Update post 20. Deworming horses on the same property at different times?

[lenapesadie]

Due to circumstances detailed below, my options are:

1. Deworm 1 horse now and deworm 1 pony in a few weeks
2. Wait and deworm both in a few weeks

Which would you choose?

I have two equines at my home farm. A horse and a pony. The pony is a recent acquisition with a totally unknown history.

Typically I deworm 2X per year. Quest Plus in April and Equimaxx in October. I was a bad horse owner and hadn’t done my horse’s October dewormer yet when pony showed up. I thought NBD, I’ll get a dewormer for pony too and do them both at same time.

Wrong. Pony isn’t having anything to do with anything that resembles me putting anything in his mouth. Or touching his mouth even. I’ve tried some basic “tricks”; slowly starting with just touching over top of nose and under chin, luring with cookies, syringe w applesauce, using a carrot as a syringe. I’m getting nowhere fast with this. At this point, I’m presuming that either 1) pony has serious trauma re being dewormed or 2) pony has a tooth / mouth issue that needs medical treatment.

Vet is scheduled for the 4th of December. She’ll do his vaccinations and his teeth and presumably we can squirt the dewormer down his throat while he’s sedated or something.

Anyways. Should I wait until I can get pony dewormed to deworm the horse? Or go ahead and deworm horse now?

[2DogsFarm]

IIWM, I’d deworm the horse & pony can wait.
Since vet is coming, a fecal count for pony will let you know which wormer he needs.
Not sure worming while sedated can be done, but I’m sure your vet will know.

FWIW, my 13h pony is The Worst! to pasteworm.
After 13yrs, I still have to put him in a headlock & hope I don’t end up wearing most of the paste
16h horse doesn’t even need a halter, hand over nose, insert syringe & done.
Mini same.

[JB]

Are FECs involved? If not, or you know your horses are historically low shedders, then it doesn’t matter. If I remember right, you’re in a fairly moderate climate, like you’re not already into full Winter weather?

Is it possible to get a FEC on the pony?

You don’t want to deworm while he’s sedated, no food/paste/liquids.

What does the pony eat? Could he be enticed to eat the paste in a meal?

Now, vs a couple of weeks, isn’t going to matter at this point. Dividing dewormings is a Best Practice if you’ve got horses with > 200 FECs. Why? That dilutes the number of resistant parasite eggs being shed into the pasture, so you lower the risk of any given horse ingesting a resistant infective larva.

@2DogsFarm

a fecal count for pony will let you know which wormer he needs.

Equimax would still be the go-to regardless of a FEC result

[lenapesadie]

I could get a FEC done on the pony.

Very moderate climate, as in no below freezing temperatures yet or in the forecast. Lows in the 50s and 40s.

Well that’s a bummer that he can’t be dewormed sedated. What if he’s just a little sedated? I’m no horse whisperer, but I’ve dewormed a whole bunch of horses in my life and this pony is not having any of it. He’s compliant and steady about all other things I’ve done to him so far so it’s both an extreme reaction and out of character.

Pony eats 3/4 lb of TC Gold Balancer and maybe 2 lbs TC Timothy Balance cubes split into two meals and soaked in a mash. I add salt and electrolytes as supplements.

Currently stalled overnight with 8/9 lbs of Teff and Tifton hay mixed together in a nibble net.

I’ve considered trying to put the paste in feed. Theoretically, I could make him a mash with a larger amount of cubes to help hide the taste and withhold his hay net. Maybe add some kind of sweetener to the mash like sugar free maple syrup or unsweetened applesauce. If it’s a no go to deworm him under any kind of sedation then I’ll probably try to slip the dewormer into a mash.

But I’m ok to proceed with Equimaxx on the horse now regardless it seems?

[JB]

He has to be awake enough to eat grass, before he can be dewormed.

If you’re willing to potentially waste a tube of dewormer, you can try mixing a half dose in a larger volume of food, and if he eats that, add the other half into an equally large meal

The problem is, obviously, if he eats the first half, but not the 2nd half. Can you twitch him at all?

Yes, you can deworm the horse now

[2DogsFarm]

Considering I generally wear a good part of my Pony’s wormer & his annual FEC’s are always low, I’d vote for 1/2 a dose being better than none.

My 3 rarely leave the farm.
When they do it’s even rarer to be in a horse show environment with stalls of strangers in proximity. Usually tied to a trailer outdoors.
If mini goes to The Ntl Drive in October, his stall there has been stripped & left empty since the Spring event at the end of April. Possibly used at the September CDE.
Stalls there are shedrows, so open to weather.

All 3 routinely test low & I worm in Fall for tapes, in Spring based on FEC.
Vet-approved schedule.

[Texarkana]

Can you use pelleted fendbendazole (SafeGuard) on him this time around, until you get his mouth issues sorted out?

It’s what I did when I had an uncatchable feral one living out with the herd until they were tame enough for me to get a tube of dewormer in their mouth.

[NaturallyHappy]

Are you able to get a lip chain on the pony? We had one that was awful, but I could get a lip chain on her. After a couple of sessions w applesauce, she got better. I think someone jammed wormer, bute paste, or something and hit the roof of her mouth. No one, including her, minds Equimax.

[2DogsFarm]

Duh!
Forgot about the feedthrough stuff.
Years ago, my vet told me he had a client with a herd of 50 minis that got Strongid.
I switched for a while, but cheaper to worm based on FEC.

@lenapesadie Honcho might not object to top-dressed pellets.
It’s just pyrantel, but it’s a start for him.
Then you have time to work on his syringe-in-mouth issue.

[lenapesadie]

I’m cheap but not so cheap that I’m terribly concerned about wasting a tube of dewormer. I might try putting the paste in a mash. He’s not shown any tendency towards being a picky eater.

Honcho, the pony, will not let me do anything that involves messing with his lips. Perhaps with assistance of vet and tech we could get a twitch or lip chain on him.

He doesn’t load either so hauling him up to vet clinic to put him in stocks is also out for now.

[lenapesadie]

Vet team is satisfied with dewormer schedule. It would be a rare case that would need anything additional. I’m keen to get Honcho dewormed as I’m dubious that the Bamboo Prison Warden’s system was up to snuff He might need additional but we gotta get basics first!

[lenapesadie]

That is a good idea!

I’m hopeful that getting his teeth worked on will make future deworming training more productive.

[lenapesadie]

Nope. I can’t so much as touch a finger to the corner of his mouth. I suppose if I was pressed, I could wrangle one on him. Maybe.

Honcho the pony is almost certainly WAY behind on dental care and is of unknown age. It’s entirely possible he has some sort of painful tooth thing going on in the back of his mouth.

It’s been my observation that the Equimaxx is less offensive than Quest Plus so that may be a boon if I try to put it in his mash.

[JB]

@2DogsFarm

I’d vote for 1/2 a dose being better than none.

It’s not though, and that’s a good way to start or worsen resistance on the farm

@2DogsFarm

All 3 routinely test low & I worm in Fall for tapes, in Spring based on FEC.

bots too
Do yours get any grass over the Winter? If so, you might want to deworm again for bots and tapeworms

@Texarkana

Can you use pelleted fendbendazole (SafeGuard) on him this time around,

Highly likely to be highly ineffective, so I wouldn’t bother. Besides, it won’t target tapeworms or bots anyway

@2DogsFarm

Forgot about the feedthrough stuff.

there are no pelleted dewormers that are useful anymore, they’re all fenbendazole or pyrantel pamoate, both with high, widespread resistance. The only use they have is if you can do a FEC, see a high enough count, use one, and do another FEC in 10-14 days to see how effectice it was

[2DogsFarm]

I no longer use feedthrough & paste according to annual FEC, product per vet’s recommendation.
My pastures never approach “lush” at any time of year. Horses have access to them 24/7/365 year-round.

[SusanO]

I have one that is terrible to worm - imagine 1600 pounds of “you aint gonna worm me, no way, no how”. She is fine for everything else. I imagine somebody got into a fight with her as a baby and she decided she wasn’t going to be wormed ever again. I have been able to trick her once or twice by training her with an empty syringe dipped in molasses but you have to be really quick when you squirt the wormer out. I now do her when she gets her teeth done. Before the vet gives her the shot to take her out of sedation the wormer goes in. I suppose there is a risk but I am through wrestling with a 1600 pound giraffe. And it’s not just me, the vet can’t do it either. My other two horses are easy peasy. Dip the end of the paste tube into molasses and let them lick some molasses in my hand afterwards and they don’t care. Some horses if you get in a big fight about something they never forget. I think she is one of them.

[lenapesadie]

Dipping the tip of the syringe in something sweet and sticky is a good idea. I tried applesauce but he was having none of it.

When vet comes, we’ll see what kind of shape his teeth are in and kinda go from there. If he has had a bad tooth or something for a while and a person knocked it with a syringe that might explain his behavior.

[RMJacobs]

My large pony suddenly developed an aversion to me sticking a worming syringe in his mouth, after years of worming him with no problem. DH couldn’t get it in him, either. This was a pony with otherwise great ground manners. DH tried mixing it in with senior feed, and the pony slurped it right down. So we just went with that while he was living at home.

After I moved him to South Carolina, the BO said he was sure he could worm him. Five minutes later, he said “mission accomplished.” I don’t know what he did differently from me or my DH, but I was happy he got it done. I had no trouble with my other two horses for their entire time with me.

Rebecca

[lenapesadie]

I’m probably going to try putting the dewormer in a mash for him. I don’t have anything very tasty to mix it with on hand though. Maybe I can grind up some Mrs Pastures cookies. My feed store carries little single flavored beet pulp mash kits. That might be an option.

[lenapesadie]

I put Honcho’s entire dose of Equimaxx in a mash tonight. He didn’t even hesitate and licked the bowl clean. I’m kinda shocked at how easy that was. And I’m relieved to get an appropriate dewormer in him.

The horse got his too. But via the traditional delivery method.