ANy of the saddleseat persuasion post any shoeing limits yet? Do they have shoeing limits? I think they do - just can not find it on line.
NO it mean He is blowing smoke for the press.
TWHBEA isn’t it the Tn walking horse breeders and EXHITORS Assoc.
that means this assoc has a responsbilty to govern the EXHITORS right or have i missed something. doesn’t the twhbea make the rule book.
when i was yes was a member they sent me a rulebook.rules of registery and rules of show.
this has changed?
[QUOTE=oliverreed;6332154]
So does this mean Mr. Howard has had a change of heart? He’s saying the abuse is rampant, and we all know that it is. Does this mean the Celebration is going to prohibit stacks and soring? I’m confused.[/QUOTE]
No, that was Nathaniel Jackson (thank you Preacher !) saying it was rampant.
From the above links Preacher posted, footage shows Howard saying the he could NOT smell chemicals in the many area barns he has visited. He also says there will always be (some)trainers who try to get away with soring.
This is from the other link Preacher posted:
'David Howard, a board member of Tennessee Walking Horse National Celebration, said "I was surprised, very surprised."Howard, an organizer of the $41-million dollar annual Walking Horse show in August, says most everyone in the industry expected McConnell to do hard time. While animal rights advocates say soring in a common practice Howard argues Tennessee’s Walking Horse community is safe and humane.
“I’m telling you, you’re never going to be able to eliminate everything in the industry, it’s the same thing in any sport, like why did Roger Clemons take drugs? Some people are going to cheat,” Howard said’.
So, Howard is denying there is a problem. Just because there is is a recommendation of probation, it will be up to the judge.
'While federal prosecutors are recommending McConnell get probation instead of prison for his plea it will be up to U.S. District Court Judge Sandy Mattice to decide the penalty during a sentencing hearing September 10 at 9:00 a.m.
Two other men who also entered guilty pleas Tuesday morning will also be sentenced that day.’
I think i am starting to understand this mess. The 52 counts were mostly about soring from the undercover footage which is not against the law according to the HPA because it took place at a private barn, NOT while horses were being transported or shown. I think it is important that these acts were accepted as evidence, but i believe what got McConnell in trouble with the feds was Felony Conspiracy due to some paperwork. (Kinda like the big mafia figures in the past were taken down by IRS). So we do not have to feel bad about 52 counts being reduced to only one. I think the timing of the footage being released was to just get it entered into evidence and show the world who McConnell is.
If I have anything wrong - let me know. Im just trying to figure this out. McConnell is still facing cruelty charges in Fayette County in early June.
WITW -
It does not have to be done at a show:
The HPA is a Federal law that prohibits horses subjected to
a practice called soring from participating in shows,
sales, exhibitions, or auctions.
But isnt it still okay to do whatever you want to a horse on your own farm ? The HPA spells out that a sored animal cannot be transported or entered in shows, etc. The HPA is specific about what constitutes soring. The sorers do most of the prep work at private barns. They are not being as cavalier about doing it in public as they used to be.
If the intended use of the horse is to show, and you sore at home you are in violation of an impotent law. Yes impotent.
I would think that the HPA covers transporting and showing animals…but…each state’s local cruelty laws cover what you do to your animals on your property.
And all states disallow “torturing” which is defined as:
“Torture” means every act, omission, or neglect whereby unreasonable physical pain, suffering, or death is caused or permitted, but nothing in this part shall be construed as prohibiting the shooting of birds or game for the purpose of human food.
So can’t the local animal cruelty laws be applied to that moron AFTER the HPA issue is decided?
Missed this link yesterday
Misty - McConnell is up for cruelty charges in Fayette County in early June.
“As a result of the video, McConnell and three others faced a 52-count federal indictment, accused of conspiring to violate the federal Horse Protection Act by knowingly transporting and entering sored horses into shows across the state from 2006 to 2011.”
So i was wrong a few posts back about thinking that counts were dropped because it was on private property. Were the counts dropped because of a plea and not because they were not valid ?
Im going back into a corner since its obvious i still dont have a grasp of the intricacies and i dont want to post innacuracies.
[QUOTE=hurleycane;6332180]
ANy of the saddleseat persuasion post any shoeing limits yet? Do they have shoeing limits? I think they do - just can not find it on line.[/QUOTE]
Look in the USEF rulebook. For example, shoeing requirements for Arabians is under Rule AR103. I didn’t check Morgan, Saddlebred, etc. but am sure they are there, if they exist.
Ahhh, makes sense. Thanks for the info WalkInTheWoods.
Let’s hope the judge does the right thing on that too.
Funny how the Big Lick folks are all hanging him out to dry now, huh? Tons of previous problems with him, re-instated numerous times. And still a stable full of clients. Show classes full of horses. Judges not ignoring him/his horses.
But let him get caught on camera and it’s all, “Oh, we WERE planning on getting rid of him next month! Yes, yes we were. Really.”
Does anyone ever believe that lame string of excuses?
I don’t know that anything short of the owner’s themselves policing their own ego, will ever work anywhere.
When Cleve Wells got in trouble with AQHA for that torn up training horse in his barn with broken jaw bones and sides chewed up by spur gouges full of infection…well, ‘everybody’ knew he was bad. And had known. I haven’t been involved in AQHA shows in 10+ years, but I knew he was bad. My vet is also an AQHA judge and said he never really understood how Zip’s Chocolate Chip’s owner could put him with Cleve, since ‘everyone knew’ how hard he was on horses, and he knew how much she truly ‘loved’ ZCC…musing that maybe ZCC was good enough as a WP horse that Cleve maybe didn’t have to do much. Money+horses+ego stroking horses: the horse always loses, every single time.
A zillion years ago I recall reading articles about Magnolia Missile, a top notch barrel horse, who fought a hoof injury, I think it was, on his way to the NFR one year. His farrier was on stand by to fly to any rodeo anywhere…and the horse was just about on round the clock care, so that ‘the horse didn’t miss his opportunity to win it all, which he’d worked so hard for, and deserved’- I can honestly remember being like 10 years old and thinking what? The horse doesn’t care. Lynn McKenzie cares. Go home, get healthy, come back next year.
It’s up to the owners. Period.
Currently, in the TWH show world: if one of my horses that I own gets a two footer/bilateral soring ticket… that horse is out, the trainer is out, and all of my other horses are out for that time period indicated by the ticket.
So, what SHOULD happen if a horse I own is ticketing for a two footer/bilateral soring? Remember…a single hoof COULD be a DQP with an agenda who doesn’t like me or my trainer…taking issue with a bonk the horse sustained stepping off the trainer, or a tender spot where the horse hauled beside him stepped on him in the trailer…one footers are potentially kinda bogus…A suspicious substance COULD be ingredients in Endure fly spray ( I am not making this up). A bilateral…IMO…while it could also be fly spray…a bilateral ticket is (IMO) really and truly the real deal soring ticket.
So, what SHOULD happen if a horse I own is ticketing for a two footer/bilateral soring?
[QUOTE=WalkInTheWoods;6332378]
“As a result of the video, McConnell and three others faced a 52-count federal indictment, accused of conspiring to violate the federal Horse Protection Act by knowingly transporting and entering sored horses into shows across the state from 2006 to 2011.”
So i was wrong a few posts back about thinking that counts were dropped because it was on private property. Were the counts dropped because of a plea and not because they were not valid ?
Im going back into a corner since its obvious i still dont have a grasp of the intricacies and i dont want to post innacuracies.[/QUOTE]
I believe they were dropped because of the plea.
Curious if anyone has contacted the University of Tennessee - don’t they traditionally have a TWH parade on the field at the homecoming football game? As a symbolic gesture, wonder if they could be pressured into using a sound horse instead of a big lick type?
Caffeinated, the bad guys sore flat shod horses too.
Here is great link to get us to the various HIOs. Im sure clicking around will get us to their rules and specs for shoeing, etc.
http://forthetnwalkinghorse.blogspot.com/2012/05/how-you-can-help-get-your-letters-out.html
HIOs
Send your emails to the all the major board members: president, vice president, committee leaders, etc. Or choose all of the email addresses…the more the merrier!
When writing to the HIOs, request that they ban McConnell the same way they banned Barney Davis. The HIOs immediately banned Barney Davis BEFORE he went to trial, but they have not banned McConnell. It’s clear who’s the money maker of the two for them.
Also, ask them to start putting together stronger penalties. Perhaps a 3 strikes and you’re out policy–three HPA violations (not rulebook violations) and you’re banned for life. Ask them to stop trying to placate the public and pretend these are isolated incidents and actually start working to end soring. We all know soring is the main way of “training” these horses–it’s high time it ended.
KYWHA - http://kywha.org/contact-us/
PRIDE - http://pridehio.com/wordpress/contact-us/ You can copy and paste all the email addresses into a single email.
SHOW - http://www.showhio.com/contactus.htm
SSHBEA - http://www.sshbea.org/contactus.html
WHOA - http://www.walkinghorseowners.com/about-whoa/ Scroll down to see the email addresses.
TWHBEA
Ask them to stop supporting the HPA violators and giving them high positions in their association. Ask for changes in the by laws that anyone who has violated the HPA more than twice is not eligible to be on the board or an officer for life. Ask that their Horse Protection Committee, which has HPA violators serving on it, to get active within the breed and actually protect the horse.
http://www.twhbea.com/contact.php
Executive Director - Ron Thomas, rthomas@twhbea.com, 931-359-0580
Executive Assistant - Diane White, dwhite@twhbea.com, 931-359-0581
President - Marty Irby, martyirby@msn.com, 615-796-5334, 931-233-0112
Senior Vice President - Margo Urad, murad@kandsins.com, 214-763-7379
Trainers Vice President - Wayne Dean, fredad@wildblue.net, 931-359-4808, 931-359-7326
Equine Welfare Vice President - Dr. Linda W. Montgomery, 615-210-4038
Find your local board representative on this page: http://www.twhbea.com/association/bod.php
The Celebration
Ask them to ban Big Lick classes.
http://twhnc.com/ email: twhnc@twhnc.com
Good Morning All,
I am new to this forum (or any forum) but I have a question/idea.
Bayou Bengal was good enough to post a partial list of sponsors along with facebook links. One of the links wasn’t working for me so I looked them up via Yahoo. Several hits popped up from sites similiar to the yellow pages. All of these sites allow and encourage reviews of the businesses they list. Would there be any benefit to posting comments about the sponsorship of the Celebration? Maybe if these businesses feel that association with the Big Lick will impact their profits they will be more willing to distance themselves. They can ignore or delete emails but might be more nervous about comments that are available for any and all to see. It probably won’t have that much impact but maybe falls under the 'couldn’t hurt/might help catagory?
Okay, heading back to my quiet little lurking closet now.
double post - see above
