They won’t name one until after Vegas. The article I posted guesses it will be Tineke.
[QUOTE=kkj;2371368]
Velvet, rolkur aside, Sjef can ride. He is an effective/rider trainer. In Europe, it is not uncommon for a man to do a lot of the training and a women to do a lot of the showing. If you are an elegant man like Edward Gal or Andreas you can shine in the showring. If you are a more manly looking guy like Sjef, you may just do a lot of training and leave the showing to someone super tall, thin and elegant like Anky.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn’t say that he trains all the horses and Anky just competes them. That’s not giving Anky enough credit. She was competing at the Olympic level before Sjef came into her life.
[QUOTE=fargo;2371378]
Velvet you are wrong, he has been on the dutch dressage team in the past. Not the recent past but he has ridden Bo (also known as Olympic Bo who was subsequently ridden by Sven Rothenberger and gonnelien Rothenberger). He won team bronze in 1991 on the EK Dressage with the Dutch dressage team. So he has been there and has done that too…
So he has been there and he is the son of a well known dutch cyclist (sp?) and in that way has known top sport since he was young.[/QUOTE]
I thought he’d only been nationally competitive, not internationally. That’s all the info I found on him, thus the reason for my initial question out here on my first post on this topic.
Okay, you’ve got to show me exactly where kkj said that Anky “just competes” them. Because I’ve read it for comprehension and I get something totally different.
[QUOTE=Coreene;2371555]
Okay, you’ve got to show me exactly where kkj said that Anky “just competes” them. Because I’ve read it for comprehension and I get something totally different.[/QUOTE]
[i] In Europe, it is not uncommon for a man to do a lot of the training and a women to do a lot of the showing. [/i]
I guess I won’t delete this, but I’m adding a clarification. I am responding to Coreene about my last reply and am highlighting a statement made by KKJ–this was NOT said by me. Thank you for reading this entire message and now having a full understanding. 
[QUOTE=Velvet;2372100]
[i] In Europe, it is not uncommon for a man to do a lot of the training and a women to do a lot of the showing. [/i][/QUOTE]
That is at best hearsay…and I do resent statements that blanket some assumptions about things done in Europe…???
Wonder who is Isabel’s secret man…LOL!
[QUOTE=Velvet;2372100]
[i] In Europe, it is not uncommon for a man to do a lot of the training and a women to do a lot of the showing. [/i][/QUOTE]
And we clean the house, wash the dishes, take care of the kids, actually we do everything:p that is the reason most straight males stop working with horses it is just to much ;).
What a statement Velvet IMO where did you get that info from?.
It’s a ridiculous statement, absolutely ridiculous, so is what it implies, that the woman needs the man’s help with the training.
Each person does differently. Horses, riders and situations differ vastly.
There are ladies who get their husbands to ride the horses whose husbands know nothing of competing at that level, and who just hack the horses on a long rein.
There are a few women who are married to their trainers (KR was) and who got actual relevant help from their husbands. But there are just as many MEN who get help from a FEMALE partner, like Klimke.
Some have a partner or spouse who isn’t quite up at their level yet, but who can do a great deal to help.
Then there are situations like with Klimke, who, due to a very heavy work and riding and competing schedule, could very often leave a horse at home for weeks to be schooled by his wife, who, while not as famous to Americans, or with as many international medals to her credit, is an excellent trainer and competitor in her own right, and could do tons of good for his horses and keep them going for Klimke. In fact, she was responsible for much of the work done with Ahlerich. Klimke was still competing very actively on other horses and very often, Ahlerich was home with Ruth or their other trainer. That’s VERY common.
There are VERY few women who have a man do all the training and just hop on for the shows, and this is NOT typical of people like Wilcox, Salzgeber, etc, they WANT to do most of their own schooling and do, but someone else can help with the maintenance of the training.
If I would say it was true of ANYONE, it would be true of American women AND MEN, who don’t have the skill or experience to dive into the top levels, and rely on a trainer like Herbert Rehbein or Zeilinger to put the final training on the horse so they can enter into those levels.
there are situations, for some people, in which a spouse or partner can very easily hack the horse or school it a little or even work it at a higher level, while the main rider is out of town at a clinic or other competition for their other horses at another level.
In alot of cases, there is NO REASON the main rider has to ride the horse every second, and often when the rider is very busy it’s downright IMPOSSIBLE to do that.
In fact, it’s fairly obvious with this sort of thing, that a person NEEDS someone at home who can school the horses. No really great competition success is achieved over a period of years with many horses…WITHOUT someone who helps.
Who it is and how that’s done varies from person to person, but for KKJ to even IMPLY that this is some sort of weakness or copout is ridiculous. It’s absurd. In fact, it’s a reality for many busy trainers who succeed repeatedly with more than one horse over the years. Count up how many hours there are in the day, and, especially in Europe, where everything is close by and anyone like Uphoff or WIlcox is going to a show every single weekend SOMEWHERE, count up how many hours there are in a week.
Many horses BENEFIT from having a more easier going rider on them from time to time. They get the work they need but are in more of a ‘maintenance mode’.
Other horses have to be ridden every day by the main rider. That can represent a serious problem, but if the horse has a lot of potential someone would try to work around that.
Too, it’s the rule, rather than the exception, that more than one person and trainer are involved in the training of a given horse. Typically, no one person has trained ANY of the top FEI dressage horses.
Velvet was quoting kkj when she posted that
see, Egon, you DO read ‘the drivel’, LOL.
I read it. I just try not to write too much of it. Can you say the same?
oh egon, you have so much to teach the world!
see, Egon, you DO read ‘the drivel’, LOL.
You really didn’t believe otherwise, did you?? I never put much stock into “announcements” like that. :lol:
““Maybe if the U.S. hired Sjef as chef, we’d chance better than a bronze in 2008!””
Sure.
And, maybe they can increase fees at the grass roots level in order to pay off his law suits in the US, while they’re at it.
Cinder
Velvet: “I thought he’d only been nationally competitive, not internationally. That’s all the info I found on him, thus the reason for my initial question out here on my first post on this topic.”
I can’t find where he’s proven he knows what it takes to either train or ride on the top team (outside of the success he shares with his wife, with his wife naturally contributing a great deal to the equation):
Janssen not on an Olympic Team that medaled:
http://www.databaseolympics.com/sport/sportevent.htm?sp=EQU&enum=160
Janssen not an Olympic Individual that medaled:
http://www.databaseolympics.com/sport/sportevent.htm?sp=EQU&enum=150
I can’t find a bio on this guy, that is a bit silly isn’t it! The little I could find doesn’t indicate WHAT national team (for example, young riders?) or how they/he placed in competition results:
“Mr. Sjef Janssen was a successful dressage rider himself and became a member of the national team, but he achieved his greatest successes as the trainer of Anky van Grunsven, his wife. “http://www.wbs.wur.nl/UK/postacademic+education/Short+International+Programmes/Equine/
well, I’ll personally toast four bottles of the best champagne, and wish all the very best, to those who:
“are very keen on keeping their horse happy.” And if I knew how to say “best of luck” in Dutch I would.
[QUOTE=slc2;2372477]
oh egon, you have so much to teach the world![/QUOTE]
Just a teensy heads-up. The moderators are sick enough of the constant catty snarking and personal jabs on this forum that we are this close to simply closing it completely to give you ladies a “time out.” And I will be more than happy to name names of those who are culpable, so that the thousands of DQs who are upset to not be able to discuss the WC will be able to fill up YOUR inboxes with hate mail.
Grow the hell up. Ignore the people who annoy you. If you can’t do that, leave. Simple enough?
[QUOTE=egontoast;2372351]
Velvet was quoting kkj when she posted that[/QUOTE]
THANK YOU, eggie!
I can’t believe I’m being slammed for clarifying a response I had already made to a post that had THAT statement in it. Please, people, read the thread before jumping on someone. It was NOT me who would make such a statement. I thought it was offensive, Coreene was asking me what I was addressing in my response to another posters post.
Sheesh, this board sometimes, I tell ya! No wonder everyone thinks a person making a comment on the rail is saying something bad. Everyone is looking for someone to say something bad and jump on them. :rolleyes: I was just commenting on the fact that I did not agree with such a blatent statement, especially as it seemed to be pointed at Anky. That’s all. Then I reposted the exact sentence I was addressing.
Are we all clear now? I know eggie is! 
BTW, I think I’ll go and delete the offending message since I certainly do NOT want to be held responsible for that statement!
SM, it’s already been stated that he was on two European championship teams, and medaled as well.
[QUOTE=Erin;2373005]
Just a teensy heads-up. The moderators are sick enough of the constant catty snarking and personal jabs on this forum that we are this close to simply closing it completely to give you ladies a “time out.” And I will be more than happy to name names of those who are culpable, so that the thousands of DQs who are upset to not be able to discuss the WC will be able to fill up YOUR inboxes with hate mail.
Grow the hell up. Ignore the people who annoy you. If you can’t do that, leave. Simple enough?[/QUOTE]
Read this and again and again and again, and consider your own behaviour
