I don’t see anything wrong with someone riding in a class they and their horse qualify for, regardless of who they’re married to.
A TRUE amateur counts 1, 2, 1, 2, 1, SHIT!
The difference between that and the way the junior counts is that the trainer will chastise the junior for language so the junior is encouraged to say “shoot.”
So…since the spouse rides “to well” for good optics in this situation, what is the suggested solution for this person if they want to show?
And getting ring time in the target sales division with an ammy rider is a very good sales strategy.
I see that it’s a somewhat challenging situation for the kids, but surely they could understand if you explain that the divisions are combined. This could be a teachable sportsmanship moment.
Possibly you could ask the show management (given the situation), if there could be a special award given to the highest scoring kid in the combined classes?
Dressage shows combine classes all the time, but manage to give out both junior and senior ribbons.
I literally shouted this at WEC. I then told everyone I was a PG13 rider Still don’t know the quote feature Ba ha ha. I shouted SHIT at a spot AND when I made the jump off
User name checks out!
Forgive me because I don’t know what a B show is - I assume the equivalent of a non-rated schooling show? If so, is it even going to show up on the horse’s USEF record?
As I mentioned somewhere upthread, my personal selection criteria for me & my child is not “Has this horse done X?”. It is “Has this horse done X with someone roughly our paygrade piloting?” Based upon what I see careening around the ring with pros on board at schooling shows here, the fact that the 6’ 190 lbs pro got that Irish Draught over a 2’6" course & created a somewhat nice picture doing it in no way warrants or implies that my nervous AA self can do the same.
Weighing more makes for a better round?
Interesting.
Usef has AA, A, B, and C rated shows. Our barn typically does A shows, and then some AA and some B shows. This show sure ain’t HITS, but it is not a schooling show. Thanks everyone for their points of view!
There have been a bunch of posts lately where people complain about showing against other people - who by all appearances are following the rules and showing in what they’re eligible to compete in - because those other people (gasp) ride better than they do.
It’s really unbecoming, IMO. Learn to lose just like you learn to win. It’s not modeling good behavior for your children (who are competing in a 3’ division and still having to count their way around the course?) to be throwing shade at someone just because they ride better than the kids at the moment and are eligible to ride in that division.
If the division isn’t something like maiden/novice/limit, where eligibility is determined by prior winnings, then you really don’t have a leg to stand on. Model better sportsmanship for your kids.
No, but a man that size is hell of a lot stronger. Lean muscle mass.
Can make a big difference in keeping a horse that size put together & not getting strung out on the forehand.
You’re getting information. I happen to think your question reflects some poor sportsmanship. Now you have that information. The nice thing is that you can do whatever you want with the responses you get. Clearly, mine hit a bit of a nerve.
Best wishes
Wow.
It’s also possible the adult registered for an adult class and found out on the day of the show the classes had been combined. Is he meant to lose his registration fee and waste the costs of bringing the horse because of this?
Was he the only adult in a class that was otherwise 100% upper beginner tweens? In that case he might take first place but there are 5 or 6 ribbons left to share among the kiddies. Or was there also a strong contingent of really competent juniors on the show? In that case the beginner kiddies aren’t going to see any ribbons.
There is no level playing field in equestrian competition. The multiple combinations of horse and rider skills, talent, cost, and coaching mean that even those who technically fit within one level are widely disparate.
As your beginner kiddies on school horses progress, they will come up across all sorts of “unlevel” situations, even compared to other juniors with better coaching, more saddle time, and way more expensive horses. That’s why you really need to ride against yourself rather than for the ribbons.
And jumping is notoriously unpredictable. You can knock a rail and be out of the ribbons. A clean round is never guaranteed even at the Longines Master’s. You could have trainer’s spouse knock a rail on his sales project and lose to a kidlet on a pony Saint.
I’ve also watched big jumping classes, and yes, a really gutsy small teen on a hot handy large pony that can cut corners will absolutely beat all the adults up through 2 foot 6.
If you are in hunters where pure speed isn’t the point, realize that hunters is partly scored on the pace and way of going inherent to the horse. Put two tweens of equal ability in the ring and the one with the more appropriate (likely more expensive) horse will win.
Very soon, OP, the most well off girl in your child’s lesson program will end up buying a $50,000 warmblood with show miles and an $8000 CWD saddle, riding every day, getting training rides from the trainer, and in general being fussed over. And this girl will beat all the lesson kiddies at every show, before she disappears to a more expensive show barn.
While this is going on, how will you address the tears, the jealousy, the begging for a really good horse of their own, etc? The only way forward will be to stress starting now that we only ride against ourselves, we do the best with what we have, and ribbons only represent a 3 minute moment in the total history of your horsemanship.
The other solution of course is to buy your child a $100,000 horse.
Which is only a short term solution, since there will be others who will buy their kids a $200,000 horse or a $300,000 horse or what have you.
Points taken, truly, these will help me going forward in my own riding. But this is not about me as a rider or a parent in any literal way. My own children don’t ride and these children (the middle schoolers referenced in the title) are well-mounted. They are on leased horses that have been to indoors, but that are now senior citizens. The children are inexperienced in the show ring: they are not little jerks and two are working students. I found it shady that this particular trainer-spouse combo was doing this. Other people did too. I realize now, though, that it is not a big deal.
While there are many great points about fairness here, so long as trainers husband isn’t breaking any rules it’s not tacky IMO. If he’s following the rules and wants to show in those classes it’s his right and perfectly normal. I do not think showing a 3’ horse in the adults - that HAPPENED to get combined with the kids - and then another in the 3’3 AOs - plus the open divisions - means he’s sandbagging. If he’s an amateur, and your zone allows cross entry, he isn’t breaking any rules here. Would you care if he rode like crap and only scored in the 60s or do you care because he rides well and wins?
If the kids 1,2,1,2ing are that upset about not WINNING they need to either step down to the 2’6 or adjust their goals. There will always be a better rider. Competing makes us better. That is my perspective.
Also — I count 1,2 to 3’ jumps all the time lol.
The only relevant part of that sentence for competition purposes is the first half. They are inexperienced in the show ring.
All the rest of it makes no difference for the two minutes they are in the ring. Whether they are good kids, terrible kids, rich kids, poor kids, hard workers, lazy as all get out, whatever. They are only being judged on their performance in that class, just like everybody else who is in that class, regardless of their respective experience and abilities.
There will always be other exhibitors with more advantages of one kind or another. As long as the exhibitors are entering classes for which they are eligible, there is no point worrying about it.
If you truly want to be proactive perhaps addressing your zone committee with adding a rule in your zone which is similar to other zones in regards to ‘no cross entry by riders/horses into AO and Adult hunter divisions at the same show’; might be another possible future solution?
The simple solution is for the show to combine classes & pin separately. That’s what they do here.
Until the middle schoolers are confident and competent enough to step into the Junior Hunters, sure! Then you end up with the same problem at smaller shows, where the A/Os run with the Junior Hunters half the time…
In seriousness, this is a good suggestion if the primary concern of the OP is the adult cross-entering between amateur divisions; @Peggy and others have pointed out that some zones do have a rule like this. But I’m not sure that it addresses the OP’s actual concern, which I read as being half about an experienced adult rider in a class combined with Children’s Hunters, and half about the optics problem of the experienced adult being married to a pro.