Ok, the “unapproved” deal after editing a post is getting ridiculous - I’ll try again with 2 separate smaller posts:
E uptake? Do you mean the myth that vit E needs fat in order to be absorbed?
No, it’s an incorrect extrapolation from people to horses. It’s not even about oil. It’s about fat.
it’s bile that is needed for Vit E absorption. And in people, that release by the gall bladder, where bile is stored, is triggered by the presence of fat. Not oil - fat.
Horses don’t have gall bladders. They are trickle feeders, so bile is constantly produced. No fat, let alone oil, needed for E absorption
And this one https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10659301/
“In conclusion, no apparent adverse effects of feeding a diet supplemented with either an unsaturated or saturated vegetable oil for 6 months at approximately 20% DE after 10 months at approximately 12% DE were identified and there were no apparent disadvantages of feeding a saturated vegetable oil supplemented diet compared with an unsaturated one.”
Searching with “horse unsaturated fat pubmed” brings up lots and lots of studies you can sift through
that comment makes absolutely no sense in reply to my comment. I posted facts about oil and Vit E uptake. No correlation, no negative or positive relationship. That IS how fat is absorbed.
I don’t need to think about it. You said my post on facts about how E is absorbed wasn’t what you wanted, that you were looking for a negative correlation. If you quoted the wrong post I made, then it makes more sense.
Oil IS fat. All oil is fat, but not all fat is oil.
It doesn’t matter if you eat an avocado or nuts or have olive oil on your salad, it’s all fat, and all of it triggers the GB to release bile in people.
As I said, those questions were really just directed at the quoted person who confirmed she is an expert in the industry. At this point I am taking this into PM’s.
Forums really do have limitations. Regardless, I got some other good unrelated info. The work week is starting here soon so I will get answers to my original concerns.
Thanks everyone else for posting useful info also. You know who you are.
At this point (four pages in) I wouldn’t mind a Mod closing or deleting this thread. Not sure if they do that here. Thanks.
As I said, those questions were really just directed at the quoted person who confirmed she is an expert in the industry.
Ahhh, my bad, I didn’t realize ONLY the person you asked could reply :rolleyes:
I thought it MIGHT be helpful to provide you some facts about E and fats that anyone can learn, even if they aren’t an expert in the industry. It’s not like I just made that stuff up :rolleyes:
Actually, if you bothered to read anything, you would see Vit E IS addressed:
"If you take the non-commercial approach, then vitamin E should be added to the diet at a rate of 200-250 international units (IU) per cup of oil. This is very important, because higher-fat diets increase the horse’s requirements for antioxidant nutrients such as vitamin E. "
I don’t know why you’re asking about a negative correlation between oil (and why oil specifically, why not fat in general? Honest question, why do you feel there’s a difference?) and Vit E uptake, when a couple of people have pointed you towards credible sources that say you need MORE Vit E if you’re adding fat to the diet to help counter the side effects of additional free radicals from the fat.
You want a negative correlation? Here, I’ll make one - if you feed enough fat in the diet…wait, I can’t even make it up.
Additional fat doesn’t decrease E absorption. Adding more E doesn’t cause any decrease in fat absorption.
But if you read any of these cites, you’ll see oil is 100% digestible but not all fat sources are. Sooooo, someone could make a really poor correlation based on “I fed extra Vit E along with my rice bran, rice bran isn’t fully digestible, therefore it must be the E that’s causing that”, and that’s just horridly poor sciencing.
If you read and understand why adding more E in the face of adding more fat is a good thing, you would see there isn’t any negative correlation between the 2. I can’t even figure out if this is something you heard from someone, or just some random thought that popped into your head.
You asked:
Is there an inverse correlation between Vitamin E uptake and oil in diet that you know of?
If oil (any fat, of which oil is a subset) is required for Vit E to be absorbed, why do you think there’s any inverse relationship? Do you thing at some point, enough fat is going to lower E uptake? That’s making an assumption that fat goes around looking for E to help it get absorbed. It’s not even about the fat, it’s about the bile. There is no direct relationship between fat and E. There’s a middleman - bile. Vit E needs bile. It doesn’t need fat
Can you feed too much Vit E? Yes, and that can negatively affect absorption of certain nutrients, but fat isn’t one of them. It can impair bone remineralization, which implies some reduced uptake of some minerals.
Could you feed SO much oil that it causes diarrhea and therefore food is going through the system too fast, which means general nutrient absorption is lowered? Yes. But that’s nutrients in general, not Vit E specifically.
If that’s still not floating your boat, then I give up.
I fed oil years ago. I don’t have a horse that needs the calories anymore, but to be frank it is cheaper( prices have gone way up) easier and just as beneficial to feed whole flax to my horses now.
This actually is much closer, thanks. Pleasantly surprised. But as you liberally choose to mention, that info is already available. I am more interested in the reaction and the mechanism.
Thank you for your post; it is certainly above and beyond the expectation at this point.
