I’m just wondering whether you experienced trainers out there in BB Land find it more difficult to teach/train children or adults.
In asking this question, I realize that I have to place adolescents in a category of their own - do you find teens easier or more difficult to teach/train that either adults or children?
“as an employer I expect the employees to adjust to my whims and fancies”
I would not like to define a student/teacher relationship this way. I am aware that this makes me naive and unrealistic as far as being a pro, which is why I will keep my “day job” and teach a little on the side for fun.
There are many times in the course of a true learning experience when the teacher needs to rattle the cage a little bit. For example, to ask you to ride a horse you don’t like–until you discover the reason you didn’t like the horse was that you hadn’t quite gotten him figured out yet. Or to keep pulling the d****d stirrups off the saddle even though you dislike it intensely, until the next course you jump you realize your leg is more solid than it was yesterday. The list goes on and on.
Yes, a teacher should be able to explain WHY, but a great deal of that explanation should lie in the results, not the verbiage. Save the lengthy discussion for the drink you buy your long-suffering trainer AFTER the lesson; during the lesson do her the courtesy of making a 100% effort to focus on the task at hand. You just might learn something.
I hate them all…LOL. No I find younger kids are very brave with little fear and greater confidence. The lack of failure and pain in their life is a plus. The teen-agers are good too because most of the ones I teach are focused on goals and how to get there. The harder ones for me are the adults. Between forgettng what day it is ( forgive me Inverness I think that was one of YOUR excuses for missing a lesson!!) or having a lack of confidence in themselves.
I have a few ladies right now who are very successful business women,who once they mount up can’t make a decision (NOT Inverness). If the horse walks to the center of the ring they let him. If it won’t trot/canter it’s ok. I have started telling these ladies I am going to charge for TWO lessions from now on. One will be Assertive Management on Horseback and the other will be the actual lesson. These two ladies could make Donald Trump cringe in a board room. But they are so out of there element I have to start with real beginner basics. I do enjoy my adults very much, but I think it’s always harder for adults than kids. We adults know our own mortality. If we fall and get hurt, we are the only ones to take care of us. If Pumpkin falls Mom/Dad will take care of them until all is better. But no matter what group, if a person is eager to learn that is such a joy to teach.
“. . .if a person is eager to learn that is such a joy to teach.”
What a nice thought KS, you must be a great instructor.
I don’t teach riding, but I do teach swimming (everything from water babies to adult) and other physical activities. Its clear thatadults and children do have different learning styles, (as everyone has noted) so there are challenges with each. I like teaching both for the sake of variety.
One of the things that’s nice about adults is they do want to know why, so its nice to be able to discuss & explain. This can be helpful for the adult learner. Of course there is a big difference between wanting to know why and “overanalyzing.”
My exerperience as riding studen has really helped me be a better teacher because I can relate to the challenges an adult learner faces. On the other hand, there are times that being a teacher has helped me be a better student since I relate to what an instructor is trying to do and know what student behaviors can be difficult to deal with.
Interesting topic!
I prefer teaching kids rather than adults. I have taught a few adults for like filling in, and I mean seeing as I am only 17, I bet you can see why 
With the little kids its fun because you know you can jump around & do fun stuff like that! The little little kids don’t have much of an attention span, but they are fun to teach though because like i said earlier you can have fun. I am lucky to have a good group of kids (well the majority of them) You know how that always goes! So there ya go, there is my ramblin for the day! HeHe, talk to you all later!
~Tracey~
I prefer teaching adults. The adults I’ve given lessons to were consistently receptive to learning and able to understand the mechanics and philospohy of what they’re doing; they are also more willing to ask for clarification and more in-depth understanding. In that respect, adults challenge me more, and that makes a lesson more fun for me. The adults I’ve had have valued their lesson time more than the kids, since the lesson fee came out of their own wallets, not their parents’.
I’m not much of a kid person, which is obviously a big part of my adult preference. Which is not to say that I don’t like teaching kids - when I have a child student who posesses an age-appropriate attention span and a love of riding, I have a great time. Maybe it’s the particular group of kids I have contact with, but several of them seem to be riding more out of an interest in the social opportunities than out of a desire to learn about horses. I rarely see that motivation in adult learners, and I am generally bored by a student who is more concerned about chatting with the others in the lesson than with actually riding.
I think the qualities I like in a student include a willingness to try new things, ability to listen and follow directions, a love of horses and riding, motivation to practice between lessons, a long-term view of goals and progress, and a willingness to stop and ask for help when needed. Needless to say, I have found these things both in kids and adults.
and there is yet another Monday holiday coming up next week.
I think the instructors who prefer teaching children over adults are being rather hard on us ‘mature types.’ When I rode as a teenager, I was more bold and pretty athletic. Now, although I carry on a fitnes regime that includes jogging, NordicTrak sessions with stretching, situps and some weightlifting, I do not have the SWIFT REACTION time that I had when I was a youngster! Reaction time is important, even when you are setting yourself up and planning where your transitions will be, for riding sharp turns around a course of jumps, or lengthening and shortening strides through gridwork! I don’t chat endlessly to my instructor, but do like to ask what I did well in the lesson and what I need to work on for the next time.
I love teaching the kids because they for the most part are like sponges. You tell them to put their heels down once and they maintain that the whole lesson (at least most of mine do). You can keep yourself amused by mixing it up.
I usually break my kid group lessons into thirds. First 1/3 we warm-up and they get tortured as a group. Walk trot canter, lots of changes of direction, work with no stirrups, half seat, lengthen shorten etc…work up a good sweat.
Second third is learning something technical with the how and whys very much included…i.e. correct turn on the forehand, leg-yield, counter canter, figures etc. or over jumps…how to ride a bending line in 4,5,or 6 strides by changing the track or how to get in deep and why, or learning how to do a walk jump, etc.
Last third putting up a challenge…so who can ride this jump course and get the long five there and the short seven over there? or who can jump the scary narrow the first time through with no run out? Makes it fun.
Adults are more challenging to me because they tend to get stuck and do not seem to develop that sense of feel if they haven’t been riding forever. I have two who have inflated egos and wonder why I tell them not to practice the sitting trot or canter unless they are on the longe line (jerk, jerk, jerk on the mouth, bounce, bounce, bounce on the back. Ugh) One lady is sweet as can be but treats the horse like a cross between a cuddly kitten and a being that has human feelings and reasoning abilities “Icon is jealous of all the other horses with long tails so I bought him a tail bag and a bag of peppermints”. I love teaching the technical side of riding but overall it is many times rewarding to say to the riders just go do it and stop thinking about it so much!
with everything that’s been said here, one area not touched on that can make children challenging for some isntructors is the old attention span.
If you can do privates, its not such a big deal, but at some point most kids and parents want group lessons, and that’s when the attention span (or lack thereof) can really come into play (whipping your head around constantly to make sure everybody is “still with you” can cause a lot of whiplash, LOL). I often find though the horses/ponies themselves are the best “reminders” for paying attention. Kid zones off and pony stops dead, runs to the middle, runs into the pony in front of it (causing much kicking and squealing), or with some of the more well-humored equines, kid get scraped off on a fence or tree. Kid learns to “stay focused” very quickly.
All previous posts contain much wisdom and accuracy. Children seem more able to take instruction without blockading you, and are much more trusting on the whole than adults.
I have found that teaching adult men beginners is generally another cup of tea altogether. While you do have to really try not to humiliate them (if you want them to keep coming back, that is), I have found that men are much less fearful and more ambitious (in the short run, anyway) than women. Beginners, I’m talking. Women beginners might ride for years and years and progress to a sophisticated level and become serious, dedicated riders; but a man is much more likely to be showing A/A jumpers inside a year.
As far as personal preference for teaching? I will teach any one on earth as long as they want to learn. Child or Adult, a little motivation goes a long, long ways in my book and makes up for any physical or mental challenges.
I read somewhere that one of the biggiest differences in teaching adults vrs. kids is that asults tend to ask ‘why?’ where as kids tend to ask “how?” (this extends past teaching riding into everyday life). This is not to say that a trainer doesn’t have the answer to either or both the the question (though i have personly had to leave a trainer who couldn’t tell me why half the time, she would responsed “becuase that is how you do it” when i would ask why we were doing something one way when it wasn’t working… another story.) In any case, i think that is really true- kids and adults learn much diffrently becuase adults have other experiances to get in the way.
I hadn’t thought about emotions getting in the way untill i read some of the other posts, but i think that is really true. I am only 18, but i know sometimes i pose extra… complications becuase i have fears and emotions and probally more ‘bad days’ that little kids. Also, i think my age group is somewhat difficult becuase you are sort of inbetween- you are asking both why and how, which can be too much for some trainers. Plus, at my age, you get this akward thing happening with your ‘trainer’- becuase you are close enough to be friends but at the same time too far to be really friends, too much is diffrent in your life yet i think more like an adult so i easily relate in that way. It is an added challenge which the student must deal with (or maybe i am the only one who has that problem). But whoever said adults tend to be more chit-chaty, that is sort of right- but i think it is more that adults want to talk to the trainer, where as the kids talk amougst themselves…
All of this in my humble opinion. 
I definatly would teach children or men over ladies any day. For some strange reason, and here I am talking about beginer ladies, they always think they have to analyse everything. They seem to think that there is a reason for every single thing a horse does. Why did he move his ear? I think he is in a bad mood, he stomped his foot! They don’t seem to realise that horses are animals, not cars! Generalising here.
I think that many trainers learned as kids, by feel. So, when faced with someone (an adult) who wants to know “Why”, the trainer can’t tell them because they never learned “why”! They never needed to know “why”, they just did it.
I rely on books these days to tell me why, because my trainer can’t. This month I’m reading Mary Wanless, who is helping me integrate feeling into my riding while satisfying my need to know.
Summarized (very summarized don’t kill me):
little girls. Basically the ideal student, except they have no sense of humour and have to be told often that it is supposed to be FUN. Insanely competitive. Cute barn animals likely to be tortured to within inches of their lives.
little boys. Also great and take life less seriously, often you have to be very careful not to scare them or they will quit- reason given is invariably “I’m not interested in horses anymore now that I’m 7/8/12 etc” which translates to “I fell off and I never want to jump 18”/2’ again so I quit".
Teenagers. Either absolutely fabulous or lunatics. Often both at the same time. They are without a doubt the most focused, least devious group. Very useful for braiding, organizing your tack trunk, polishing underside of trailer and other anal tasks. Ironically will often be unable to locate saddle in chaos of own tack trunk. CHECK EVERYTHING they pack for a show. Twice.
older teenagers:
The tweeners. Ideal age to ride babies and greenies. Will not expect too much of young horse but will devote hours to them. All young horses should be ridden by (supervised) 19 year olds as they relate better and none of them have any sense anyway.
beginner adults.
men: usually good fun and fairly committed to riding before they show up to the first lesson. Makes them quick studies. Often suicidally brave in direct contrast to their sons. Have to be restrained from scaring the life out of afore-mentioned sons by pointing to the junior jumper ring and saying “you think Merrylegs could jump that?”
women: more likely to be dabbling. Paranoid fear of doing the littlest thing wrong, will asuume horse spooked b/c it dislikes the way they groomed it, when it actually heard the feed cart coming. New motto: “just do something!!”- would prefer to discuss everything with you ad nauseum. Will they or won’t they show up style is often irritating. Extreme necessity to match them with a horse they trust, often a plug/nuthead, at which point they will relax out of all proportion to their actual level of safety and begin to learn.
seniors: my favorite people in the world. Often come in pairs. Find everything fascinating and amusing and tell the best jokes. Beloved by all lesson horses and most teenagers. Youth is truly wasted on the young.
dedicated amateurs of all sorts.
The backbone of any barn. The most sought after will bring donuts on Saturdays, know the best blanket repair place in the state, the best motels and the best Mexican restaurant anywhere you go and possess the only boot-polishing kit or safety-pins at the show. Great fun, I especially like to teach people basic new stuff, like dressage, eventing or jumpers for hunter riders and vice versa. Especially to college students or long-time horsepeople. I talk a lot to these people and get pretty technical then give them time to figure it out on their own. Compare it to jamming in a band- you all know the theory, you just need to show them some new chords. Can awe any teenager with incredibly devious and creative excuses to not do stuff. Conversely often much too hard on themselves and their horses. “This horse will never do a decent piaffe!!!” -“Well, um, he’s only three”. Usually can make killer margaritas.
Arrrk, I can’t spell. As to why I am up at this hour a) I’m still on vacation sort of, OK I am doing a training class for work but it’s silly and b) I have a nasty flu/cough and the medicine I am taking makes me go asleep at 6pm and then wake up at 1 am. Very annoying.
[This message was edited by letsgo on Jan. 10, 2001 at 07:26 AM.]
In the case of beginner adults vs. beginner kids, I find that kids don’t usually mind the rate at which they progress while some adults feel that they should be posting around like a pro in a couple of weeks and showing in a couple of months. If you are only riding once a week, regardless of how athletic you are, it can take a while to get a hang of it all! Of course at the same time, these adults have more of a work ethic than my kids. So for beginners, I personally prefer 12 to 16 y.o.s anyday as they probably really want to do this, work hard at it, and aren’t afraid or over analytical. But for experienced riders, I’d take a whole barn full of working ammies over kids any day!!
Janet of course you are entitled to know why. And I hope I give a clear understanding of what we are working on and the overall project.
But I have known people to over analyze every stinking step the horse takes. And think that because I said do something now, that means we will do it the same way forever. Not so. Some times you just have to KICK HIM AND MAKE HIM GO FORWARD. Then fine tune the project. And tomorrow, since the horse has nerves and mind of his own, we may have to approach it from a different angle.
I swear some ride with GM’s book or Kyra Kyrkland’s in their back pocket, and if given the chance would like to turn to page 42 and discuss it.
You just have to trust the person in the middle of the arena, and do everything you can to “try” to do what they are saying at that very minute.
As someone said it is a lot of feel, and try as we may it is hard to convey that. Question yes, but only after trying and trying and trying.
I take my five yr old on the pony lesson anyday over the beginning jumping ladies. One took four lessons, figured she knew enough to do it on her own, When questioned, she told me, “She didn’t want to be dependent on me”. On gasp a green Ayrab mind you. ARRRGGHHH. 
I won’t jump a stick without ground help. But that is how “I” was taught.
[This message was edited by Cactuskate on Jan. 09, 2001 at 06:58 PM.]
First of all, LetsGo, that was hysterical (and at least partly accurate!undefined.
As to the adults who ask why:
I teach children and adults… and yes, the adults tend to be more interested in theory. Your teacher MUST be able to explain the WHY! There are some very good riders out there, who ride mostly by feel and may not have a clue as to WHY, but that makes them poor teachers. Especially when dealing with adult beginners who probably don’t have the same “feel” that kids can develop, the why is very important.
However, unless you are in a private lesson (then you should get as much “why” discussion as you want), teachers are sometimes reluctant to discuss the why ad nauseum for legitimate reasons. It’s not that we don’t care about your understanding, or can’t explain it… but SOME adults want to stop riding every 30 seconds to talk about it! I find this absolutely maddening when I’m teaching. The reason is this: There are times, when it is a better teaching technique IMHO, to work through the problem, and keep the work going. Some problems are better addressed by really sticking with it, and working working working,…i.e., a little more leg, NOW, too much right rein, a little more bend, a little more this, a little more THAT. As a teacher, I can SEE what is happening sometime before the student knows it is happening.
It doesn’t mean that you can’t discuss it… it’s not uncommon for me to have a student adjust, adjust, adjust,… then, when she finally gets it, we stop and talk about it. Sometimes it’s easier when they’ve FELT the mistakes, AND getting is RIGHT, to then compare the two in the discussion. E.g., Did you feel how when he drifted left in that corner, that you had him over bent to the right? And then when you did X he stopped drifting? This happens BECAUSE… Especially if you are in a semi-private or group lesson,… you need to be considerate of the other students’ desire to RIDE, and not stand in the middle of the ring discussing Kafka.
All age groups pose their own issues… I defer to LetsGo!
I’m just wondering whether you experienced trainers out there in BB Land find it more difficult to teach/train children or adults.
In asking this question, I realize that I have to place adolescents in a category of their own - do you find teens easier or more difficult to teach/train that either adults or children?
Having taught all three categories, I agree with Kennet Square, but with one caveat.
The difficulty with teaching adults, IMHO, is that they want to know WHY. They try to delve a TECHNICAL knowledge out of something that works largely by feel. Kids on the other hand rarely ask why, they just do until it starts to “feel right” to them.
MOST importantly, adults are worried about making mistakes, getting hurt or looking stupid, while kids are only somewhat aware and are generally speaking MUCH less self-concious and more open to making mistakes in order to get better.
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