiao has posted are at least one full generation older than this colt, some two. The youngest is a nine year old with a 3k Euro stud fee. He has a wonderful record.
I do not expect to be making money but it would be nice if his career could be paid for by what he earns or almost.
I love the TB breed and I find it a shame that there are hardly any (left) in my country.
But I am not hell bent on this, he could as well be a nice gelding for me to use for riding. That would save me a lot of hassle and risk :D.
Did I miss it or was it mentioned what discipline you are aiming at?
If it is for Sport horses, wouldn’t you present him to the registries?
Has he shown any great talent so far?
I would love to know how much of a market is outside, say, the KWPN in Holland and if they didn’t want him, would you be able to market him as a stallion with any great success?
I know they are always looking for Tb blood so that would be a good place to start instead of considering one horse in the pedigree 300 yrs ago. I seriously doubt that could matter at all at this point.
And even if he has decent horses 2 or 3 gens ago, he has to show the talent. How many brothers of famous stallions (with incredible pedigree’s) are also successful stallions? Not many.
