Stable View cancelled

[AMWookey]

Updated-very happy to see they made the responsible decision to cancel. Hopefully the other events still planning on running will soon cancel as well.

Stable View has opted to run their FEI divisions but cancel their Nationals.

I understand that they have put a lot of effort into repairing and rebuilding a course they just created, but honestly, it’s incredibly selfish and self serving to run this. I get that riders feel they need to run their horses, but the rest of the entire sporting world has gotten on board with this. In their statement, they alluded to upper level rider pressure.

While I am not completely unbiased, I am a very frequent volunteer at Carolina, and on the CIC sub committee for the Carolina International. I had nothing to do with the decision to cancel the carolina, and despite the impact I know it has to my friends who work there, and the time I put into it myself, I was very happy with the decision to cancel.

I was disappointed enough with the riders bemoaning the cancelation on social media. This blatant disregard for public safety really ensures that this facility will not see this amateur rider. Not that they care.

[EventerAJ]

I can’t speak for Stable View.

But it is my understanding that Rocking Horse (and possibly Majestic Oaks?) is still running, but as unrecognized. I understand why other sporting events are cancelled; they have spectators, and competitors in locker rooms, travelling significant distances by plane or bus, and in general having a lot of personal interaction.

The usual horse trial in FL is mostly ship-in by locals within a 30-mile radius. Trailers park 20ft apart. People generally interact within their own close groups, trainer/student, rider/groom. It’s outside in fresh air, usually sunny. Its not hard to maintain safe social distance. The only shared locations are at the secretary office, and potentially the porta potty.

I didn’t enter my own horse in anything coming up, but I am supposed to ride a friend’s horse at Majestic Oaks. I don’t mind riding if the show continues. Honestly I feel a lot safer in open air than at restaurants, grocery stores, feed stores, etc.

[AMWookey]

@EventerAJ

I can’t speak for Stable View.

But it is my understanding that Rocking Horse (and possibly Majestic Oaks?) is still running, but as unrecognized. I understand why other sporting events are cancelled; they have spectators, and competitors in locker rooms, travelling significant distances by plane or bus, and in general having a lot of personal interaction.

The usual horse trial in FL is mostly ship-in by locals within a 30-mile radius. Trailers park 20ft apart. People generally interact within their own close groups, trainer/student, rider/groom. It’s outside in fresh air, usually sunny. Its not hard to maintain safe social distance. The only shared locations are at the secretary office, and potentially the porta potty.

I didn’t enter my own horse in anything coming up, but I am supposed to ride a friend’s horse at Majestic Oaks. I don’t mind riding if the show continues. Honestly I feel a lot safer in open air than at restaurants, grocery stores, feed stores, etc.

Except that the grooms, riders, volunteers will all touch the same toilets, have the have briefings in close contact, will need to use water hoses. They encourage people to travel and cross state boundaries. Where do they eat and sleep? This is an FEI event. It’s not local ship ins.

Every other sport has cancelled. Its irresponsible. My husband (never gets fired up) just wrote it out a lot better then iI ever will, and posted it to Major League Eventers.

[Equisis]

I think the riders are likely the ones at the lowest risk in these situations. Consider volunteers, who generally must congregate in large groups for briefings, and use supplies that lots of other people are touching. Secretaries, who have to interact with pretty much every person onsite. Stewards and veterinarians, who see much more contact with others at FEI events than at horse trials. Plus officials who may need to be flown in, and then stay at hotels, eat restaurant/show food, and ride in shared vehicles. There is a ton of close person-to-person contact that is difficult to mitigate occurring behind the scenes.

[EventerAJ]

@AMWookey

Except that the grooms, riders, volunteers will all touch the same toilets, have the have briefings in close contact, will need to use water hoses. They encourage people to travel and cross state boundaries. Where do they eat and sleep? This is an FEI event. It’s not local ship ins.

Every other sport has cancelled. Its irresponsible. My husband (never gets fired up) just wrote it out a lot better then iI ever will, and posted it to Major League Eventers.

In Great Britain, horse racing is continuing thus far “business as usual.” 250,000 people at Cheltenham last week. https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-rac…-usual-for-now

Again, I can’t speak for Stable View and their conditions. But I also can understand how locals feel safe to attend a “home” event.

I just volunteered yesterday at Ocala HT. I was at full arm’s length from others as we listened to the JJ briefing. Hand sanitizer was provided in Ziploc bags with our clipboards and radios. Was it 100% safe and sanitary? Don’t know. But jump judges were needed, and my husband and I were happy to help.

[AMWookey]

@EventerAJ

In Great Britain, horse racing is continuing thus far “business as usual.” 250,000 people at Cheltenham last week. https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-rac…-usual-for-now

Again, I can’t speak for Stable View and their conditions. But I also can understand how locals feel safe to attend a “home” event.

I just volunteered yesterday at Ocala HT. I was at full arm’s length from others as we listened to the JJ briefing. Hand sanitizer was provided in Ziploc bags with our clipboards and radios. Was it 100% safe and sanitary? Don’t know. But jump judges were needed, and my husband and I were happy to help.

I was on the sub committee for the Carolina. I still have prizes and awards to pick up and pay for. I took some of my precious vacation time (13 days of it) so that I could be volunteering and working every day leading up. I got VIP tickets for my 2 friends to fly down and spend the weekend, friends I hadn’t seen for a year. I was absolutely disappointed that our event was cancelled, but it was the right thing to do.

I am not worried about myself. These are rules and restrictions that have been placed across the globe. Social distance is one of the most important ways to slow the spread and help our medical infrastructure cope.

Spain is feeling the pain of not taking the proper steps already. Are we going to be next?

[ksbadger]

Both Majestic & Rocking Horse will run with a much reduced crew relative to a normal HT. Both will be trailer-in only so no overnight stabling/barn interactions (RH has I/P, P & N on the Saturday, T & BN on the Sunday). The competitors will all be from the Central Florida area and have been there since the New Year (and thus before this pandemic was known to have started in the US) irrespective of their home base.

[RAyers]

@EventerAJ

In Great Britain, horse racing is continuing thus far “business as usual.” 250,000 people at Cheltenham last week. https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-rac…-usual-for-now

Again, I can’t speak for Stable View and their conditions. But I also can understand how locals feel safe to attend a “home” event.

I just volunteered yesterday at Ocala HT. I was at full arm’s length from others as we listened to the JJ briefing. Hand sanitizer was provided in Ziploc bags with our clipboards and radios. Was it 100% safe and sanitary? Don’t know. But jump judges were needed, and my husband and I were happy to help.

And the UK government has decided to literally let thousands die in an insane experiment under the guise of creating “herd immunity.” It’s easier to let large crowds congregate and spread the disease than to actually attempt to mitigate it.

Don’t take their stupidity as a sign of some sort of strength. This disease is not a simple flu nor is it even close to over.

It’s main method of infection is via close family and friends, those who people actually self quarantine. Thus, those who show and stay together are more likely to pass it along than strangers.

The medical literature, while still fragmented is beginning to paint a picture of a virus that even when thought to be contained shows the ability to reinfect (cases are beginning to show up in China where those who were thought to be “cured” are infected again) or to live much longer in the body and be able to “hide” over time in-vivo.

I think running horse trials at this point, other than as a local competition, is questionable at best, absolutely stupid at worst.

[Bearx2]

Some good information from the cdc in the podcast below.

https://edition.cnn.com/audio/podcasts/corona-virus

[ghst13]

@ksbadger

The competitors will all be from the Central Florida area and have been there since the New Year (and thus before this pandemic was known to have started in the US) irrespective of their home base.

You’re assuming no one has traveled into or out of the area since arriving. No flying out for a quick horse shipping trip to Europe, no clients or perspective buyers coming in to ride or try sales horses. No interaction with anyone else in the general community who may have traveled at restaurants, bars, churches, etc.

Sadly, I find some of the attitudes in this thread as parallels to the safety discussion. It won’t happen to us, we’re different, we’re more careful than others who have been impacted.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

@AMWookey

Except that the grooms, riders, volunteers will all touch the same toilets, have the have briefings in close contact, will need to use water hoses. They encourage people to travel and cross state boundaries. Where do they eat and sleep? This is an FEI event. It’s not local ship ins.

Every other sport has cancelled. Its irresponsible. My husband (never gets fired up) just wrote it out a lot better then iI ever will, and posted it to Major League Eventers.

actually…most of these events running FEI levels are still local in nature. People are shipping in daily. The event runs over one or two days. They are not using hoses…but water they bring themselves. People are staying at their home bases. The events are doing other measures to further limit contact and protect their volunteers. The events holding those levels are most likely losing money. They are only doing so to support the sport. It is not wrong to cancel (and I think the better choice) but a few venues can still do limited levels in a safer manner if they choose to do so…but I do think that most competitors likely do not need to compete either. I’ll not be competing but I understand why we need a few options for our advanced horses.

[MsRidiculous]

I feel like people are having a really hard time understanding that it’s not really about THEM getting deathly ill, it’s about them becoming transmitters and spreading it even further into the population. One healthy person can very quickly spread it unknowingly to many other people who aren’t so healthy, who in turn spread it some more. The whole point of social distancing it to sever that link. It’s just not that hard to stay home as much as possible for a few weeks. It really isn’t. And it’s the responsibility of all of us to do so, to protect those members of our society who are not as healthy as we are. The sooner we get it under control, the smaller the impact will be on the industry, the economy, and the health and safety of our fellow citizens.

To think that horse shows have little to no risk for transmission is ludicrous… you touch the same doors, washracks, warmup jumps, pens, course maps, score sheets, porta-potties, etc and stand in the same show offices, tents, pavilions, etc. Even if it’s “just local”, to get there you need gas - touching high traffic gas pumps, convenience store doors, etc. Maybe you stop for coffee, or at a restaurant for dinner afterward. Seriously, spend a day just paying attention to how many things you touch that other people also touch before or after you do. We know that the virus can survive on surfaces for days. How abundant are proper hand-washing facilities at horse shows? How often are you touching your face because hair is blowing in your eye, or there’s a bug, or you’re sweating, or whatever?

I am not sure why so many horse people are convinced that we are exempt from our social responsibility, or that we are somehow special.

[AMWookey]

The DOD has cancelled all domestic travel, moves, relocations, training etc. To try and slow all of this down. But by all means, let’s have a horse show.

Let me put it this way-spouses of military members who have given notice at their jobs, possibly sold their homes, made all the changes necessary to move, their moves have been cancelled or post poned until at least May 11th. We know of people in this position.

The Canadian military has sent all but their most critical personnel home. Gyms and base services are closed. Schools are closed across multiple Countries. This isn’t an American problem. It’s not a mass media stirring up fear problem. Its science and math based to figure out how to reduce the burden on health care and save lives. Across the globe. I do not think everyone we know is going to die. But I will do my due diligence to try and be sure that I don’t contribute to someone’s death.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Yes…people do get it. And others don’t. It isn’t just a horse show…for some people it is also their livelihood. I’ve been working remotely for over a week and my entire office just shut down last night as a result of an exposure last week (so I was lucky to have already been out of the office). But my farm (my second business) still needs to run, the horses still need to be taken care of so that means I cannot fully quarantine. As I said, I’m not planning on competing but I do get why a limited number may still compete. These are not the people running lower levels competing for a ribbon who do this for a hobby (Or it shouldn’t be). We have to balance limiting the spread of the virus (that is beyond containment and in mitigation) with complete economic destruction—-and that is a hard line to draw. Not all jobs can be done remotely and in quarantine. A horse business is such a small business. But this is serious and it is scary. Most of us will ultimately catch this virus…and will know someone who dies from it. I’ve known several people who died from the Flu (not all were old)…And this virus is far more contagious.

[ghst13]

@bornfreenowexpensive

Yes…people do get it. And others don’t. It isn’t just a horse show…for some people it is also their livelihood. I’ve been working remotely for over a week and my entire office just shut down last night as a result of an exposure last week (so I was lucky to have already been out of the office). But my farm (my second business) still needs to run, the horses still need to be taken care of so that means I cannot fully quarantine. As I said, I’m not planning on competing but I do get why a limited number may still compete. These are not the people running lower levels competing for a ribbon who do this for a hobby (Or it shouldn’t be). We have to balance limiting the spread of the virus (that is beyond containment and in mitigation) with complete economic destruction—-and that is a hard line to draw. Not all jobs can be done remotely and in quarantine. A horse business is such a small business. But this is serious and it is scary. Most of us will ultimately catch this virus…and will know someone who dies from it. I’ve known several people who died from the Flu (not all were old)…And this virus is far more contagious.

I don’t think anyone said anything about quarantining individual farms. But I fail to see how a small horse business is ruined by not going to competitions for 30 days. There are all sorts of things that can keep someone from competing for that long or longer - person injuries, horse injuries, farm quarantines due to horse diseases such as strangles or EHV, weather conditions, etc.

Honest question, how would not doing an upper level competition for 30 days ruin someone’s business?

[bornfreenowexpensive]

@ghst13

I don’t think anyone said anything about quarantining individual farms. But I fail to see how a small horse business is ruined by not going to competitions for 30 days. There are all sorts of things that can keep someone from competing for that long or longer - person injuries, horse injuries, farm quarantines due to horse diseases such as strangles or EHV, weather conditions, etc.

Honest question, how would not doing an upper level competition for 30 days ruin someone’s business?

The effects are much greater for those levels. For our novice and training (even Prelim) horses it is not a big deal to not compete for 30 days. But at the higher levels…you can’t just pick up and go again. They need the right prep runs. So 30 days really can be end of a season…which may mean no qualifications and delay of more than one season. It has a much bigger domino effect. Now how much that affects a particular business likely will vary quite a bit but it may cause events much further out to also have to cancel as horses will not be prepped. So no KY3D, no Jersey Fresh or Bromont…and could impact the fall too. I suspect the Olympics is likely going to be postponed as well. For many besides just riders this will have a huge impact (vendors, photographers etc)

This may all have to happen (and probably will)…but my point is that it isn’t just a horse show. This will have economic impact on a lot of people and that needs acknowledgement as well.

[ghst13]

@bornfreenowexpensive

The effects are much greater for those levels. For our novice and training (even Prelim) horses it is not a big deal to not compete for 30 days. But at the higher levels…you can’t just pick up and go again. They need the right prep runs. So 30 days really can be end of a season…which may mean no qualifications and delay of more than one season. It has a much bigger domino effect. Now how much that affects a particular business likely will vary quite a bit but it may cause events much further out to also have to cancel as horses will not be prepped. So no KY3D, no Jersey Fresh or Bromont…and could impact the fall too. I suspect the Olympics is likely going to be postponed as well. For many besides just riders this will have a huge impact (vendors, photographers etc)

This may all have to happen (and probably will)…but my point is that it isn’t just a horse show. This will have economic impact on a lot of people and that needs acknowledgement as well.

Thank you for your explanation. I think this is just an area where we will have to agree to disagree. I still can’t justify in my mind that equestrian sport should get any special dispensation as compared to every other aspect of our lives and economy that will be impacted. There are college and professional athletes that may have now lost their season, businesses in college towns that depended on a student population that has now been sent home, any number of support personnel for concerts, athletic events and other large events that are impacted.

I’ve been through the frustration of losing a season to injury and it is certainly disappointing and frustrating but things happen beyond our control. I feel like part of the plus side of a 30 day pause across the board is that it levels the playing field for everyone. Now people may feel pressured to go out and compete because their peers are doing so and end up increasing the risk of spread of the virus.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

@ghst13

Thank you for your explanation. I think this is just an area where we will have to agree to disagree. I still can’t justify in my mind that equestrian sport should get any special dispensation as compared to every other aspect of our lives and economy that will be impacted. There are college and professional athletes that may have now lost their season, businesses in college towns that depended on a student population that has now been sent home, any number of support personnel for concerts, athletic events and other large events that are impacted.

I’ve been through the frustration of losing a season to injury and it is certainly disappointing and frustrating but things happen beyond our control. I feel like part of the plus side of a 30 day pause across the board is that it levels the playing field for everyone. Now people may feel pressured to go out and compete because their peers are doing so and end up increasing the risk of spread of the virus.

I don’t think you are going to find many events running anything. At least up in Area II most have fully cancelled including schooling shows. Most people are shutting down. My only point is that this is a business for some and not just a hobby. So the economic impact on them IS just like all the other businesses being hit. Not that exceptions should be made…but it needs to be viewed more than some disposable leisure activity… just like other businesses.

[AMWookey]

@bornfreenowexpensive

I don’t think you are going to find many events running anything. At least up in Area II most have fully cancelled including schooling shows. Most people are shutting down. My only point is that this is a business for some and not just a hobby. So the economic impact on them IS just like all the other businesses being hit. Not that exceptions should be made…but it needs to be viewed more than some disposable leisure activity… just like other businesses.

I totally get that it is a business. I truly feel for those personnel whose livelihoods are dependent on this.

I relate it to a truck driver who goes out in white out conditions. Their livelihood relies on making their deliveries and long hauls on time. So while others may be in, waiting out the storm, not putting a further burden on first responders who are out working the storm, the truck driver is still out there. Should that truck driver kill someone, or injure someone, during a time that the government or local officials told them to stay off the roads, then we would look at them as recklessly endangering others in order to make a living. And we wouldn’t look at it favourly.

While running an event may not have an obvious correlation to a truck accident, if there is someone or multiple people infected, it has a chance of an even wider spread endangerment.

I personally, am not looking at it as a leisure activity. I recognize that it is FEI levels, and for the most part, all pros. I recognize the grooms and vendors that are impacted. The grounds crew, and the jump crew. I just don’t believe it’s a valid enough reason. I believe it enough to say something about it.

My husband’s post got removed at 4am this morning from Major League Eventer due to the level of name calling it divulged into. I don’t know. I went to bed. I appreciate the civil discussion here 🙂

[Divine_Comedy]

@AMWookey, I saw your husband’s post getting circulated on FB and thought it was well put. However, and this is what might be rubbing people the wrong way, is third point:

“3. Competitors need to run to get ready for Kentucky – I’ll be blunt. If you’re an athlete who is going to take a horse around a 5* event and you or your horse cannot do it without running an Advanced a certain number of weeks out, then you’re likely not ready or need a new training plan. Also, I’m fairly certain that LRK3DE has already announced that they are planning to host an event in 2021…and 2022. It may not even run this year.”

Bold is mine.

I’m not sure if you or your husband is in healthcare or how familiar with the very top levels of eventing you or he are, but this statement is JUST as irresponsible and quite frankly, ignorant of the requirements of the sport, as saying if we just wash our hands a lot then we’ll all be fine.

Now, I actually agree with most of the post. But do you know the number of pairs who head to KY or 5* without an Advanced or 4*-S run that season? I can tell you in the past five years, I’m fairly certain exactly zero pairs have done it. I can give you exact numbers tomorrow, when I fire up my work laptop but it’s just not done. Riders at that level are to be considered experts (give or take a few green riders) at what it takes to prepare a horse for that level and if not one of them are willing to tackle a 5* without an A/4*-S run that season, I’d believe that it is dangerous to attempt to do so.

I’d also like to check the numbers of riders who do an Advanced/4*-S at Red Hills or before and then coast to KY. I do not believe you’ll find high numbers there, most of the horses who only do one or two prep runs at those levels usually wait until Carolina to begin their horses’ prep. Pairs who run at Rocking/Pine Top/Red Hills/Fresno/Twin Rivers tend to also run another 1-2 times before KY as well. So you’re looking at the majority of competitors not having the preparation they want or expect before tackling a 5*.

The 5* level is NOT the place to experiment with less preparation. It could turn out to be deadly too.

Having said that, I believe that the likelihood of KY 5* happening is…not high. Without KY pulling the trigger and cancelling, these riders are going to continue to try and find places to do their prep runs, because they as experts in preparing a horse for 5*, know what they need to do to accomplish that SAFELY. Just as health care professionals know the best way to control a pandemic.

Perhaps KY needs to address the elephant in the room. It’s not enough just for the riders to show up…they need to be prepared too. If the end goal is taken away, or postponed, perhaps the riders will feel that it is ok to cool their jets and stay home. Otherwise, the riders are going to be as desperate to find ways to make a run or two happen as a local restaurant is to keep afloat during this time of social distancing.