Suggestions needed for an article: "Not Aged" Very Promising TB Sires of Eventers

[vineyridge]

There’s a young stud in Ireland who interests me named Sound Man Fenya. He’s got a really nice bottom line and the top is also quite nice. He’s about 7.

Slyguff Stud has two–Golden Master who is Master Imp out of a Prefairy mare and Pointilliste. Golden Master is over your age cutoff (1999), but Pointilliste is a 2003 model.

I notice that one Irish stud is planning to use a 3-4 yo Robin des Champs unraced son, Robin de la Maison, for event breeding. Robin des Champs makes my heart go pitter patter, and the damline of Robin de la Maison is quite interesting, with double Ribot and same tail female as the American Pocahontas.

Chiron xx in Germany is a 2001 model who won the German Munster TB Showcase in 2010. His pedigree is very international. Bred in Germany he has no German blood. Not too fond of the Lomond sire line, but the rest of his pedigree is sterling, and his tail female goes to Perfume/Lavendula.

[tom]

Thank you.

[goodpony]

this guy looks interesting: http://www.horsetelex.com/horses/pedigree/46194

[vineyridge]

I’ve been going over all the TB stallions on webpedigrees.com who were born after 1999 and am finding some interesting ones. Cyrkon is Alydar line and has been approved by Holstein. He’s a 2004 model.

[halt]

what about these two (viney) ?

http://holsteiner-verband.de/front_content.php?client=1&lang=2&idart=5566
http://holsteiner-verband.de/front_content.php?client=1&lang=2&idart=449

[vineyridge]

[QUOTE=goodpony;8045089]
this guy looks interesting: http://www.horsetelex.com/horses/pedigree/46194[/QUOTE]

That’s a mare. One of Jan Greve’s herd of TBs. He’s always sponsored TBs as sport horse stallions. Anytime you see a TB with Watermill or Watermoelen, it’s one of Greve’s. Ones like Watermill Swatch and Watermill Rolex and Painter,s Row and Wiliwander and one whose name begins with an A that I forget. None of them have ever gotten much of anything.

[vineyridge]

Armand is the right age. Fragonard is approaching aged. He’s a 1999 model. The is another Holsteiner approved stallion named Ibisco who is a 2000 model. He’s sired 3 approved stallions, two by Holstein. But I can’t seem to find many of his in actual sport.

[goodpony]

oops shared his dam…Swatch was the one that looked interesting–nice type. His website says he has a couple of YR’s horses.

[Simkie]

Does Rather Well have any up and coming stallion sons? He’s “aged” according to these criteria.

Fred, would love to hear more about that TB AFR colt Very excited to hear he’s got some sons to carry on his legacy!

[skydy]

[QUOTE=Highflyer;8044639]
Not quite TB-- but what about the Gem Twist clones?[/QUOTE]

:lol: Oh, so wrong, to suggest THAT on this thread! :winkgrin:
Clones are not done, with most any studbook.

[vineyridge]

If I were in Europe and wanted to use a TB sire for an event horse, I’d haul the mare to France, and for 1500 Euros, breed her to Laverock. He’s a tail male great grandson of Sir Tristram, one of the greatest event sires in history; he was a successful racer; he’s 13; he hasn’t been at stud long–since 2009, and in his first crop, he’s produced a hurdler who will be running in the Champion Hurdle at Cheltenham this weekend (Kitten Rock); he ticks all my pedigree boxes and then some; he’s nice looking; and is that middle distance runner who obviously can produce either long or short. His sire was an Australian champion and produced Lonhro, another Australian champion, who shuttled to Kentucky. Could never afford Lonhro, but could afford Laverock.
http://sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10552720

Although Laverock either shuttles to or has been sold to Australia. There is a notice on France-Galop that states “Exportation Definitive 27/08/2014–Aus” I’m researching that now.

I just checked the Australian Stud Book and Laverock IS in there with an Australian number. I also checked the Racing Post. He’s now owned by Godolphin, and The Racing Post has him with a 2015 stud feed of 1500 euros, standing at Haras de Saint Voir. So it sounds as if he may be shuttling.

[Elles]

ALBERTO GIACOMETTI XX
IBISCO XX
BALLINLOUGH GERRY XX
BERYLLUS XX
BODYGUARD OF SPAIN XX
CARUS XX
DESIRAO XX
DUKE OF HEARTS XX
ESB GOLDEN KNIGHT XX
FRAGONARD XX
Golden Lariat xx
ARMAND XX
COLOSSUS XX
FIEPES WINGED XX
FLY SOCIETY XX
GENIOS XX
INTENDANT XX
KITON XX
LAST ACTION HERO XX
MOUNT EDNA XX
FOXATTAC XX
BELMUNDO XX
CYRKON XX
DAUDET XX
MULLIGAN XX
REX SHIPPING XX
MR BIG CAT XX
SHREK XX
SZAMURAJ XX
IL DIVO XX
LUCARELLI XX
NOM DE D’LA XX
PANYU XX

SAPHIR XX
LIZIO XX
UNITED NATIONS XX
ASAGAO XX

[Elles]

However I do not know about their own performances and those of their offspring, sorry.
But for example this stallion is on an eventing website: http://www.boelting-eventers.de/mulligan.html

These are in France:
http://www.haras-bareliere.com/etalons-2/course/lizzio/
http://www.france-sire.com/actu_cheval-9756-nom_de_d_la_et_agent_secret_les_deux_nouveaux_etalons_du_haras_du_mazet.php

A list from 2014 of French TB stallions, no idea if these also cover non TB mares:
http://www.fba.fr/userfiles/2483/File/stud-fees-fba.pdf

New-Zealand TB stallions: http://nzthoroughbred.co.nz/studs-stallions/default.aspx

I think if you look at the list of horses that competed at MONDIAL DU LION
Haras national du Lion d’Angers not a lot of those nowadays have a TB sire. No idea why because at the highest level horses by a TB sire are still doing well.
http://www.mondialdulion.com/2014/archives/pdf/liste-des-chevaux-ayant-participe-au-mondial-du-lion-depuis-1986.pdf

A son of Ibisco xx: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BlnBB8-9Cw

An offspring of Duke of Hearts xx: http://www.hippomundo.nl/competitions/index/389223

Offspring of Fragonard xx: http://www.hippomundo.nl/competitions/index/104607
http://www.hippomundo.nl/competitions/index/104613

Nobre xx maybe? http://www.astrid-ue.de/celle2004/pages/33-nobre.html

[omare]

“I think if you look at the list of horses that competed at MONDIAL DU LION
Haras national du Lion d’Angers not a lot of those nowadays have a TB sire. No idea why because at the highest level horses by a TB sire are still doing well.”

One thing I have read is that the thoroughbreds used for sport horse breeding, as the parents and relatives were not used in sport, inter alia, have a lower BLUP hence lower interest from breeders.
http://www.horsemagazine.com/thm/2014/12/the-horse-breeders-of-france/

[Elles]

Thank God for that last sentence:

Footnote: And it was Bernard le Courtois as President of the Selle Français who was able to announce the death of the BLUP in 2013…

[vineyridge]

Most TB stallions in France cover non-TBs. French racing, chasing in particular, is filled with SFs, ACs, and AQPS horses. The SFs used to just approve all TBs for breeding. They changed that policy about 15 or twenty years ago.

[Timex]

for those in NY, Stonesider at Saratoga stud IS available to be bred to tb’s for sport (and probably to nice non-TB mares as well). just throwing that out there. and, fwiw, he doe have at least a few offspring that have come off the track and gone to eventing homes. I don’t have names offhand, would have to ask. they are still young yet, though. his pedigree: http://www.bloodhorse.com/stallion-register/stallions/135588/stonesider

[vineyridge]

Clayton Fredericks brought Mr Big Cat from Brazil a few years ago. There are a couple of his young ones from Headley Brittania.

[somanyhorses]

Hi Tom, as you are considering horses from the Southern Hemisphere, you may want to consider Another Warrior. One of our Olympic eventers, Shane Rose, stands him, and he is the sire of Shane’s horse Shanghai Joe who won Melbourne CCI*** last year aged 7 I think, and also a promising 2* horse Another Biscuit. http://www.bimbadeenhorses.com.au/?page_id=231

[vineyridge]

[QUOTE=somanyhorses;8046577]
Hi Tom, as you are considering horses from the Southern Hemisphere, you may want to consider Another Warrior. One of our Olympic eventers, Shane Rose, stands him, and he is the sire of Shane’s horse Shanghai Joe who won Melbourne CCI*** last year aged 7 I think, and also a promising 2* horse Another Biscuit. http://www.bimbadeenhorses.com.au/?page_id=231[/QUOTE]

Lovely pedigree that horse has got.

Judy Wardrope, the conformation expert from Canada is standing a TB for sport somewhere in the west. Unfortunately I can’t remember his name, but I do know he’s close kin to Sea Accounts. She’s only had him a couple of years and seems to be putting him on top of WB mares. Unfortunately he’s a 1998 model, so aged even if he is new.

Tom, if you want to do the research, there’s a way to search the FEI database for sires if you know a name you want to research. Peaches here figured it out. Here is what I copied from her to search. Go to Google and use this language in the search bar:
site:https://data.fei.org/ “horse name”

You HAVE to put the horse’s name between quotes.

I did Armand that way and got ten pages of results. I didn’t look through all of them, but I did find two fei level horses by him, both Jumpers, IIRC.