I do not think this program is available in the States yet, but BBC Four showed this program last night.
It is an appaloosa horse breeder from New Zealand who thinks the horse originated in central Asia and is not from the spanish horse introduced to the Americas. It is a fascinating trip across Asia.
I am a sucker for a nice appaloosa and this is a fascinating show.
Didnât all horses originate in central Asia???
I saw the teaser for this on H&H yesterday⊠Iâm a sucker for a nice appy too, so I shall be keeping an eye open for it here.
Oh I REALLY want to see this!
But it says âBBC iPlayer TV programmes are available to play in the UK onlyâ :sigh:
There is a way around that. Iâve done it so I can watch âThe Daily Showâ in the UK. It involves a Firefox plug-in called âmodify headersâ and some faff. Google âwatch BBC iplayer in USâ and I am sure you will be enlightened.
Thanks 
I will do some âgooglingâ once I get home!
My understanding is that Appaloosas are both: âThe Appaloosa,â by Frances Haines, traces the origin to Central AsiaâŠbut that eventually becomes the Spanish and other European horses, ergo the Spanish derivation of American Appaloosas (and Knabstruppers, whose foundation horse is âa Spanish mare named Flaebenhoppenâ.)
Of course, many modern ApHC horses are more QH than Appaloosa, so that brings in big doses of mustang and TB, not to mention the dreaded Impressive HYPP - which will never show up in a real Appy (!) So if youâre talking about some 31/32nds Impressive QH bred Appy, or a Rockledge or Pratt (or Confetti G) Foundation Bred horse, youâre really talking about two different things, though both are âregistered Appaloosas.â
I donât want any Quarterloosas, myself, eh, Appsolute? LOL
Yes - no âquarterloosasâ 
From I understand this documentary explores the possibility that the âpalouse horseâ derived from horses that crossed the Asian Land Bridge - long before the Spanish arrived with spotted horses, which in turn ended up in the hands of the Palus people in the pacific northwest.
Now, I have read that it is accepted that horses were in North America well before the conquest - but that those horses went extinct over 11,000 years ago.
I have also read (often from mustang proponents) that there is a theory that those ancient horses didnât go extinct.
I am interested to see the documentary!
That would be quite a departure from accepted scientific knowledge regarding the extinction of the - what Pleistocene(?), Pliocene (?) North American Horse. Thatâs Nobel Prize stuff if he can truly PROVE it. I will grant, however, that spotted coloring is certainly regarded as âprimitive,â along with duns/zebra striping.
Many large mammals were likely hunted to extinction when HUMANS came east over that land bridge. Accepted knowledge would be that horses were among them. Especially with hunting techniques like driving an entire herd over a cliff.
Well, we shall see. One wonders if itâs âscientificâ like the âghost huntersâ and âbig footâ hunters. Just because itâs on PBS of BBC doesnât guarantee accuracy. I reserve judgment for now, but I have major doubts. LOL
FWIW I had a college professor of Cherokee origin who told me that Appaloosas being descendants of Asian horses namely Prezwalskis who had crossed the land bridge was the lore of some Native Americans. And thus believed by many.
So basically, itâs as much a âdocumentaryâ as that Discovery mermaid show.
At a conference once, I saw a painting as part of a presentation which contained horses of all colors in China in a valley. I think the painting was called âThe Valley of 100 Horsesâ. It was stunning, the painting was hundreds of years old and portrayed every color of horse imagineable. What stunned me the most were the pintos and the appaloosas. Here is something that looks like a part of that painting.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-CHINESE-ASIAN-LARGE-PAINTING-ON-SILK-PICTURE-8-HORSES-/261236750985
Correct me if Iâm wrong, but arenât there people out there that believe Appys also have Akhal Teke in them? They are a Central Asian breed, yes? So is this guy one of those?
[QUOTE=roseymare;7972305]
FWIW I had a college professor of Cherokee origin who told me that Appaloosas being descendants of Asian horses namely Prezwalskis who had crossed the land bridge was the lore of some Native Americans. And thus believed by many.[/QUOTE]
The Prezwalski horse still exists and is the only true WILD horse (as opposed to feral). The were/are on the verge of extinction, but have in recent years been captured, bred in captivity, and released back into the wild to replenish the herds in Mongolia. They are uniformly dun. No spots. There is also the Tarpan, an artificially re-developed primitive horse, primarily in Germany, I believe. They also tend to be dun. It is apparently much debated whether they are ancestors of any domesticated horses.
The ancestors of the Native Americans - the Asians who crossed that land bridge INTO North America, may have seen (and hunted and eaten) a Prezwalskis type of horse, but it disappeared from North America long before the development of Native Americans into the tribes that would have an oral tradition re such horses. Weâre talking pre-history here, not the tribes that existed when the first Europeans reached America. If tribes had passed down knowledge re a Prezwalski type horse, youâd think theyâd have an oral tradition of mammoths and mastodons, also. Donât recall every hearing THAT. LOL
[QUOTE=BigBayHanoMare;7973085]
Correct me if Iâm wrong, but arenât there people out there that believe Appys also have Akhal Teke in them? They are a Central Asian breed, yes? So is this guy one of those?[/QUOTE]
Never heard that one! What is true is that the Nez Perce have âredevelopedâ a Nez Perce horse (they canât call it an Appaloosa because of ApHC), by crossing Appies with some Akhal-Tekes they were gifted with, the theory being that they would be a similar type, i.e., horses developed by nomadic high-desert tribes. The funny thing, of course, is that some of such crosses COULD be registered as âregularâ Appaloosas - but only geldings with a color pattern.
I heard a great lecture on the genetics of horses- basically 2 evolutionary paths. One lot comes from North Africa- the desert horse type. The others came from central Asia and northern Europe and are stocky, drafty types. There is a distinct genetic difference that you can check. Most horses are a mixture, but there are the pure (or purer!) types such as the Przwalski horse, as well as some Arabs. The Akhal Teka is interesting because it is supposedly northern European but looks like a much more âdesertâ type. I believe there have been genetic tests done on the mustang which take it back to the Spanish/desert type, but there are very few âpureâ mustangs if any. They interbred with other types, including draft stallions which were released on purpose to breed a heavier type of horse that would be more useful when rounded up.
The sad thing about Appaloosas is that they were almost destroyed as a breed in the late 19th century. Therefore, every Appaloosa today IS a mix of mustang, Appaloosa, some of what would have been called QH before the AQHA registry even existed, TB, Arab and who knows what. I had a friend who had a TWH/Appy. He didnât gait, but he was full color and characteristic, white sclera, mottled skin, etc.
When Hatley and Thompson started the Appaloosa registry in 1938, they chose the best types of Appaloosa they could find, and crossed them on TB and Arabian, trying to restore the type that had been degraded by forced draft crosses by the US Government. That is why those Arab/TB crosses are accepted for full registry with ApHC. Of course, there is QH in Appaloosas even before the wholesale QH crosses of the last 20-30 years, but originally it wasnât to the point that it is now, when you have horses that look entirely QH with minimal color and often NO other characteristics - and often no color either!!
Of course the QH thing works both ways: AQHA registered several âroanâ Quarter Horses that later produced Appaloosa foals, even when bred to other âregistered Quarter Horses.â
The late founder of the Foundation Appaloosa Registry was a bit of a character and a man of strong opinions, but I have to agree with him that âyou can put color on anything, but that doesnât make it an Appaloosa.â That registry is working towards producing horses with at least an eight generation âAppaloosa onlyâ pedigree. Ergo, while they accept that there are QH, TBs and Arabian cross Appaloosas given âFoundationâ designation by ApHC (e.g., Red Eagleâs Peacock), my present horse would not be eligible for Foundation registry despite his dam being in the 90th percentile of Foundation breeding, since his sire is an Arabian. (He is full characteristic and color, FWIW, and his full brother is leopard. LOL)
[QUOTE=Sandy M;7973336]
Never heard that one! What is true is that the Nez Perce have âredevelopedâ a Nez Perce horse (they canât call it an Appaloosa because of ApHC), by crossing Appies with some Akhal-Tekes they were gifted with, the theory being that they would be a similar type, i.e., horses developed by nomadic high-desert tribes. The funny thing, of course, is that some of such crosses COULD be registered as âregularâ Appaloosas - but only geldings with a color pattern.[/QUOTE]
Yes, thatâs what I found from Googling. This came up: http://extension.uidaho.edu/nezpercereservation/files/2013/04/NP-horse-info-brochure-rev-2010.pdf
For your amusement: A Painting entitled âThe Stud at Lipica,â showing the mare herd from which the Lipizzaners of the Spanish Riding School were developed. NOte the classic black & white spotted horse on the right.
Hope the link worksâŠ
[QUOTE=Appsolute;7971924]
Oh I REALLY want to see this!
But it says âBBC iPlayer TV programmes are available to play in the UK onlyâ :sigh:[/QUOTE]
Download this. Donât forget to turn it off when you arenât using it though.
https://dotvpn.com/en/
You can change countries on this too!
The lady (American living in NZ) featured in this had DNA tests done and proved a link to the Asian horses. They did a piece on her on the World Service too.
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