[QUOTE=tntrak;5958978]
IMAGER s a small Trakehner approved by the ATA and by Martini. He is trained and shown to Intermediare I think- He is around 15.3 opr so.[/QUOTE]
I have a Martini grandson who is only about 15.1h but is a powerhouse and a dynamite mover with a very large stride for his size. I’ve heard that the Martini line can run small, so I would definitely look into some of his sons.
Dr. Doolittle…I will post pictures for you. I do absolutely love all three Escudo II full siblings! They are smart, sweet, willing, athletic…everything I try to breed for! VERY much people oriented critters 
Talking to other people that have seen him in person, is is a small guy, with a fabulous neck, and enormous presence. I love my Escudo II kids, and Edgar is just the best to work with!
[QUOTE=flyinghorse;5966025]
Dr. Doolittle…I will post pictures for you. I do absolutely love all three Escudo II full siblings! They are smart, sweet, willing, athletic…everything I try to breed for! VERY much people oriented critters
Talking to other people that have seen him in person, is is a small guy, with a fabulous neck, and enormous presence. I love my Escudo II kids, and Edgar is just the best to work with![/QUOTE]
That would be wonderful, thanks so much! Yes, I get the impression that he is a small(ish) horse, but very elegant, lots of charisma; I am toying with the idea of flying out with my daughter during spring break next year to see him in person
Edgar has been nothing but helpful, and a delightful gentleman to talk to. (I’m very excited for the foal, it’s a filly. Only another 7-8 months to wait, cross fingers, worry, etc. :D)
He is very small. Probably the smallest warmblood stallion I have ever seen. To be honest he didn’t seem much taller than my mare who was 15.1hh. He does have a very big and uphill neck so I suppose someone could measure him at 16hh with some creativity.
This is the problem with people requiring horses be 16hh+, when looking for a smaller horse it’s impossible to know their real height.
[QUOTE=feuerkracher;5965991]
I’ve heard that the Martini line can run small, so I would definitely look into some of his sons.[/QUOTE]
Really? I’ve never heard this. I had a gelding by Martini who was 16.2hh and most others I’ve known were a similar height.
(This is an excellent line for work ethic and trainability.)
Imager is by Hailo PgE* o/o a Martini PgE* mare. Hailo himself (and IME most of the Hailo sons) do not necessarily add or subtract height from a mare - if the mare throws large she will prob still throw large with a foal by him and if the mare throws small or med you pretty much get small or med with a foal by him (there are exceptions of course). I’ve not heard anything one way or the other about Martini and size…
Imager himself I saw when he was approved in TN a couple of years ago. He scored a 10 on his walk. VERY nice (temperament) and a an all around good horse, I liked him - he did well in the jump chute too which was nice to see for a horse confirmed in dressage.
In this case - buy, don’t breed
I’m 5’0" and like the OP, wanted a small dressage-oriented athlete for myself.
Problem is, most WB registries don’t approve stallions under 16 hands, so even the smaller guys have lots of height in their pedigrees - and may throw it even if they don’t express it.
I’ve ended up with 2 smaller WBs - both around 15.2 hands. Neither WB dam was particularly small. They are by Dauphin & De Laurentis - but I’m not sure that either stallion is known to consistently down-size a mare. I’ve also had a smaller (16 hands but very refined) mare by Santa Cruz out of an average TB mare, although a friend has an 18-hand mare by him, also out of an average TB mare! Another friend has a really fancy 15.2ish gelding by Donnerluck out of a WB mare - again, I don’t think he’s a consistent down-sizer.
Small WBs are happy accidents. (Happy to petite riders, not so happy to breeders aiming for the 16.2 hand market.) As Angela Barilar noted, when she agreed to sell me the De Laurentis kid, “You can’t breed for a horse like this.” (meaning his size) She would know …
I have a DeLaurentis mare whose breeder picked him to downsize a 17.2 Oldenburg mare. My mare is 16.1, I think, but looks bigger.
Small warmblood stallions have size in their genetic background.
Anyway wanting to reliably downsize should look at German riding ponies, IMO.
What about a warmblood approved pony?
We have a few voltaire mares at our barn that were bred to two registered oldenburg ponies. One is a medium, stunning black with 4 stockings (hes dressage type) and the other is a large hunter pony.
Both were awarded premium at their inspections. Both also won qualifiers of the north american sport pony association.
The filly (out of a 16hh voltiare mare, and by the 14hh large pony) is 6 months old and about 14hh right now. They are expecting (and hoping) that she will finish off in the 15.2hh range.
I have two warmblood geldings that were both stallion candidates as youngsters, one was gelded just because of his small size (15.2 as a young three year old). He matured 15.3 1/2, he is a super mover, super disposition, gorgeous (black 4 white socks etc). Lucky for me, but interesting that there is so much emphasis on size by buyers as well as sellers. My newest purchase is a 15.1 or 2 DW filly. The breeder told me not to even take her to a keuring unless she reaches 15.3. There are a lot of us out here that don’t need big horses. I suspect one of the reasons I had such a hard time finding small is a lot of people just wouldn’t admit what size their horses really were!
Talented, smaller Oldenburg (1/2 Arabian): Saint Sandro
Did very well recently at Sporthorse Nationals.
[QUOTE=Kyzteke;5958294]
Rubino Bellisimo was only 15.3hh when he did his 100 Day Test in Germany; I think he matured to 16.1h.
I bred a 17.1hh mare to him and the resulting filly matured at 16.1hh herself. And he was successful (very successful) in GP by the time he was 8 or 9 yrs old. Pedigree is impeccable.
For that matter, Weltmeyer was billed as 16.1 or 16.2hh, but I have friends who stood next to him and judged him more like 16-16.1 TOPS.
I bred him to the same 17.1 hh mare and that mare is about 16.2hh.
And The Old Man has killer frozen semen.[/QUOTE]
He also has a number of kids and grandkids who are well above 16.2 hands, even up past 17 hands, so size doesn’t stay small just because you breed to Weltmeyer. His semen will now be limited since he is deceased.
OP, you need to research your mare’s pedigree. If there are a lot of horses in there who are tall or big, you’re not necessarily going to get petit, even if you breed to a GRP.
Being that your personal height is an issue for your next baby star, you should look at refining stallions as the option. This will produce less bone and refinement and thus still be a pleasing fit for you when riding. It’s not a guarantee, but a stallion that is pegged as a “refiner” means that most of time he influences the body in the biggness department. Big is not to be confused with tall. Tall and big are 2 different things. You may still get over 16 hands, but a refined horse won’t make you feel like you are a kid sitting on a well-rounded Thelwell pony (with your legs sticking straight out sideways)!
[QUOTE=Ridewithnopride;5958061]
I never understand why tall riders seem to always be concerned with finding a big enough horse. For me, as a 5’2" 110lb woman, I can’t seem to find enough talented SMALL horses, with big enough strides! Therefore, I will be breeding for me next time around. Mare is 16.3hh. I even considered breeding to a nice, large welsh or connemera but can’t shake the warmblood lust! :)[/QUOTE]
They are out there - but size of offspring can vary.
Actually, I have frozen semen from my DWB stallion who was 15.2 1/2. (15.3 required to present). He was outrageously talented, smart and a packer. Excellent dressage movement and super, catty jumper. By Graf Gotthard out of a Chrysos mare. Thing is that it appears from his 2 breedings to TB mares, he does not affect size so up to the mare as both foals were big. His 5 yr old son is near 16.3. The mare was very strong in type - all her offspring are big.
I also have a 14.1 very athletic pony stallion out of the full (younger) sister to the above stallion. She was the surviving twin and is 14.1 1/2. Bred her to BRP Rosslyn Pearl Fisher. So great German horse blood with Good English breeding. If all goes well, the plan is to test breed in 2012.
I also like the large ponies and prefer to ride them over a larger horse. I have 4 ponies out of either Section B stallions and our newest addition of larger ponies out of 2 imported British Riding Ponies (we do combined driving with the section B’s and are training the young BRP ponies for combined driving as well - so a good mind, movement and trainablilty is very important to us!). Check out Morton Stables www.mortonstables.com This is my mother in laws buisness and I have seen many of the foals out of all 4 of her stallions and they are all amazing! I just love the Top Cat foals as they are born quiet and talented!! He is registered BRP as well as North American Sport Pony. As an adult I can also show them under saddle in any Sport Pony show. I have seen a few horses that were bred to Commander and they have turned out to be lovely large ponies, some of them showing in the US on the hunter circut and doing very well!
Good luck in your search!
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