Scurry Racing http://www.bbc.co.uk/birmingham/content/image_galleries/scurry_racing_gallery.shtml
Single pony = driver only = no groom = ROLLOVER !
The carriages being used look smaller and lower than the typical pony pair marathon carriage. Is there any weight limit? Are these carriages just for scurry?
This may help;http://www.scurrydrivers.co.uk/
http://www.scurryponies.org/
http://www.paardenkoets.nl/index.php?page=119#sec482
video P&K 2007 http://video.aol.com/video-detail/scurry-driving-paard-and-koets-17-november-2007/2146579404
What type of carriage is used?
Bellcrown, Hartland and Phoenix Carriages build specially designed Scurry Carriages. Some competitor’s with an engineering background actually build their own vehicles. A Scurry carriage must not have wire spokes or pneumatic tyres. Most competitors use v shaped steel wheels at the rear to help with grip and prevent the back of the carriage sliding. Delayed steering is not allowed.
Scurry teams are now starting to opt for a more appealing appearance by choosing more brightly coloured carriages with co-coordinating attire.
http://www.bellcrowncarriagesusa.com/
http://www.hartlandcarriages.co.uk
[QUOTE=Equ
LOL
Leia
OK ???
I’m getting something here. The P&K video is detailed enough that I can figure out the course. Seems pretty simple but I don’t see what I would consider a complex hazard. Is that because its sort of a demo or is there some other reason there is nothing more complex than that reversal thru gates 4 and five in the far left corner?
Any idea what the dimensions of that arena are?
I can set this course in a jiffy. Guess I better shut up and drive.
Dick
[QUOTE=MSP;3637010]
So there is no good reason for Scurry being pairs only? [/QUOTE] Yes. Its about SPEED. It tests ponies SPEED. The vehicles are purpose built for SPEED. There’s a driver and a groom to be taken round a tight course at SPEED, so extremely tight turns at SPEED. Do that with a small single pony at SPEED and with a driver only and you’d likely have a nackered or dead pony and a tipped up carriage.
Of course you could use a horse, you could use a 2 wheeler carriage, you could use a different sort of cariage, you could do whatever the heck you want but it then wouldn’t be a sport for PONIES to test their SPEED. It would not be the same as British Scurry Driving, it would be something else.
Oh, I doubt very much I will be organizing anything, I have no free time.
So I’ll take it that you’ll have no time to organise anything or to train a scurry pony or indeed a pair of them and so you’re just asking why the rules are as they are and why they can’t be changed to be contradictory. Must be an American thing
Seems though from Tandem’s helpful posting that you don’t need to bother inventing something else or bemoaning why British Scurry driving isn’t in a 3 wheeler carriage with a St Bernard Dog or whatever. There’s already something going that’s along the lines you want… If you ever have time to do it. 
But some day when I have time it would be fun to try it. Any event that requires a team is simply out of the question for me. I ride alone and I drive alone.
In the UK, there’s no competitive driving that you do alone. It’s considered to be dangerous and bad practice and so not permitted anywhere on a show ground and as such it even invalidates any insurance you might have. Even when pleasure driving.
You remind me so much of my grandmother, I guess its a Scottish thing!
May well be true for your Grandmother but that has nothing to do with me.
I’m not Scottish!
[QUOTE=Ashemont;3637214]
The carriages being used look smaller and lower than the typical pony pair marathon carriage. Is there any weight limit? Are these carriages just for scurry?[/QUOTE] They are indeed purpose built and different from the marathon phase vehicle.
All vehicles must:
A) Be equipped with four wheels;
B) Be fitted with a working brake;
C) Not use wire-spoked wheels;
D) Not use pneumatic tyres;
E) Not have delayed steering;
F) Have a minimum front axle track of 130cm;
G) Have a rear axle. This may be shorter than the front axle, but not by more than 50cm; and
H) Be clean and safe.
Yup yup
I think I saw that the groom/navigator is to be SEATED as well rather than standing on a backstep.
Thomas, could you take a shot at defining that “complex hazard” for me? I found a site that said it could be U, or L, or even Z shaped yet I didn’t see anything like that in the Praad & Hoets video. somwhere I saw a fuzzy video that appeared to have a bridge down at the far end of the arena.
Thank you
Dick
OK
I found the video of Amanda and the spotted ponies at HOY 2008. That is clear enough that I can pretty well figure out the course.
I can see the U shape complex hazard in both that video and one from the 2007 HOY.
I HAVE A SCURRY COURSE ON PAPER. YESSSS!!!
That HOY arena looks sort of bigger than my 100 by 200 foot outdoor. My next choice is what I call the jump field which is about 150 by 300 feet.
Dick
Thomas,
Maybe if your view of the world wasn’t looking down you could see what I was asking is why couldn’t you run a course similar to a scurry course with a single pony in a 2 wheel cart, that is no person hanging from the back! I asked because I was curious of what modification might need to happen to make that safe. An answer like “the course is too tight for a two wheel cart” or something equally constructive would have been what I was looking for.
The time would be slower I imagine but then it would truly test the speed of an individual pony wouldn’t it? After all they have CDE’s for VSE in similar circumstances. Frankly, I never though ponies were that fragile, mine certainly doesn’t appear to be fragile not the way she can move steel fence panels and snap steel joints. Necessity is the mother of invention and I guess if we were all like you we could just stick to “how it’s always been done” and never invent any thing new.
My purpose for asking is because I hope some day to have the time and I will keep events like this in mind. However, the way things are now and the fact that they are getting worse by the second the odds are I can never count on being capable of spending thousands on pairs and fancy specialty made vehicles just for a weekend of entertainment.
[QUOTE=MSP;3642731]
Thomas,
Maybe if your view of the world wasn’t looking down you could see what I was asking is why couldn’t you run a course similar to a scurry course with a single pony in a 2 wheel cart, that is no person hanging from the back! .[/QUOTE] I might suggest that if you take your head from up your backside that you’d see I replied.
I asked because I was curious of what modification might need to happen to make that safe. An answer like “the course is too tight for a two wheel cart” or something equally constructive would have been what I was looking for.
Tell you what. Next time you ask a question and know what answer you want, just tell folks what you want them to say and save them replying!
The time would be slower I imagine but then it would truly test the speed of an individual pony wouldn’t it?
And it wouldn’t be scurrying!
After all they have CDE’s for VSE in similar circumstances.
Clearly you have a totally different experience of Horse Driving Trials to what I have. Scurry driving is NOT, NO WAY, the remotest bit like any of the phases in HDT. (Apart from the fact there’s a harness horse and some cones in there somewhere!)
F
rankly, I never though ponies were that fragile, mine certainly doesn’t appear to be fragile not the way she can move steel fence panels and snap steel joints.
Who said ponies were fragile?
Necessity is the mother of invention and I guess if we were all like you we could just stick to “how it’s always been done” and never invent any thing new.
No sh** Sherlock!
My purpose for asking is because I hope some day to have the time and I will keep events like this in mind. However, the way things are now and the fact that they are getting worse by the second the odds are I can never count on being capable of spending thousands on pairs and fancy specialty made vehicles just for a weekend of entertainment
So what? I’ve never been able to understand why you would change a whole sport just because someone can’t do it.
I think you can’t distinguish the difference between “changing a whole sport” and inventing a new one based on an existing sport so more people can participate!
BTW, how come you didn’t get all over Tandem when he hosted just such an event?
^ Why should I ???
AND ???
Thomas while you are jousting back and forth with those that immediately want to change the rules to suit their individual situation I still don’t know how big a scurry field usually is. Big as a soccer field or what?
Thanks
Dick
Complete rules for OSG http://www.osborne-ref.co.uk/osg/OSBORNE%20SCURRY%20GROUP%20RULES%20(2006).doc
Course sizes would vary with venues. As Competitions are routinely held at shows - think more like “jumping arena” sizes.
[QUOTE=kearleydk;3649705]
Thomas while you are jousting back and forth with those that immediately want to change the rules to suit their individual situation I still don’t know how big a scurry field usually is. Big as a soccer field or what?
Thanks
Dick[/QUOTE] It may be that I got confused between those who want to know about Scurrying and those who want to change it to something else :winkgrin:
I did post the rules earlier though its not explicit what the course size is other than stating number of obstacles.
The actual area the course covers varies but think of a large jumping arena at a show field and that’s it.
thanks Thomas
The more you know the more you know you don’t know. One question leads to another.
I get the impression that scurry has a major “demonstration” aspect to it. Teams are known well in advance and maybe it’s a club sort of thing where the competition is within the club rather than open to anybody.
Is this impression correct?
On the up side, I have a course set and will test it out today.
Two of my drivers will be running single ponies but you have to run what is available. The carriage most appropriate for scurry does not currently have a pole. We only got the carriage yesterday so give me a bit to get a pole on it.
My course is not just a flat playing field. It has a mound in the middle as well as a couple of interesting humps and a pond at one end. Ponies might catch some air over the mound as I set gate #5 right on top of it with a rather long approach.
Thanks again.
Dick
It looks like the closest thing we have to scurrying here is the pony chuck wagon races. We also have cutter racing that is similar but no obstacles. Think pair flat track racing. It can still be a rush to see a pair of running QH or TB’s going all out on a track. Very intense. Lf
So I am killing some time waiting for bath time for the kids and I pick up one of my old driving books. I have them stacked in the kitchen for reading with my morning coffee.
Show Driving Explained by Marylian Watney and William Kenward
First published in Great Britain in 1978
I come to page 45 and see this:
Scurry driving
Scurry driving is a recent innovation in the British show ring, and is the ‘show jumping’ of driving – the object being to pass through a series of obstacles at speed, faults being incurred when obstacles are touched, and by time. Classes are open to both singles and pairs, and all types of horses and ponies in every type of vehicle are eligible to compete, as they are judge purely on performance. In some British competitions, the horse is expected to be both ridden and jumped as well as driven, and while these competitions are exciting spectacles for the public, they do not promote the elegant style of driving seen in other classes.
Here is the book
http://www.antiqbook.co.uk/boox/pilgri/004006.shtml
http://www.amazon.com/Show-driving-explained-Horsemans-handbook/dp/0668043849
So! Lets take this in! One more time:
Classes are open to both singles and pairs, and all types of horses and ponies in every type of vehicle are eligible to compete, as they are judge purely on performance.
Seems that some where along the years since 1978 Scurry has changed. So I suppose a purest or some one wanting to have a REAL Scurry competition could go back to this explanation and what appears to be very simple rules.
And perhaps the motivation for changing Scurry from its original form was because of attitudes like the author :
…while these competitions are exciting spectacles for the public, they do not promote the elegant style of driving seen in other classes.
Mighty interesting, don’t you love old books!
So for anyone wanting to have a Scurry looks like you can call it a Scurry or maybe Original or Classic Scurry would better suite a truly open competition including…
both singles and pairs, and all types of horses and ponies in every type of vehicle are eligible to compete
So yes I did learn a lot about Scurry! I learned Scurry IS for a single pony in a two wheel cart if I would like!
Seems that some people on this thread would have know this, assuming they are at least as old as me and were driving back in the 70’s when I was driving, and being British would have know this!
[QUOTE=LostFarmer;3654848]
It looks like the closest thing we have to scurrying here is the pony chuck wagon races. [/QUOTE] You’re actually very right saying that and indeed its often mentioned here that in the USA they have chuck wagon racing which is sort of similarish.
We also have cutter racing that is similar but no obstacles. Think pair flat track racing. It can still be a rush to see a pair of running QH or TB’s going all out on a track. Very intense. Lf
Sounds great fun.
