Something being “ideal” is one thing, most likely the beginning of prejudice and discrimination, but being downright rude is uncalled for. Everyone should be happy with who they are and what they look like, forget the “stupidity” of people who judge others on superficial reasons and ignore the truth. Speaking of ridiculous body images, what is up with the crazy adds for various riding pants with almost shirtless women leaning over fences and trees sticking their butts in the air, how often do you see that when you pull into the barn!!!
It really saddens me to learn how widespread this attitude has become in our sport. Right now on the BigEq bulletin board, there is the suggestion that Georgina Bloomberg should be doing the equitation simply because she’s skinny." Where is this mindset coming from?
I hope that something is said to this judge regarding her inappropriate comments. I confess I’m not too clear on how the IHSA works, so I don’t know if this is possible, but I’d certainly think twice about inviting this judge back.
Fitness is what should matter- not how skinny someone is or isn’t. Weight should only matter if it seriously endangers horse or rider.
I agree with everything that’s been said. What can we do to change this mindset and instead get people to appreciate healthy, fit bodies?
Cozmo: I am aghast!!! You do not need to lose anything–except maybe your trainer for agreeing with them. Let me tell you something from very personal experience. As thin as you already are, if you lose weight, you WILL lose strength. Do you want to throw Devon away because you have listened to these fools? Change nothing, if you are riding well and you obviously are. If you listen to them you could frankly blow it. Eat healthy, treat your body well and nothing can stop you. Except stupid comments from ignorant people.
Hi, all! Right on, LOUISE! Hallie, can we clone you? Pretty please? With a cherry on top? We need more judges like you in the show world! I admit, I am 5’ and about 154. And, I have NEVER been pinned down for being overweight! Although, I have only showed in small shows for the last two years, I constantly get pinned in the TOP 4, and the judges like my RIDING, not my WEIGHT! 
I know this b/c my trainer has overheard the judge say what a nice rider I was! Without any mention of my weight AT ALL! SCREW JUDGES WHO THINK THAT YOU NEED TO BE 5’8 AND 90 LBS TO WIN! How stupid! Riding SHOULD be based on riding alone, not riding and weight combined! Just my thoughts.
Hi. I really admire you CTT for sharing your story b/c that’s what I sort am doing right now, except I am not eating. OK, I am eating but sometimes I skip eating something in the morning and lunch on perpose. I can’t help it. It’s SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO tempting right now. I am showing in my first rated horse show in less then 3 months and I have to lose 20-50lbs by that time, which I don’t think I am going to do, at the rate I am going. Sometimes I fall off and pig out one week but then I feel guilty for eating. My trainer said I should lose weight and I agreed(this was last year), but I have not kept my part of the bargin.I once tried to not eat anything for a whole day until dinner and I nearly passed out. Man, you don’t know how much I envy those people that can eat whatever they want and not gain a pound. My mom and I had this disscion about losing weight before the show and she said not to worry about it. But, I am worried about it. What’s happens if I don’t get pinned b/c of my weight? What happens if I get talked to by one of the judges about my weight or heck even whispered about behind my back? It’s SOOOOOOO tempting to starve myself right now. I know it’s not right but…That’s all for now.
I would have been up the AHSA’s backside with this faster than the speed of email!
Thank goodness for judges who pin based on one’s riding and not the size of one’s back end. Otherwise I’d have biffed lots of classes because of my butt and thigh size.
Maybe if the judges and trainers (because boy oh boy are there a lot that go on about the size of one’s butt) concentrated more on the riding and less on the size, we would be able to achieve the same success as our compatriots in other countries, where rarely do they worry about such nonsense.
I entered Lane Bryant’s contest for new models a few years ago (whoo hoo, and got through a few cuts), and one of the pictures I sent in was of my fat butt riding a polo pony. And that’s why the 18-24 company is such a success, too - because they make great clothes for butt-sy and busty women. All the gals on my mom’s side of the family are reeeeeally tall and nice strapping gals. I’ve never had a problem with it - too bad there are so many narrow-minded judges who do.
And have you ever noticed how a gay trainer that knows nothing about women or their metabolism seem to be experts in weight loss?
What can we do? Emphasize fitness. Over and over and over. Everyone has a weight over which it is not healthy to be.
I’m 5’4" and when I carry over 145 pounds my hips start aching and I find my wind isn’t good. It get out of breath doing flights of stairs, etc. Now I’m pregnant and 170-something and I can really feel the difference that a lot of extra weight makes. My back and hips hurt badly, especially after a day on my feet teaching (high school). My ideal, semi-fit (I say semi, because I don’t mean obsessively “ripped”, 10-miles-a-day fit, just averagely fit) body would be about 135 (I’m very large-boned). I hope I can do that after the baby. But I am lazy. I hate working out. I have yet to find something I like. I’m one of those types that I have to a workout buddy to help motivate me. I haven’t found that yet.
Has anyone noticed how much more expensive it is to eat healthy – to buy fresh fruits and veggies, etc? It’s so much cheaper to load up on starches – bad for my body type.
Hi Everybody,
Thanks so much for your kind words. I’m glad that so many people value horsemanship over weight! I am actually judging an IHSA show this weekend at Dartmouth - if anyone is riding or coaching there - come by and say hi to me at the end of the day.
Darden, I’ve tried e-mailing you but the e-mail keeps getting bounced back. Please try e-mailing me at haligator@aol.com.
Hallie
Just because people do it doesn’t mean that it is right of good for the animal. Read the study, University of Guelph has a copy a very thought provoking study. Don’t you think that an animal would have an easier time doing what it was asked if the load was lighter?
A horse will try to do what you are asking if they understand, no matter what size a person is. I am just stating that not everything we do for the horse is good for the horse. Sure we feed, water and stable for shelter, but if you where a horse and had to run a pattern or jump a course and had the choice of carrying a 200lb person or a 140lb person, what would you choose? I would choose the lighter. JMHO
[This message has been edited by JRG (edited 12-04-2000).]
Children today have enough to worry about without this crap about being overweight. (Since I am in my 40s, my definition of children has become anyone 18 or under…).
I was a skinny-minnie until I was about 35 years old. Not skinny in the modern definition of today, however. I was slim, athletic and muscular. This was partially due to luck of the draw, lots of exercise. Tomboy upbringing, playing only guy-type sports - including tackle 
football - as I was the only girl in the neighborhood. I hiked, hunted and fished. Walked a lot, and rode whenever a horse was around… In fact, I was one of those oddballs who took TWO sports every quarter in college while everyone else tried to avoid even one!)
I began to slide around 35, and have been sliding ever since. I carry a good extra 40 lbs, and it is no longer muscle. I know it because I feel it, the mirror tells me so (and so do my clothes). I am sure my wonderful mare knows it, although she has been kind enough not to mention it… I don’t feel healthy in the saddle, and I don’t feel healthy in general. I am working slowly but surely towards Adult Onset Diabetes. Thankfully, with age, I have come to realize just how important it is to have your health, and have begun to implement certain “things” to help myself in that area.
The responsibility for my welfare as an adult is mine and mine alone. Yes, as an adult, only I can stop undermining my health and undermining my enjoyment of physical activities in which I have participated so long.
The keyword here is ADULT. I am here to tell you that it is hard enough to deal with all this body image stuff as a grownup - and the rest of you grownups know it! It saddens me and actually frightens me to hear some the comments made at horseshows, not only by the children about one another, but by the “alleged” adults as well.
With butting in inappropriately, I think all of us should be aware of just how deeply youngsters can be hurt by careless or mean-spirited comments … I don’t have children, so I don’t know quite how they function in modern times - and - I don’t think it is my place to correct the vipers who make such remarks … but if the occasion arose, I wouldn’t hesitate to put my arm around the shoulder of the child who was singled out, and give them a smile and a hug and remind them that “everyone is not the same, that and never will be - buck up and try not to take those stupid comments to heart!”
And P.S. I would also remind them that “pretty is as pretty does”. Like they say about grandma’s chicken soup to fight a cold… it might not help, but it won’t hurt!
[This message has been edited by woodbern (edited 04-03-2000).]
I haven’t read any of the responses to this, but I think what the judge said is sick. FIVE pounds?!?! That’s nothing, much less nothing to comment about. That’s water weight, not even body fat. I’m sorry you and your rider had to experience such a comment.
You are, unfortunately, correct Woodbern. Criticism based on weight and/or a “svelt” conformation does not begin and end at adolescence.
I am a 40 year old adult who began riding only 10 months ago. When I first began searching for a lesson barn, I went to one facility (that shall remain unnamed) where the instructor advised me to forget about riding b/c I was too muscular. In her opinion, my athletic build would detract from the “streamlined appearance” that riders should seek to achieve.
Hearing this comment as an adult, I was able to laugh. In fact, I roared. My outburst very nearly sent the wispy young instructor tumbling backwards head over delicate heels.
I assured the young woman that despite my balanced diet and overall fitness, I would indeed learn to ride and ride well, that I had paid an exhorbitant amount of money for an hour of her time, and that I intended to extract every second of that time from her even if I had to use one overly developed arm to physically carry her from the office into the ring.
We got along just fine after that exchange, but needless to say, I never went back to that particular barn.
Unfortunately, ludicrous comments like the one made to me are more often directed at kids and younger women who may not yet have the self-assurance to recognize and dismiss them.
I agree with the majority of you posting here that governing organizations should be made aware of judges whose subjective prejudices are detrimental (or dangerous) to young competitors. Because judging is, by definition, subjective, it may not be possible to eliminate the problem entirely. However, where it is known that a judge uses weight or physical appearance as a criteria in evaluating a rider, that judge should be called on the carpet.
I am encouraged that societal attitudes on the weight subject seem to be changing. Ultimately, this type of global shift in outlook is what is needed. Destructive attitudes about weight and appearance are pervasive throughout American society – as attitudes change in society generally, the horse world will follow.
In the meantime, kudos to all of you young women (and men) who refuse to allow the current asinine prejudice re weight to deter you from your goals.
How about treating ourselves as well as we treat our horses? I told my trainer that was my New Year’s resolution (haven’t achieved it yet, but will keep trying). If a tall, narrow Thoroughbred was the ideal horse, you would not try to starve your Quarter Horse to get him to look like that - we all know that would not work! You just keep your horse fit and at the weight that looks best on him.
OK, I’ve kept my hands quiet on this one for quite awhile. . . .But. . …
I was one of those kids that could eat and eat and never gain weight. My pediatrician was still telling my mother and I at age 16 (yes, I was still seeing my pediatrician at that age - didn’t have any reason not to) to feed me more and with more calories. Then it happened. . .the summer before my freshman year at college and that fall. . .my metabolism took a complete turnaround. . .It was devastating. . .And school pressures didn’t help. My weight used to fluctuate up to 30lbs / year. I’d pretty much lose it every summer, then balloon up and down again. Talk about expensive to have even jeans in all those sizes! Somehow I managed to have one pair of chaps - forgiving, stretching leather!
Kip Rosenthal came up to do a clinic a couple times during my four years and she was fantastic. She had just judged an intercollegiate show the weekend before and I had not been there. She yelled across the indoor ring, complete with who knows how many other riders, plus people in the bleachers, to my coach and asked her why I hadn’t been at the show. My coach yelled back to her that “after she loses 15lbs, she’ll be back on the team again”. Talk about mortifying. I think Kip felt worse than I did. I can’t remember whether there was just silence or those embarrassed laughs, or what. I got over it, as we all have to. But I still remember it and it was over 20 years ago.
So, two children later, past smoker, all sorts of adult stresses (and I hate to tell you kids - that you may think you know what stress is - I thought I did - but you don’t yet) and my weight still fluctuates. And my body is NOT the same, even when I’ve gotten down to “fighting weight”. The same clothes that used to fit me at that weight just don’t look the same now. (I really do need to clean out that closet.) And being “single” again has got me thinking about my weight even more and that makes me extremely mad at myself! (At least I haven’t started smoking again to try to get skinny!) I’m not fat, but I know I could look better. But I get so upset with myself that at my age I should feel better about myself the way I am, and not be worrying about how people perceive me who may or may not even know me. I guess what I’m trying to say, is that the weight hang-ups don’t go away as you get older and sometimes trying to fight them is just as hard. I dislike the fact that I’m a much more confident person when I feel “thin” than when I don’t. Am I making any sense?
On the other hand, I never ate healthy in my youth and I can’t say that I do even now that I supposedly know better. I’d still rather get my calories from chocolate than from something I wouldn’t enjoy as well. So I guess one could say I deserve every pound on me and I would have to agree. But I am healthy today and for that I’m extremely thankful. And ultimately, I guess that’s the most important thing. That, and the fact that my family and friends love me no matter what I look like, including my animal friends!!
Some of you people need to get a life. I can’t believe you look at someone and think negative thoughts about them because of their weight! Especially the person who was worried about a heavy person having health problems in the summer. I think that a girl who has not eaten properly in who know how long is more likely to pass out at a show on a hot day than someone who is well fed and getting all their nutrients every day. And YOU CANNOT JUDGE A PERSON’S LEVEL OF FITNESS BY THEIR BODY!!! My sister just ran a marathon, and is NOT SKINNY! In fact, some of you princesses may even call her chunky. Well, she ran 26 miles in 5 hours. I know plenty of skinny eq riders who have to ride everything in a pelham because they don’t have the strength and ability (Or fitness) to use their hands and bodies effectively.
AND ANOTHER THING…if you notice an overweight person participating in a sport or otherwise physical activity, you should not think, “look how fat she is,” or “she would be better at that if she lost some weight.” You should think, “Gee, look at that motivated person who is out there doing something good for her health and enjoying herself.” After all, riding is exercise, right?
Erin posted yesterday saying that the Chronicle is going to do a story on drug and alcohol abuse at shows based on a thread from this board. A good argument can be made that this subject is as important and should be addressed in the Chronicle and many other magazines.
Unfortunately, the body image/thinness issue is so pervasive in our society that it’s easy to think that small efforts may be futile, but if we don’t try then things will never change. Letters/emails to the editors of magazines with offensive ads, letters/emails to the IHSA/AHSA regarding judges who make inappropriate comments, letters/emails to those at the AHSA involved with judging to remind them that the rule book does not say that suitability means only tall and thin. (If I remember correctly, a few years ago GM was highly criticized for his comments about riders’ build and weight in his Practical Horseman jumping clinic and he has softened his comments since then. Even if it’s just better editing, it’s a small step in the right direction.)
Here’s a wild idea… wouldn’t it be great if we could find a show rider, or group of riders, who would speak out on this issue in a wide variety of forums. Positioned properly, that could bring some good publicity to our sport for trying to put health and fitness above body type.
This one is too important to ignore. The mental and physical health of too many women of all ages is riding on it!
Glasgow - I personally haven’t found many judges to judge unfairly based on weight, IMO, at least in the Adults. There are still obviously some skinny adults out there, but there are also plenty of us that may not seem in “ideal” shape for this sport. I think that a lot of the pressure is more self-imposed as we get older. If you feel OK with yourself, than others will too, including the vast majority of the judges.
I know I’m looonnnngg since out of the Juniors, but I still watch them and most of them are beautiful riders on beautiful horses. It’s a tragedy that some of them have eating disorders. As others have mentioned, it’s extremely difficult to help these youngsters without actually having the opposite effect. Hopefully through education, threads such as these, articles in magazines of interest to them, etc. we can start the battle against this negative self-image.
Needless to say, action needs to be taken pertaining to any judge that makes such a derogatory remark to anyone of any age. But as posters have mentioned, I don’t think the inherent problem lies with the judges, per se, or at least not many of them. It’s driven by far more insiduous methods in society. Peer pressure, trainers, public image, and even parents have a part in this as well (not all, obviously). And as so many factors contribute to the problem, so too, many factors will have to contribute to rectify it. Please know that I fully support any changes in the equestrian world that will help with these self-image problems. And hopefully some of results of these actions will trickle to other venues as well. There are a lot of us that could use some help in the self-image department, not just the Juniors. I just realize that if we don’t do something to help the younger folks out there now, then they’ll be even more adults out there in the future with these same issues that don’t have to! There’s also the fact that people die from these eating disorders and won’t even make it to adulthood. . .
First of all, to weatherford, one of the riders that you saw in Wellington, in the GP ring, has been a skeleton for at least 4 years that I know of and she is who I was talking about in my first post. She actually looked as if she (thank god because she looks so much better), gained some weight since the last time I saw her. So hopefully, finally someone said something to her, or tried to intervene and get her some help.
Second of all, is there a way to speak about this problem at the AHSA convention? Does anyone who reads this board know how to go about getting this subject on the agenda. This is a really touchy subject, but one that I feel needs to be addressed.
Not to make light of all that Joe Dotoli is doing with the helmets, but isnt the health of our children, nutritionally, just as important as headgear issues.
How can people who are so concerned about not letting people fall off and get a fatal head injury, stand around and watch our children starve themselves to death. Is there someone in our country who could or would become our spokesperson on this?
Cozmo, Listen to Bascule!!
Yes, I think it is sad that people have to STILL be judged not only in the outside world, but in the horse world as well about their weight! One of my friends is struggling with bulemia because she “doesn’t want to look like her family”. I think that is sad. Hallie, you are not going to get flamed, quite the opposite actually. You pinned it for questioning a judges ability if they have to turn to such nastiness to judge a class. And Marimee, YOU GO GIRL!!! Right on for holding your chin up and proving yourself, that was the perfect revenge! I bet that skinny minnie trainer stuck her foot in her mouth! There are overweight riders who ride beautifly and skinny riders who ride horribly, to me it’s black and white. Whoever rode the better course or test should win, plain and simple.
