Walking alone, at night

[Tosca]

I work at a stable (yes, this is horse related!)once a week or so to help pay for my horse’s board. Most of the time I work Saturdays 8-5, which I like because it’s in the daytime (but awful when you’re smart like me and drink the night before and get three hours of sleep ). The problem is that lately they’ve been wanting me to work Tuesday nights, from six until ten-ish. Not (sob) being able to afford my car, I take the bus. The bus stop is about a ten minute walk away. And, as I’ve found, it’s a little hair raising to be walking alone in the dark in the city and then sitting on a bech by yourself with your back to the paths, waiting for the bus. It’s along a busy highway which is well lit, and there isn’t really anything around besides parks so there aren’t a lot of people around but still…Last time there was this guy lurking (or so it appeared!) at the end of the stable driveway. I pulled out my cell and pretended to be talking to someone and he walked up and asked me to call Alberta Automotive or whatever because his car was broken down. So I did, somewhat apprehensive, and it turned out fine-he was super nice and grateful, but as I was standing there dialing the number I suddenly realized how unsuspecting and vulnerable I am. If he was a wacko, he could’ve done anything and I wouldn’t have known what to do. I don’t even carry and defense things (spray etc.) on me.

So I decided I don’t feel comfortable working the night shifts. My question is can they fire me if I refuse to work when they want me to work? And if they tell me I’ll lose my job what should I do? How unsafe is it? (This city is relatively safe and I always have my wits about me, know where I’m going, walk quickly and confidently etc.) And what are the best ‘defense mechanisms’? I really love having my horse here (even though most people think it’s crazy to pay more for my horse’s board than mine!) and I wouldn’t be able to afford it without working. My mom said she doesn’t want me out at night like that and she’d pay for the cab, but she doesn’t realize that it’d be WAY expensive. (I go to University here, my family all lives elsewhere.)

The people I work with on night shift live right there, and all the lesson people leave after lessons and I still have to do evening feed, so getting a ride isn’t an option.

I wouldn’t feel so bad if my ‘big boss’ wan’t such a jerk. The barn manager is cool, but I have to talk to this other guy who doesn’t seem to know what the word empathy is.

[Cactuskate]

Whether it is related to your working evenings or not, postition yourself to defend your self. Take a self defense class, carry whatever Canada allows for personal defense and most importantly KNOW HOW TO USE IT.

You are correct in feeling vulnerable at that hour in those conditions. Just because there are not very many people around does not make it safer. Actually the opposite. If nothing else can you check with your local police authority and find out if they patrol that area. Tell them your schedule and see what kind of schedule you can expect from them.

I hope you can work the schedule out or find someone to accompany you to the bus stop. Can you wait at the barn until it is close to the time the bus comes so you minimize your wait on the street?

“The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!”

[Janet]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Life is not fair…women can NOT go out alone at night. Let’s not pretend that we can defend ourselves alone…we cannot.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

THIS IS TOTAL BS.

If you don’t feel comfortable out alone at night, then you shouldn’t have to go out alone at night- MALE OR FEMALE.

But there is ABSOLUTELY no reason to say that WOMEN cannot go out alone at night. I do it all the time. Country mostly, but city sometimes. And unlike the poster above, all I have is a Swiss Army Knife.

PS, the only time I have really felt in danger (I was held up at gunpoint) was 2PM on a weekday, outside the House Office Building.

[DocHF]

the labor code in BC and Manitoba states that after 9 pm, an employer is obligated to provide transportation/escort either home, or to the nearest safe public transport, IF THE EMPLOYEE REQUESTS IT. It is mandatory if the employee is a minor. Very few employers know of this and even fewer employees request it, but its there. Phone the Worker’s Compensation or Labour Relations Board-they usually have access to the code pretty quickly.I suspect the code is the same in Alberta.
I am often at work late at night and there is no way I am going to walk alone in a dimly lit hospital parking lot to get to my car. I had to take this up with the hospital admin, but they have informed their security guards that any employee who requests it, will get a guard escort to their car, bus stop, etc.

The other things are really good too. I have taken a self-defense course, I always make eye contact or even greet people on the street, and I do not walk like a victim. I want someone to think that they are going to have a fight if they tangle with me (yes they will- I have dropped two grown men who came after me, both with moves I learned in a weekend defense course, one was actually unconscious and was discretely removed by the bar bouncers after he grabbed my bosoms!) As for pepper spray- you can buy it in hunting stores as “bear repellant” but more often than not it goes off in your purse, or the cloud of spray drifts back towards you and gets you choking.
I’m sure you and the stable owner will work it out.

[jl1]

advice. When I was 18, I had to walk to bus thru a very nasty area of San Francisco. I walked briskly beside the street with my head high and made eye contact with everyone I passed.
Another tidbit-if you feel threatened-holler “fire” at the very top of your lungs. For some reason that elicts a response when “help” or “rape” does not.

[NancyL]

Talk to your employer.

I once worked a job that finished late at night and they always made sure there were two of us and that we always left at the same time.

As for self defense:

In California if you take a certified class you can earn a license to carry tear gas.

The course is one day, and the test is fairly simple. You also learn self defense techniques.

The instructors, both women, recommend tear gas (yes, the military version) over pepper spray as many people react negatively to pepper spray (they can die when their throats swell in reaction to the pepper spray).

Yes, I am well armed with my tear gas.

[Tosca]

That’s exactly what I wanted to know DH, thank you.

Ahh bear spray–something I am familiar with. We have several bottles at home; maybe I should have my parents send me one.

“The question is not can they speak or can they reason, but can they suffer?”

[gwen]

Maybe they could drive you to the station??? I would NOT feel safe either!!!

Barb

[davidgud_equestrian_jihad]

YOU GUYS!!! This is Canada!!! She can no more go around carrying a “Colt 38 Special” as fly to the Moon!! There is major major gun control in Canada and as far as I know, it is next to impossible to own a handgun in Canada - especially a high school girl. Tear gas?? Interesting idea; but my gut guess is that it is probably banned too; I do know that the stun weapons are not allowed.

I hope she’s dealing with this . . .

DG/Seoul ROK

[Jennasis]

You absolutely should not be punished by your employer for not wanting to work at night. You are still a minor and God forbid something were to happen to you on yuour way to or from work, they could be held liable.

Let me tell you a story…My mom is a medical assistant for a gynecologist. After several years with him, during which time she was always considered a valuable member of the team, the doctor decided to expand his practice. He was going to partner up with another gyno colleague. So the doc told me mom that she’d be working two days a week in the other doctors office instead of the usual one. FINE. My mom happily obliged. About 2 days into working at the new office, my mom discovered that the new doctor performed abortions in his office. my mom is pro-life and was mortified that she would, in some way, be contributing to abortions. For DAYS she agonized over it, knowing she had to tell her boss that she could not, in good conscience, work for this new doctor, but she was afraid she’d be fired for it.

Finally she caved in and told her boss how she felt. Her boss was horrified that he had put her in such a compromising position and apologized profusely. he then severed ties with the new gyno, and continued on with his small practice…with my Mom as well.

Your safety and well-being come first in ALL situations. I’m sure they’ll understand. If they don’t, then they aren’t worth working for.

[jl1]

by the notion that anyone would think women cannot go out alone at night as well.
I’m certainly not going to deliberately put myself in a dangerous situation but I’ll be damned if I’ll stay in my house like a flipping hostage either.

[Cactuskate]

Go jennasis, an example of a person that has taken control of her own livelihood!! Good for you.

“The older I get, the better I used to be, but who the heck cares!”

[Seven]

Tosca, if you don’t want your Mom to pay for the cost of the taxi – could she contribute the same amount to your board bill so you wouldn’t have to work nights?

Just a thought.

=^+^=

[PaulaM]

In my opinion (and living in Edmonton) if your employer wants you to work nights and they know that you are taking the bus they should be darn well sure to make sure that someone stays with you until you get on the bus safely at least. Are there any other boarders still around at that time of the night?

That is one of the busiest stretches of road within Edmonton and personally, I wouldn’t feel safe alone in the dark there either. You are truly justified with your concerns. Talk it over with the barn manager I am sure you can come to some sort of arrangement.

[Zimt]

a coupla facts:

*a woman is raped every 6 minutes in the USA.

*people who use guns to defend themselves are more likely to have their guns taken from them and used against them by their attacker, than they are to successfully defend themselves with that gun. The same is true of knives.

Tosca - get some pepper spray right away, talk to your employer, and please don’t risk your life and emotional wellbeing for one more second. You’re putting yourself in an extremely dangerous situation for no good reason. Life is too short.

My friend was gang raped a month ago. That’s just never going to go away…

[Tosca]

I work at a stable (yes, this is horse related!)once a week or so to help pay for my horse’s board. Most of the time I work Saturdays 8-5, which I like because it’s in the daytime (but awful when you’re smart like me and drink the night before and get three hours of sleep ). The problem is that lately they’ve been wanting me to work Tuesday nights, from six until ten-ish. Not (sob) being able to afford my car, I take the bus. The bus stop is about a ten minute walk away. And, as I’ve found, it’s a little hair raising to be walking alone in the dark in the city and then sitting on a bech by yourself with your back to the paths, waiting for the bus. It’s along a busy highway which is well lit, and there isn’t really anything around besides parks so there aren’t a lot of people around but still…Last time there was this guy lurking (or so it appeared!) at the end of the stable driveway. I pulled out my cell and pretended to be talking to someone and he walked up and asked me to call Alberta Automotive or whatever because his car was broken down. So I did, somewhat apprehensive, and it turned out fine-he was super nice and grateful, but as I was standing there dialing the number I suddenly realized how unsuspecting and vulnerable I am. If he was a wacko, he could’ve done anything and I wouldn’t have known what to do. I don’t even carry and defense things (spray etc.) on me.

So I decided I don’t feel comfortable working the night shifts. My question is can they fire me if I refuse to work when they want me to work? And if they tell me I’ll lose my job what should I do? How unsafe is it? (This city is relatively safe and I always have my wits about me, know where I’m going, walk quickly and confidently etc.) And what are the best ‘defense mechanisms’? I really love having my horse here (even though most people think it’s crazy to pay more for my horse’s board than mine!) and I wouldn’t be able to afford it without working. My mom said she doesn’t want me out at night like that and she’d pay for the cab, but she doesn’t realize that it’d be WAY expensive. (I go to University here, my family all lives elsewhere.)

The people I work with on night shift live right there, and all the lesson people leave after lessons and I still have to do evening feed, so getting a ride isn’t an option.

I wouldn’t feel so bad if my ‘big boss’ wan’t such a jerk. The barn manager is cool, but I have to talk to this other guy who doesn’t seem to know what the word empathy is.

[davidgud_equestrian_jihad]

Frankly I’m appalled, and a little ashamed too, because I’m a native Edmontonion.

I don’t know which barn you work at, but in my opinion there is just NO WAY that ANY barn should let a young woman sit by herself at a bus stop on an open stretch of highway at night by herself.

Yes, I know, Canada is still relatively safe, but the key word is “relatively”. It isn’t nearly as safe as it used to be.

I totally agree that you need to bring this subject up with the barn NOW. You need to have someone with you waiting at the bus stop.

(If you need any help, email me and I will get my sister in Edmonton to help you out with your case and situation. She’s a rider too and also has coached in and around Edmonton.)

All the best (and for Gawd’s sake deal with this NOW)

David G./Seoul ROK

[Chicago]

As a bus rider, I’ve had a few scary moments myself, but thanks to a short self-defense seminar I participated in, I learned how to think more logically about taking care of myself.

Here’s the basic gist: EVERYONE has a RIGHT to walk alone at night. JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE ALONE DOES NOT MAKE YOU VULNERABLE!!! We are not automatically victims. I want to go where I want to go without fear, and no-one is going to compromise my self esteem or personal safety.

Well, that’s a nice principle, but how to carry it out? Three steps.

First, you have to breathe. When you get frightened, your body automatically breaths more shallowly and quickly, and shoves necessary blood carrying oxygen to your limbs so that you can RUN. Unfortunately, this leaves you unable to think, because your brain gets a little oxygen starved. There is no way you can remember to fumble out that can of pepper spray and spray your attacker if you don’t have enough oxygen in your brain to think clearly. So BREATHE.

Second, think space. If anyone who seems moderately suspicious gets within 5 feet of you, start breathing and thinking. If someone asks you to make a call on a phone, keep space between yourself and them. To promote this space, you may need to get nasty. So, if you think someone is following you as you walk to your parking lot in the dark, change your speed a bit, cross the street, and see if they are still following. If they are, turn around, and scream at them, “Why the F**K are you FOLLOWING ME!?!?” If they know you aren’t afraid to rouse the neighborhood to your defense, they’ll back off fast. If they were an innocent passerby, they’ll think you’re weird, but that’ll be okay.

Step three: If someone is attacking you, and you can’t get away, you’re going to have to fight back. Make your hand into an “L” shape (you know, kinda like the ‘loser’ sign), and smack the middle of that L right into the middle of your attacker’s throat. If they’re a real psycho, kicking them where it hurts won’t help. PAIN WILL NOT STOP A PSYCHOPATH. A quick blow to the throat closes their windpipe, and if they can’t breathe, they can’t attack you. Self defense courses often tell people to poke their attacker in the eyes, but seriously, I wouldn’t stick my fingers into someone’s eyes. It’s a psychological stigma that you don’t want to have to battle when you’re being attacked.

Wow. That was really long, but I think it’s someting women should know about. So, if you’re being attacked think: Breathe, Space, Throat.

Yoikes.

P.S. I also learned how to apply this to attackers with weapons, such as pipes, guns, and knives. If anyone’s interested, e-mail me. I’m not sure it really belongs on this forum.

[Caros_Folks]

No One should make you do stuff that makes you fearful of your safety. I know that the job is important to you but, God forbid something should happen as you suggested-is the job worth that much?? I don’t think so.

I think that you should think about some kind of alternative time schedule and then suggest it to your employeer in a very non-threatening way you might be surprised at how it will be received.

You live in Canada and I in the U.S. so I don’t know the Labor Laws up there so I can’t say if the ‘Can’ fire you. I would think not, but they would probably come up with some other BS excuse if they wanted to get rid of you.

My advice…Try calm, rational talking and tell them how you feel.

[coco]

You’re Canadian??? Ever hear of a guy called “Paul Bernardo”?!?!

There are creepos who cruise in their cars looking for girls alone like you. What ever happened to Chandra Levy??? For goodness sakes woman, no horse or job (or anything else for that matter) is worth putting your safety at risk.

Life is not fair…women can NOT go out alone at night. Let’s not pretend that we can defend ourselves alone…we cannot.

Go ahead and attempt to quit your job and tell them why…I would be willing to guess your employer will then accomodate your needs since – in my experience – trying to find barn help is the next-hardest thing to trying to win the lottery.