Tennessee Walking Horse Soring Issue *Update post 1*

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=hurleycane;6865107]
It was a disappointment to me that Hannah was in the video to support the stacked horse venue and Inman’s comments. I had her in the same ball park as Nate -which is in the same show ring but none the less non-supportive of the stacked horse.

It is a valid place to be IMO.[/QUOTE]

I’m just wondering, and I’m not trying to bash you on this, sunridge, I’m serious. I’m curious to know why you think this.

To explain where I come from, I see it is they go to these shows and they give money to be in the classes, and many times because of who they are they aren’t even awarded a ribbon (I’m sure this is probably the case with the Jacksons). So they’ve just given away their time and money to show with people who are just going to go home and sore more horses. I don’t really see that as a good place to be. I’d rather see people like them support sound horse shows rather than fraternize with the enemy. We all know that money is what keeps them going–why continue to give it to them? When the money dries up, the soring will stop. (Hence Mike Inman’s whining on the video.)

The enemy doesn’t like a sound, natural horse–they WANT the artificial gait and enjoy watching it. A horse that isn’t sored usually isn’t “doing enough” to them. So it’s nothing but a losing situation for sound horse people.

So, I just wanted to know the logic behind why you think this is an okay place to be. That’s all–just want to learn others’ opinions!

Oh, and I agree that Hannah is not a “natural” trainer. Otherwise she wouldn’t use so many gadgets. She also needs to SIT UP for crying out loud–drives me nuts that she can’t sit a horse properly.

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=The Preacher;6865236]
I did not like that someone here for less than 60 days themselves telling someone else that they were basically not welcomed here., or they should not express themselves in the way that they had and degrading them by being what I saw as disrespectful.[/QUOTE]

You know, because someone who has been posting on COTH for less than 60 days MUST not know anything, never mind that that someone has over 12 years in this fight.

I see what you’re doing, Nate. Putting down others to make yourself look better. Please, for the love of God, LEAVE ME ALONE.

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=Fairfax;6865541]
I do not know about the TWH however. The stack does seem to impact however the issue is SORING…Question: IF a TWH was put into stacks and NOT sored…no chains etc…would he/she still be able to move in that extreme manner?[/QUOTE]

Actually, they might have the same lift, but they would NOT be crouching and marching behind like they do now. They would be driving up underneath themselves, not marching and fighting to get away from the pain. (This information comes from discussions with people who used to sore horses.)

[FortheTWH]

It turns out this invitation only meeting by the TWHBEA is not going to happen. People complained so they canceled the meeting.

[sunridge1]

I think you may have meant to quote me not hurley? If you are addressing me, the specialization of most every breed has reached critical proportions IMO. They are breeding for a specific phenotype that largely doesn’t exist except for a few freaks. All the while forgetting about the rest of the animal. A trend is established and before you know it, the gene pool is corrupt with single copy carriers of a mutation that really IS bad and that may never be eradicated. That is worst case scenario. Or you just plain breed out the genetics that made them what they once were to begin with. I see this across many different breeds in this country.

[gogaitedgo]

[QUOTE=Shansurri;6867869]
There are abuses in all equine environments. I see abuse on the trails, at shows, and yes… at people’s private barns. Of the three I listed, there is one place where people NOTICE the abuse, and that is at a show. Much better, IMO, for abuse to show up at a show where it can be officially decried and specifically ruled against, than to let it quietly build on trails and in the barns of people with no one around to take them to task.

Can show rings perpetuate abusive practices? Of course. But they don’t HAVE to. There are plenty of breed organizations that manage to showcase their animals without hurting them.[/QUOTE]

Can you name one?

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=Guilherme;6866918]
I’m not a fan of rail classes. IMO they reward enhanced artificiality no matter the breed or discipline.[/QUOTE]

I’ve gotten to where I don’t like rail classes for this exact reason, Guilherme.

[CFFarm]

[QUOTE=FortheTWH;6869624]
I’ve gotten to where I don’t like rail classes for this exact reason, Guilherme.[/QUOTE]

Add me in once you get past lead line. I’m afraid it’s the human factor. I mean they just passed a rule that dogs showing at Westminster can’t have plastic surgery for goodness sake.

[Guilherme]

[QUOTE=gogaitedgo;6869301]
Can you name one?[/QUOTE]

Rollkur?

G.

[hurleycane]

Hey - I think the discussion is falling off into a tangent of no return.

Think about it and answer me this - what endeavor have humans EVER been involved in where there is not some “evil” “cheating” “accusations” “malcontents” etc etc? Specially where there is judging.

Zip. Zero. Nada. None.

So it is a moot point, no?

Our only saving grace in any worthwhile endeavor is the ability to critique and reexamine the world we live in and the purpose we feel we serve best.

So I think when it comes to horsemanship through the ages and as it affects the shown horse, folks on this thread should be able to consider the big picture. ANd for me - boring as a roundy round may be for some - I sure had a blast when I was very active in the roundy round ASB shows. And so did the horses.

Get your blinkers off! There really is a lot of good going on at roundy rounds and both in the preparation for them and at the actual events.

[gogaitedgo]

[QUOTE=Guilherme;6869758]
Rollkur?

G.[/QUOTE]

They banned rollkur? How long did that take? Are they enforcing it? And the fact that it existed proves my point yet again.

[gogaitedgo]

[QUOTE=hurleycane;6869809]
Hey - I think the discussion is falling off into a tangent of no return.

Think about it and answer me this - what endeavor have humans EVER been involved in where there is not some “evil” “cheating” “accusations” “malcontents” etc etc? Specially where there is judging.

Zip. Zero. Nada. None.

So it is a moot point, no?

Our only saving grace in any worthwhile endeavor is the ability to critique and reexamine the world we live in and the purpose we feel we serve best.

So I think when it comes to horsemanship through the ages and as it affects the shown horse, folks on this thread should be able to consider the big picture. ANd for me - boring as a roundy round may be for some - I sure had a blast when I was very active in the roundy round ASB shows. And so did the horses.

Get your blinkers off! There really is a lot of good going on at roundy rounds and both in the preparation for them and at the actual events.[/QUOTE]

When animals are being tortured so people can go roundy round, it is NOT a moot point. I’m not the one with blinkers on.

[Guilherme]

[QUOTE=gogaitedgo;6870956]
They banned rollkur? How long did that take? Are they enforcing it? And the fact that it existed proves my point yet again.[/QUOTE]

I’m not sure what your point is.

G.

[anon68314200]

@Guilherme;6866918

I’m reminded that a great, American philosopher, Morticia Addams, once observed “what is normal for the spider is chaos for the fly.”

Or, put another way, what you see often depends on where you stand.

OOooh, I love that. May I steal for my signature?

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=CFFarm;6869719]
Add me in once you get past lead line. I’m afraid it’s the human factor. I mean they just passed a rule that dogs showing at Westminster can’t have plastic surgery for goodness sake.[/QUOTE]

Shoot, I even see horses jacked up and all freaky in the lead line classes, especially with Arabs and ASBs. They aren’t going nutzo, but they are being “held” in the upside frame (ASBs) or their noses touching their chests (Arabs). It’s disgusting.

And don’t even get me started on dog shows…I will never ever EVER buy a dog because of the abuse and horrible breeding practices that go on in so many breeds. I still get sick to my stomach when I think about the RSPCA undercover video and Lily’s story. Rescue collies for me all the way!

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=FortheTWH;6868710]
It turns out this invitation only meeting by the TWHBEA is not going to happen. People complained so they canceled the meeting.[/QUOTE]

EDIT TO THIS: The meeting will be happening, it’s going to be on a different date and it is open to anyone to attend. Sorry about that–got the correct information today!

[hurleycane]

Oh boy. I do not mean to point out the obvious - but lordy we sure do have some people standing “on point” here. Kinda like a well bred hound. You just can not convince them that every rustling leaf is not a vermin and they are near impossible to call off.

And now I fully understand why they chose to step out to the isolating periphery of life- so they can stand and point. It is what they are bred to do.

Give me a break - all “heads up” horses are not tortured nor inverted. Some are just freaking exuberant. They are happy and full of life.

Down slow and low is not the only way a good horse will go. ANd hey! - when my geldings are out in the field romping playing and acting all jacked up for nothing - should I be looking in the leaves for the evil doers???

[hurleycane]

[QUOTE=FortheTWH;6871218]
EDIT TO THIS: The meeting will be happening, it’s going to be on a different date and it is open to anyone to attend. Sorry about that–got the correct information today![/QUOTE]

WHere? When? and Nate - are you going???

[aarpaso]

as I rushed to get feed in before the snow and sleet hits here later today,my thoughts keep going to this meeting of the twhbea.

what are they going to do really,talk about ways to avoid the Law (HPA). even the person running twhnc has violations.

check out how many of the board members of all the alphabet soup gangs have HPA violations.if you are not amazed.WELL its these people who want to slide past the LAW,like State Sen Webb of KY.

[FortheTWH]

[QUOTE=aarpaso;6872031]
as I rushed to get feed in before the snow and sleet hits here later today,my thoughts keep going to this meeting of the twhbea.

what are they going to do really,talk about ways to avoid the Law (HPA). even the person running twhnc has violations.

check out how many of the board members of all the alphabet soup gangs have HPA violations.if you are not amazed.WELL its these people who want to slide past the LAW,like State Sen Webb of KY.[/QUOTE]

Nah, they won’t talk about that now that it’s going to be an open meeting. It’ll just be SSDD…I just hope that members and non-members who go will stand up and say ENOUGH’S ENOUGH.