Warmblood x Welsh Cob - would you?

[Daventry]

@MysticOakRanch

But isn’t that part of why people are considering such a cross? A smaller horse with a better brain for the rider who doesn’t want quite as much of a challenge? MOST riders of small horses and ponies are looking for an easier ride - that is why I got such a deal on my Welsh Cob cross… He wasn’t such an easy ride, and everyone who was looking at that size wanted something easy - they had tried Warmbloods and wanted something easier!

And while some of the well known cobs (like Cardi) are fabulous in the show ring, if you ask the riders, they won’t tell you they are an easy ride. We have a couple of nice cobs in this area that are super nice, going higher then 2nd level, and they are both very tricky rides for experienced riders. They do not suffer fools lightly, is a quote I’ve heard more then once. I think that is ExVet’s point too.

This is a great explanation! We breed Section D Welsh Cobs. I have come across enough of them over the years to know they are not all “easy.” There are certain lines that I just will not have in my barn…not if you gave them to me for free! Other bloodlines, I love the easy going temperament that comes with them. We currently have a lovely Section D Welsh Cob broodmare in the barn that is easy everything. Her babies are also easy everything, at home and in the show ring. We also had this mare’s dam in our barn for a few years and that mare was the same too…which is why I jumped at the chance to purchase the daughter when given the opportunity. As a result of her fabulous temperament (she is nicely built, good mover too), we have decided to cross her with Apiro this year and hope to produce a lovely Warmblood x Welsh Cob cross with a great temperament.

In some ways, Cardi doing as well as he has in the dressage ring has been both a blessing and a curse for Welsh Cob breeders. He has helped raise the profile of the North American Welsh Cob in the dressage ring. The curse, many Welsh Cob breeders have omitted to educate potential buyers in regards to the pros and cons of the breed and what different bloodlines might bring to the table. They are not all created equal. As a result, we are extremely careful what we bring into our barn for breeding.

[soloudinhere]

@KyrieNZ

I would appreciate any links to Welsh/Warmblood crosses, ie Facebook pages, studs etc, to further my research. Thanks

My filly is by Smoke Tree Snapdragon (Sec B welsh) her full brother (1/2 welsh, 1/2 wb - dam is 1/2 tb) is a fully licensed stallion who is 6 this year.

Solomon Farm (her breeder, and stallion owners) does many of this cross. www.solomonfarm.com

here she is as an early 2yo, just turned 2 the week this was taken:

http://i.imgur.com/6r9LahG.jpg

[Pocket_Pony]

@MysticOakRanch

But isn’t that part of why people are considering such a cross? A smaller horse with a better brain for the rider who doesn’t want quite as much of a challenge? MOST riders of small horses and ponies are looking for an easier ride - that is why I got such a deal on my Welsh Cob cross… He wasn’t such an easy ride, and everyone who was looking at that size wanted something easy - they had tried Warmbloods and wanted something easier!

And while some of the well known cobs (like Cardi) are fabulous in the show ring, if you ask the riders, they won’t tell you they are an easy ride. We have a couple of nice cobs in this area that are super nice, going higher then 2nd level, and they are both very tricky rides for experienced riders. They do not suffer fools lightly, is a quote I’ve heard more then once. I think that is ExVet’s point too.

I was never interested in a WB. I got my pony from exvet because I was looking for a pony/hony and I was also looking at other small breeds (connemara, Morgan, quarter pony, other Welsh crosses). It wasn’t necessarily because I wanted an easier ride…I never had a pony as a kid and I wanted one! I don’t mind difficult horses, but I would not call my pony difficult per se. She is sensitive. You can’t push her like you might push another horse, so if you are a coarse or rough rider or think you can make her do anything, you’ll lose the battle of wills!

I have often thought of breeding her because she is so wonderful in her temperament, has lovely conformation, is very sporty, versatile, and likes to get along. I’d love another just like her. I don’t know if I ever will, but I give major props to the thoughtfulness of what went in to producing her. I’d definitely ask exvet if I were seriously considering it, as I know she has done her homework on bloodlines.

I will say that I would be very careful about anyone I’d ever let on my pony. Not because she is naughty, because she is not, but because she learns so quickly I think others may be tempted to push her too far too fast. I’d probably actually put more of a beginner on her because they wouldn’t ask too much and she wouldn’t try to take advantage.

[ecileh]

@exvet Replica is who I meant, yes. Just had a minor brain fart while typing that post.

I believe Tomas is back in Canada and retired from breeding now, though I am not 100% sure on that. I know that Ashland had him for a while a few years back and that he “went home” (which I think is somewhere in Canada).

I’ve known and ridden quite a few Thomas babies over the years (both pure and crosses) and, yes, they are not what I would call “easy” rides, but none of them have been problem children, either. Of course, all have come through the program at my barn, so they were handled and trained well.

[exvet]

Yes Tomas is in PEI now.

[snaffle1987]

I like the Connemara cross idea. They are lovely. I have always appreciated the lovely type of Connemara that shows up in the Irish posts on facebook.

I wouldn’t ever say a Welsh pony, regardless of what section it is, is an easy ride. They are highly intelligent which can make them seem difficult. You are not breeding to an irish draught, you are breeding to a welsh cob. Yes, they can “intelligent” but I would not call them dangerous, spooky, or flighty like warmbloods; they are just, well, smart. I would not buy or breed to a Cob thinking that I am getting a trail pony of an offspring.

If you are a solid rider with a solid trainer to work with; by all means breed to a talented; good brained Cob. Start them young and be consistent; this is the basis of all success. Vet the stallions you are interested in. Too many see a stallion with lots of glitz and glamour to their show record and just breed to it. If you cant handle a smart youngster; this doesn’t bode well.

If your mare has the movement and type that you like; I’d be more willing to breed to a good, solid cob with an excellent temperament who maybe lacks a bit in the “flashiness of movement” category.

I would not discount cobs out entirely because some are difficult, I believe Quillane Apollo, who was mentioned somewhere in this thread has been known to be difficult as well? He IS a Thomas son but his dam was a very lovely individually if my old memory serves me correctly.

I do think that Quillane’s other 2 stallions; Nebo Knight Ryder and Auryn (also a Thomas son) would be worth looking into. Auryn has always been the type to be willing, quiet and easy going whereas Apollo has the pizzaz and style but maybe not the dead quiet mentality.
I have always admired Ryder. I don’t know if he’s available for breeding. He is one of those cobs who can do whatever task you put him to.

Good luck with your search

[exvet]

Gallod Auryn…out of a very nice mare too. Yes Quillane Apollo is out of a very nice dam. Did you ever meet Apollo’s full sibling, Quillane Pryderi, who stood at stud for a while? Absolutely stunning but also an interesting welsh cob to be sure.

Welsh Cobs are a breed unto themselves. Not for everyone; but, if you’ve been blessed with a true partnership with one (or many more) I’m not sure anything is ever the same.

[soloudinhere]

@Blugal

A little off topic but here is my 2 year old Welsh section D x TB. He is 16.2hh and growing… very laid back although I’m told by owners of full and half siblings that they wake up when you start jumping. The Welsh stallion has produced numerous FEI offspring in eventing, up to CCI4* level.

Who is the stallion? I am looking for one for my older mare.

[Man_in_Black]

@Daventry

As a result of her fabulous temperament (she is nicely built, good mover too), we have decided to cross her with Apiro this year and hope to produce a lovely Warmblood x Welsh Cob cross with a great temperament.

Eeeep! Can’t wait to see that cross!

[3phase]

Exvet is right - you’re going to get a different foal if you breed to either Welsh (A ,B) compared to a Cob. A friend of mine is Eventing Cob/TB x’s at a high level and they are super awesome! However, confirmationally, not the easiest to put together, as they tend to be a big long in the back and some don’t have a nice sloping shoulder for good movement. Although, they do tend to find a ‘fifth leg’ in pony style! If you’re considering something with good confirmation, good movement and jump, a lot of color, guaranteed, I’d breed to The Key. Sec. B and is stamping his foals with nice confirmation, temperament and of course color. Has foals out of TB, Warmblood, Appy, and pony dams right now. I am looking to breed my Warmblood/TB mare to him. She’s 16’2, he’s 13’1 so hard to say what size I’d get.

[exvet]

Gosh I haven’t heard about The Key in a long time. Nice to know he’s still doing well and people appreciate what he produces. Just to be totally transparent, I have seen very well conformed WB x Cob crosses but it was the result of experienced breeders who knew what they had on both sides going back a few generations and they followed the breeding type-to-type rule. I still do think you are likely to get a more ‘sport-type’ and prettier animal breeding to something like The Key or Daventry’s section B stallion with a wider range of mares and body types than breeding to a Welsh Cob. The Welsh Cob x TBs I’ve had were well built/excellent conformation; but, the mare that we bred to was not only well proven over fences she was built like a brick sh!thouse and looked more warmblood than TB. She also was shorter coupled with an absolutely lovely neck and a head/face that made you think Welsh Pony…We got pretty, talented and color in those crosses using two different welsh cob stallions.