Sophie Gochman op-ed and follow ups.

[mvp]

@snaffle1987

White Privilege: (Noun) 1. A false ideology created to cultivate victimhood and hate. I could care less what peoples’ opinions are one way or the other on the racism topic in the industry to be honest. I have been involved for a long time as has my family. I have never once seen or encountered racism within the industry. Maybe I am a lucky one? However, my only problem with Ms Gochman’s article is that she is the upper 1% of the industry. An extremely privileged girl living in multi million dollar homes, attending private schools, riding million dollar horses for sport, wearing designer clothes, with a full staff. If you don’t know their family background; here is a good start https://eqliving.com/the-art-of-being-gochmans/ https://www.forbes.com/profile/gochman/#765a7b3a48b7 So essentially we are being lectured by a 17 yr old who has never experienced the “real world” outside of an extremely, extremely privileged and cushy lifestyle. So we are being lectured about privilege by privilege? Am I about to go cancel my COTH subscription over Sophie’s article? No I am not. Am I angered about it? Trying not to be. Then again, I refuse to act like my skin color should now be considered shameful to me. Like I should apologize for being born white. And I think that’s a legitimate concern for those trying to use the White Privilege argument in response to racism and The GF murder. That argument has little to nothing to do with, if not nothing to do with, who I support for a President or what our President does in office, either. I should not be shamed for being white. Does Sophie Gochman have a team of grooms and housekeepers, tending their everyday needs in the barn and at home? Is Sophie Gochman giving up her Palm Beach estate and million dollar horses and private education and giving them to those who are less-fortunate, minorities, compared to her? … to make the world a level playing field? Is the Gochman family (and other wealthy elitists in the horse world) going to start paying their grooms six figures for the amount of blood sweat and tears they put into their hours in the barn (to level the playing field)? I don’t think so (and nor should they!!) and neither is any other person in America who worked their butt off to get to their stage in life; regardless of race. I am an equal opportunity person. if you work hard, you educate yourself, you put in the time and hours; anything is possible for you in this world. That goes for every white, muslim, African American, Jewish, Indian living in America. I understand racism exists in America. Then again, it exists in all corners of the world and it has done so for centuries. But there is one thing that I refuse to do and that is to apologize or feel guilty because I am white and a mass group of individuals now feels the need to shame me for having white skin Better yet; if you want to fight police brutality; instead of burning down your cities and walking in the streets; become a cop. Be the change you want to see. It’s very easy to sit on the outside and point fingers at those who are overworked and underpaid and underappreciated in their line of work. like any facet of life; there are bad apples in all of them. But its up to us to ensure the good is not labeled with the bad. Stand up to police brutality by becoming a cop. Be the change you want to see. If no one steps up to actually BE THE CHANGE; your opinions are null.

I don’t want you to be ashamed for being white.

I would have you, however, give back all the accreted privilege back since the time your family arrived in the US before you spout off about how anyone can get anywhere with hard work… but also every corner of the globe is racist as well so…

One thing I see in this post, in Clark’s response and in quite a few very hard-working white pros in the horse business and other places: They point of their hard work but don’t realize that they were born ahead of others who work equally hard. And insofar as work ethics and intelligence are doled out equally among races and between genders, anyone who didn’t have to compete with everyone got a leg up.

Hard work or talent or some other individual quality is a necessary condition for success; it is not a sufficient condition for success. And it’s only the privileged who get don’t get to learn a whole lot about who got head starts and who did not.

[Midge]

There is a letter signed by a whole bunch of people that was sent to the Chronicle about Missy’s statement. It came across my Facebook feed, but I don’t see it anywhere? I recognized some COTH folks on there.

[oreo_mom]

@rah

Hey. If there is one thing I know, it is that your type is predictable. I am going to be blunt…you and the people that share your views have had their chance, your opinions really don’t mean much to me at this point and let me tell you why.
Sorry to be political to make my point but, too bad. I can almost guarantee I know how people like you are going to vote and probably why. Usually it for ‘fiscal’ reasons and unfortunately for me that also means that vote is a vote to make it legal to limit (oppress) my equal rights. I’m sure you are aware our current president, and the republicans, are currently in court fighting to make it legal to openly discriminate against me as a gay man, under the premise of religious freedom. I am going to guess people like you will vote for that again. Please be clear, I absolutely understand that means they are voting in favor of their money over my equal rights.
So, now it comes back to you wanting me to trust you and believe that people like you really do care about black and brown folks equal rights? Please…you might want to sit this one out.

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

[oreo_mom]

@atl_hunter

The magic word: DATA!!! I would love for USEF to conduct a survey so we can utilize data to better understand the question of “why don’t we have more minority participation in the sport?” Right now I’m seeing a lot of hypothesizing from people of all backgrounds, which is great because it means people are thinking! But at some point you have to test the hypothesis to get as close as you can to the root cause. The only people who can answer the question are the BIPOC folks, including people not represented here on the forum as they are the ones who are not participating. We need to get to the “Why.”

Those who have chosen to participate also need to have a voice and a chance to be heard, so we can understand what their experience is like and what we can do to make it better. But that is a different set of questions for a different target.

There are so many factors to consider, including:

• Demographics (age, gender, race)
• Income
• Logistics
• Inclusiveness
• etc...

To your point, statistic can be so biased and I have seen many of biased survey, so it would probably require the help of a consulting firm to correctly deploy, compile, and draw conclusions.

As anyone ever contemplated the idea that there is a much better chance to get into college on a football, baseball, soccer scholarship etc than a riding scholarship. Ask the kids in Belle Glade FL. Wait for their answer

[skydy]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

I have to disagree. “Any gay person saying they are a victim have made themselves into a victim”. REALLY? That is an extraordinarily ignorant statement.

My gay friends and relative are all Democrats. In fact I know absolutely no one right now that would vote Republican, including my lifelong Republican father. What does that have to do with anything?

[Pennywell_Bay]

[QUOTE=oreo mom;n10668933. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
. [/QUOTE]

Tell that to Mathew Shepherd’s family.

oh- and most of my gay friends are Democrats. Your point?

[rah]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

How did you get the idea I feel like a victim because I pointed out republicans are trying to take away my equal rights? Also, do you mind if I ask if your wealthy gay republican friends are members of the iswg and that authority group? They usually seem to go together?

[rah]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

Let me take a wild guess, your wealthy gay republican friends are proud members of the iswg and that authority group? Also, how do you get the idea I feel like a victim because I was pointing out the republicans are trying to limit my equal rights? I think I know but I would like to hear it from you.

[mvp]

@Midge

Did I say you were white?

Snaffle said she was white and not ashamed of it.

[mvp]

@meupatdoes

One thing that Missy Clark, student of history though she may be, really seems to miss is that “back when the AIDS epidemic was happening”, SO WAS RACIAL DISCRIMINATION.
So it really begs the question why, in an article about racial inclusion, she pats the horse industry on the back for coming together for the AIDS community but completely skipping over racial discrimination. Recall that, in the 80s, at the same time that the government was completely ignoring the AIDS epidemic (thank you, Regan) the government was LITERALLY ENCOURAGING DRUGS TO COME IN TO OUR COUNTRY in order to do an end run around the fact that Congress wouldn’t authorize funding the Sandanistas (thanks again, Reagan). OK, Nicaragua, Congress won’t let us fund you directly, so here’s a free pass to sell drugs across the border. While we are at it let’s throw in for-profit-prisons and mass incarceration on the other side of the coin. Missy was alive and conscious when all this was happening, but apparently was too wrapped up in addressing the AIDS epidemic to remember this.

Then we move along to this gem:
“To presume minority communities have been purposely excommunicated from our world of horses is like saying equestrians are not allowed as participants in basketball. Because you may not see a majority of certain presences doesn’t mean there have been purposeful exclusions.”

Oh really?
Back in the day, a mere 15 years or so before the AIDS epidemic Missy remembers so vividly, when water fountains were separate and sitting at a lunch counter was a political act, all the Hunt Clubs opened their arms to Black members?

Any Black person could join any old hunt? There was no purposeful exclusion or discrimination? Heavens, no, not in the horse industry!

Really amazing that we get a history lesson on the AIDS epidemic but somehow these small little footnotes in history are glossed over.

I believe the myth of the black Welfare Queen was also a favorite Reagan creation. You have a good point: While its all well-and-good that the horse industry “took up” for that “othered” group, LBGTQ folks, way back when**, racism was humming along nicely then as well, and not a peep (that Missy can see) from the horse industry.

** BTW, did I read correctly in her article that charity meant to help equestrians with AIDS was founded in 1996? That strikes me as coming late, or somewhere in the middle of the pack. Subtract 10 years and then I think the horsers can better take credit for sticking up for a rather demonized group.

[mvp]

@meupatdoes

I literally had a conversation with a Floridian Trump voter, pre election, asking them how they could vote for the erosion of gay rights that were so hard won.
The reply was that gay rights have come so far, they’re not going back.

Now this person, who let us recall, voted for Trump in an electorally significant state, hates Trump and the whole administration and is constantly posting on facebook about how terrible the current administration is.

While I’m glad she’s had a change of heart, I can’t help but be a little bitter every time I see one of those posts.

Yanno, the burn of whiplash from the change of opinion on this point was quite preventable. And it’s simple: Vote for Common Decency, and any one of us will do all right.

[Bethe_Mounce]

A few thoughts…and am loosely using Jane Elliott’s words…racists are not stupid, just ignorant. Education is the panacea for ignorance. I read Ms. Clark’s piece several times. And read Sophie’s piece several times and Tyler’s piece several times. I came to a personal conclusion: listening is an acquired skill; reading for comprehension is an acquired skill. Maybe more listening?

[mvp]

@atl_hunter

The magic word: DATA!!! I would love for USEF to conduct a survey so we can utilize data to better understand the question of “why don’t we have more minority participation in the sport?” Right now I’m seeing a lot of hypothesizing from people of all backgrounds, which is great because it means people are thinking! But at some point you have to test the hypothesis to get as close as you can to the root cause. The only people who can answer the question are the BIPOC folks, including people not represented here on the forum as they are the ones who are not participating. We need to get to the “Why.”

Those who have chosen to participate also need to have a voice and a chance to be heard, so we can understand what their experience is like and what we can do to make it better. But that is a different set of questions for a different target.

There are so many factors to consider, including:

• Demographics (age, gender, race)
• Income
• Logistics
• Inclusiveness
• etc...

To your point, statistic can be so biased and I have seen many of biased survey, so it would probably require the help of a consulting firm to correctly deploy, compile, and draw conclusions.

I believe the USEF already asks for demographic and income data from its members.

[fair_judy]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

You HOPE not to offend? That kind of preamble is always bad news. Perhaps it is time to recognize that You are in a distinct minority here.

[mvp]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

My heart is warmed by any member of a systematically- and historically oppressed group who feels themselves not subject to discrimination. Truly-- I don’t wish the experience of being kept down, or treated unjustly on anyone. It’s infuriating at best and demoralizing at worst.

But so what? Our standard ought to be raising the bar for those who are or feel more oppressed, not ignoring their plight because others in their demographic group don’t feel the same way. It seems to me that if our souls are the same color, we have some repairs to do to, among other things, on a justice system that has been shown to mete out disproportionately harsh sentences to black men.

[rah]

@oreo mom

Being in the horse business I have a lot of gay friends. Uh oh I hope I don’t offend anyone. The majority of my gay friends are Republicans. Yes they are probably wealthy gay men but the one thing they have in common is being themselves. Any gay person saying they are a victim is the one who had made themself into a victim.
As a black man said to me today— our souls are all the same color.
Perhaps it’s time for the people on this forum to realize that.

I am not sure how you came to the conclusion I feel like a victim because I am pointing out a major character flaw I see in humans. I also know some wealthy gay republicans, and some that aren’t so wealthy. The ones I know in the show world are also proud members of the iswg and the equity clubs, and that is really all I need to know about their character. Maybe you could spend a little time reflecting, and try to understand what the Black man’s statement really means before you share next time.

[Midge]

I have noticed the very same overlap between the people angry about the protests and ISWG. People happily posting horrific things in public.

[meupatdoes]

What are ISWG and the equity clubs?

[rah]

These same people were also protesting the stay at home orders and now the masks, weird. They truly believe they are smarter than scientists. I am all for people having confidence in themselves but this kind of behavior comes from entitlement, not knowledge.

[caffeinated]

ISWG = “I stand with George” (against the safe sport ruling)