“My point is that it might be a good idea to cross an Arab to a warmblood from the Arab breeders side of it. I am just not so sure that it is a good idea from the warmblood breeders side.”
Let’s see. A couple well known warmbloods with arab influence include:
Inschallah
Matcho
Rubenstein (through Ramzes)
Bolero
(Also, regardless of what you believe, the Europeans do consider Trakehners to be warmbloods. The other warmbloods are heavily influenced by Trakehner blood. In the US, the GP stallion Moronjo goes back just 2 generations to the trakehner Mahagoni.)
“The link by the previous poster is a case in point. It admits that a purebred is not a good choice for open competition.”
There’s more to dressage than competition. And many arabs do well in open dressage competition. In the right hands arabs can be competitive with warmbloods. The breed of choice for someone aspiring to international competition? Obviously not. (Although Harry Boldt did ride an anglo-arab, REmus, to individual bronze back in 64 I think.) But being a good dressage horse and being a top competition dressage horse are not synonymous. You won’t see a lot of lipizzaners at the Olympics either. My own old arab was schooling FEI at home…I just didn’t have the resources to compete him. When I did, he held his own.
“It goes on to say that a cross gives you your best chance at success.”
Which is what this thread is about. Is there a good reason to cross warmbloods with arabs? The F1 cross can give you the best of both worlds.
“The problem with the cross is you don’t really know if it was a successful refinement until you are atleast 3 or 4 generations down the road.”
Um, not exactly. Shagya breeders say that the F1 cross often loses size, but by F2 the size is back. The reason they prefer to keep the arab further back in the pedigree is to keep up the size. That is more likely the reason the European warmblood registries also prefer the arab lines further back.
Arabs are very prepotent, so their qualities persist generation after generation. You don’t need to keep re-introducing arab lines every generation to maintain the influence. Where do you think Rosenthal gets that beautiful head and neck that he stamps all his foals with? Where do so many Rubenstein-line get their arabian head and body types from?
On the subject of Rosenthal, just take a look at High Point Hanoverians home page. They’re offering breeding specials to arab mares because the first half-arabs by Rosenthal have been so successful.
If I were breeding a hanoverian mare, I probably would stick with a warmblood stallion because the resulting foal would likely be worth more on the market (not necessarily a better horse, and very possibly not as nice…just perceived as worth more), and I’m too old to be planning for F3 and F4. On the other hand, if I were part of a multi-generational family of breeders, I would do what was best for my family’s long-term goals…and that could easily involve re-introducing arab blood as needed.
On the other hand, if I were breeding an arab mare I would seriously consider breeding half-arab warmbloods. The F1 cross would likely be competitive in the half-arab sporthorse world and possibly be equally competitive in open competition.
