I hope it’s OK to link this. This is not a horse I have for sale. I just like him and I wonder if he’s a Tovero or a Tobiano. Wonder what other people think.
http://www.aquilasporthorses.com/2013/04/three-new-horses-for-sale-2/
Personally I would call him a Tobiano.
Tobiano.
Tobiano, absolutely.
He technically could be a tovero, but he looks enough like a tobiano that I would call him a tobiano. Does the overo patter run in that breed?
Personally, I thought most people outside of the APHA just called them pintos.
Definitely tobiano. Also has the sabino gene.
Tobiano and another white gene ( Frame, sabino or W mutation) Tobiano isn’t really known for making face white.
Overohunter…I totally thought “isn’t that just a Pinto?!?” lmao
Oops!
[QUOTE=jessiesgrrl;8062740]
Overohunter…I totally thought “isn’t that just a Pinto?!?” lmao
Oops![/QUOTE]
I always thought only APHA people got hung up on the tobiano vs. frame vs. sabino vs. splash and everyone else just called their horses pintos :lol:
Of course the APHA wraps frame/sabino/splash all into overo which is a joke, but I guess there’s room for improvement with everything :lol:
[QUOTE=OveroHunter;8063729]
I always thought only APHA people got hung up on the tobiano vs. frame vs. sabino vs. splash and everyone else just called their horses pintos :lol:
Of course the APHA wraps frame/sabino/splash all into overo which is a joke, but I guess there’s room for improvement with everything :lol:[/QUOTE]
Back in the early days of the Paint associations (there were 2 that ultimately merged), there were only 2 options: tobiano and overo. If it wasn’t the former then it had to be the latter. We’re talking the 60’s here, and there wasn’t anything remotely like the color genetics we have now. If you are into Paints, however, you have to wonder if some day they will recognize all of the patterns, not unlike adding a new color to the equation. I read a long time ago where, if you really want to understand color genetics in Paint horses, you need to hook up with the Oriental Shorthair cat people. They (the cats) come in more colors and patterns that any other breed, and a lot of breeders (including the one I got my cats from) do genetic testing to help figure out what color/pattern they’ll get with a particular breeding.
I have one of those registered “overos” who really is a sabino, possibly with overo also. He looks a lot like Hidalgo of movie fame, but much more handsome. 
[QUOTE=walktrot;8064271]
I have one of those registered “overos” who really is a sabino, possibly with overo also. [/QUOTE]
From what I understand, there is no genetic pattern called “overo”. Isn’t it the general term for the grouping of Splash, Frame and Sabino?
Tobiano pattern. White crosses the top line and it has white legs. Also has a solid head with a stripe. Nice pattern but lots of white to keep clean.
[QUOTE=SmartAlex;8064542]
From what I understand, there is no genetic pattern called “overo”. Isn’t it the general term for the grouping of Splash, Frame and Sabino?[/QUOTE]
You’re right. Unfortunately the APHA is still in the 1960s.
Actually, I don’t think the term ‘pinto’ really caught on here. Perhaps before the APHA (and well before my time) but nowadays I almost always see any pinto horse advertised as tobiano, overo, etc. I remember ‘The Pie’ giving me a fair bit of trouble as a child reading National Velvet, and to this day I have to look up which one is black/white and which is any other color/white.
Tobiano. With lots of white. 
That face is pretty typical tobiano (dark face with “regular markings” like blazes, snips, stars, etc)
[QUOTE=Mosey_2003;8068402]
Actually, I don’t think the term ‘pinto’ really caught on here. Perhaps before the APHA (and well before my time) but nowadays I almost always see any pinto horse advertised as tobiano, overo, etc. I remember ‘The Pie’ giving me a fair bit of trouble as a child reading National Velvet, and to this day I have to look up which one is black/white and which is any other color/white.[/QUOTE]
Back in my day, horse of unknown/non-stock horse lineage was a Pinto. Stock horse with color? Paint.
That’s why I can say that I rode a Paint/Pinto. (He’s half paint (a.k.a QH with too much white) and half Pinto (WB).
I believe Overo does not naturally exist outside the paint lines, but I could be wrong.
It is important if you are a breeder, so you do not breed 2 horses with Frame gene together = 1/4 lethal white foals.
On the other hand, if you breed 2 Tobianos together you may end up with Homozygous Tobiano, which is a huge plus -to color breeders anyway.
Genetic testing is the breeder’s friend.
Frame exists in more breeds than you might think, including Thoroughbreds, Miniature horses, American Shetland ponies, Tennessee Walkers and Saddlebreds.
Splash is also lumped into ‘Overo’ label for most registries/people.
http://www.animalgenetics.eu/equine/Coat-Color-Testing/frame-overo(LWO).html
The horse is definitely Tobiano, and has another ‘Sabino’ (they are not calling them that as they identify the various white KIT locus genes) gene adding the face white and jagged edgings on the white areas.
[QUOTE=RugBug;8068843]
I believe Overo does not naturally exist outside the paint lines, but I could be wrong.[/QUOTE]
And don’t forget Arabian. It was all a scandal when they started crop out overo. My first horse was a 1970’s Arab with enough white to be registered overo pinto. Saddlebreds frequently have “crop out” overo just like Quarter Horses do. And I’ve even seen several extreme Medicine Hat sabino Saddlebreds that came from crop out Sabino.
[QUOTE=Mosey_2003;8068402]
Actually, I don’t think the term ‘pinto’ really caught on here. Perhaps before the APHA (and well before my time) but nowadays I almost always see any pinto horse advertised as tobiano, overo, etc. I remember ‘The Pie’ giving me a fair bit of trouble as a child reading National Velvet, and to this day I have to look up which one is black/white and which is any other color/white.[/QUOTE]
When I was a kid people used “pinto” pretty much everywhere, where I lived (eastern US). “Paint” was a “western” term “I ride an old Paint …” “Piebald” (black and white) and “skewbald” (white and any other color but black) were British terms.
A wonderful book I had on horse color published in the 1980s used the terms “tobiano” and “overo” as well as “sabino” and “splash” – only in more recent years have I seen “sabino” differentiated from “roan.”
I still see UK horse ads referring to piebalds and skewbalds as “coloured” – a term I guess would not be PC enough to be used in the US!
