Agree with this. I’ve seen some pretty spectacular horse /rider falls at hunter/jumper shows and even myself in a lesson on a green horse where horse stumbled, down he went and he rolled over me. I was very lucky coming out of that with just really nice bruises. I can also, recall some Jr. riders succumbing to head/neck injuries in the show ring - this was before H/J land required certified helmets. Bad things can happen in any sport.
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I’ve seen a rotational in a BN warmup. Like someone else said, it could happen just cantering. I’ve seen 2 almost full rotationals in barrel racing even.
OP if you have this much anxiety about falling, in my opinion it’s probably best that you don’t jump until you’ve worked through your fears.
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Thanks again, everyone, for the responses! I think I might follow a poster’s suggestion to go volunteer at an event where the lower level is happening and watch and ask questions. Thanks again to everyone for being so kind during these exchanges. I have always found eventers to be pretty cool, helpful, low drama people and it looks like I was correct! Thanks again!
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The hilarious thing is I have galloped thoroughbreds, been asked to ride horses that haven’t been ridden in years and have ridden them, ridden hot horses, ridden horses that bolted, bucked, head tossed, reared, or were tree swipers (and sometimes that was the same horse!), have ridden green horses and backed my own babies. None of that made me bat an eye. But, something about dying in a rotational fall has me freaked out. There are certain ways I don’t want to die…I know crazy. However, I don’t want to die being eaten by a shark or alligator, falling to the ground from a plane or die in rotational fall. Everything else is on the table!
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Stay with what is fun for you. :yes:
“Tree swipers” :lol: My first pony was one of those.
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Skydy- yeah, I think you are probably right.
I hear you with your first pony! My first horse was a grade, badass Morgan mare who tried to kill me every time I rode her. Got her for free. My parents didn’t know any better and I wasn’t about to complain or let them in on it. She was horrible but, at least, she was mine!
I do love eventing always have. I guess as much as I am intrigued by the sport, it’s probably not in the cards for me because at the end of the day…my heart isn’t in it. I hope, for the sake of the sport, that they can figure out the safety problems so I can keep cheering all of you on!
Would it be crazy to make a cross country course with hunter/jumper type jumps? I mean just at the 2’11 and under level.
That would be called an “outside course”.
Show hunters USED to compete over outside courses with solid fences (stone walls, post-and-rail, aiken, etc)
Why wouldn’t we hear about rotational falls at the lower levels?
I agree with those who say if the primary reason for your idea is to avoid rotational falls, this isn’t an idea that will accomplish anything, for all the reasons given by other posters.
Jumps up to novice level in eventing are not at all difficult for most sport-type horses. In spite of all of the facetious “I’ve seen rotationals everywhere, there is no escape” fear-mongering posts, in fact you really should haven’t a problem getting safely around BN & N courses if you have a good-enough trainer and a good-enough horse. You don’t really need jumps that fall, because your horse can easily jump these. As a trainer once said, if you do this right, it’s safe.
And that is the core of eventing – do it right, for yourself and for the horse. Prepare and execute with true skill and certainty. And enjoy the thrill of completing a course.
My suggestion is that instead of trying to re-invent eventing, concentrate on your own mental approach to riding the course, and increase your riding education and confidence.
Of course there is a cadre of riders, who do not event, who talk eventing down and claim that, as-is, a cross-country course is an accident waiting to happen. It’s not.
As a volunteer jump judge, you are likely to end up watching dozens of riders safely navigate a jump, and a course, without a major incident. To the point where it is as boring as any hunter class. You will also see the most fun part of the lowest levels, for me - a wide variety of horses cruising around the course. Along with some WB’s and TB’s there is likely to be an odd collection of various pony types (sometimes including Fjords), along with all kinds of ‘regular size’ horses - 100% or less Arabian; Morgan; Andalusian; saddlebred; draft; every color; every crossbreeding - it’s all there, and all of these horses go around quite easily.
Once upon a time at an event that was well known for max courses and new challenges, the course designer put a jump on the novice course that almost none of the novice-level riders had jumped before. From the time the course was open for walking until horses were going into the start box, there was angst, there were complaints, there was endless discussion of to how to ride it. So as a spectator I was very curious as to how this would work out, and I parked my butt right at that jump for the duration. What happened was that horse after horse, 45 altogether, all sizes, types and experience, cruised right over it. Only 3 green refusals, and they all jumped it on the next presentation. That’s eventing - face your challenge, find out how to ride it, and go do it. Lots of people do!
And yes, there are tons of unrecognized divisions that will allow you to gallop around very low jumps and experience the ditches, water crossings, steps and so forth at a very soft level. So that’s an option to enjoy the course with the least stress. 
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Not knowing the different levels in North America I do believe lower level events are good for the sport.
In my country they run unofficial classes below the official levels on many events. In my opinion these classes makes more people come out while also offering a safe kind of practise environment. It is also a great way to present competitions for younger horses and riders.
Injuries on the other hand comes on all levels. Which is why I for one embrace any kind of training making riders get more experience without overdoing things as a blessing.
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Tripping on the flat or getting tangled up in dislodged hunter rails are a different category of rotational falls, distinct from a horse rotating over a solid fence that has caught the horse between its knee and shoulder.
The first type is sort of background noise with respect to the risk assumed while riding horses in general and over show jumps. The second type is specifically caused by the nature of cross country fences being an immovable object. Citing examples of the first kind while discussing possible solutions for the second kind is counterproductive.
I’d like to see the horse fall data for the lower levels as I’m sure the risk of horse falls increases predictably with the height of the solid xc fence. At the old FEI levels, a horse falls over a one star fence once per 2750 jumping efforts. 4 star horses fall once every 750 jumps.
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We actually have those facts in the UK. They are recorded. On the BE website the most recent data is for 2017. TBH if I kept my BE magazines I could probably find more up to date information as type of thing they publish.
in 2017 - 76,000 xc starters who jumped 16,000 jumps.
There were 1486 falls of which 1380 were at jumps.
Worst culprits as jumps - ditches, trakes and corners. Least - spreads
In 2002 there were 0.20% rotational falls and in 2017 there were 0.05%.
It is also true that rotational falls happen less at lower levels. The most dangerous level for serious falls is 3*. Loads of reasons but basically because its a level where horses need riders to be better whereas at 2* they can get away with it.
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Can you please link these claims with sources? The jumps you describe are not the same as the research we have shared many times here. Also, I know of 2 horse fatalities in the UK that were not even reported last year, likewise here in Ontario. So I do not think the whole truth is truly out there currently.
I would love for you to direct me where the UK stats etc are you posted so I can read it and add it to our discussions on this board.
Thanks for posting this, but something is off about those numbers – not sure if it’s a typo or mistake at the source, but as written there are fewer jumps than riders!
Nothing off - they jumped 16,000 jumps. If a course has 16-20 jumps x by however many courses/venues that is the number.
As mentioned its all on the BE website…
https://www.britisheventing.com/downloads
Also just because horse fatalities are not mentioned - doesnt mean they were not recorded unless it was unaffiliated then there is no responsibility to record. The last person to die in the UK on a XC course was doing unaffiliated.
What the numbers dont tell you is the level which the falls happened. It makes sense to me that more people fall off at ditches and trakes. Most likely to catch out grassroots riders who have higher numbers participating and are more likely to fall off. This is not rotational, just falls which is what the data looks at.
While there is some room for further data and statistical analysis in those reports, it’s really nice to see them updating and releasing reports annually/biennially.
To the OP, my favourite thing to do is school cross-country. I like to keep solid heights well below my horse’s jumping ability - usually 2’6 and under. As others noted, hunter paces with optional jumps are lots of fun, as are derbies and combined courses that offer much lower jump heights than regular HTs. The camaraderie at the lower-level competitions is fantastic, making them much less stressful.
I’ve had more mishaps (none rotational thankfully) in the sand ring jumping sticks than I have had out on cross-country, and I find my horse is more comfortable and sure of herself out there. There are lots of fun things to start with to build confidence out there with very low risk levels that you could try if you want to dip your toes in the Eventing world.
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There are a ton of local shows around here that go even as low as 12 inches (which is probably what I will do if my mare is ever sound to jump again :lol:). At that height, it’s basically fancy trot cavaletti!
If you are interested in eventing, you don’t HAVE to compete. I don’t know if I will ever get to event again, but I still follow the sport. And if you think the idea of it sounds fun…well, get a sure footed horse that you would feel safe foxhunting with, and go try one of those 12" or 18" levels where you could probably step over the jump. Those heights are about the same as logs you would have to cross on a trail ride, so no more dangerous than that. Try it, see what you think.
Unfortunately, there will always be some amount of risk, but this is true for any equestrian discipline. I know people that have died trail riding. And not even crazy trail riding, just average. wandering down a trail. But if you choose the right horse, make sure you and the horse are well trained for the level (be able to ride and jump on terrain, actually school XC often, take lots of dressage lessons and have complete control at speed, etc), make sure you and your horse are physically fit to ride at that level, have sufficient safety equipment, etc etc etc, that risk goes down a LOT as far as eventing goes.
I do agree that going to volunteer at a few events, watching the lower levels, might let you see if you think you would be up to try it. If you are, just go to a low key schooling show. Go school the little jumps on the cross country course. Do an amoeba or pre-amoeba type course, trot or even walk in between the jumps if you want. If at any time you think it’s too dangerous, you can just stop and won’t be out of a ton of money. Eventing doesn’t have to be (and shouldn’t be) balls-to-the-wall galloping at the jumps. And honestly, hunter paces really aren’t that different from a XC course, you just have two riders going together at the same time.
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Thank you for the link.
They compared number of falls from 2017 to the 2002-2003 season. That doesn’t tell me falls have decreased, that was a pic and choose number to make things look better than they are.
Seems frangible pin fences have a high rate of falls at 11.5%?
I wonder why there is no data for 208 and 2019?
Sunny - have you looked into taking a LandSafe clinic? It’s a great skillset and learning experience for anyone riding, not just jumping, but also might help alleviate some of your anxiety.
