WEG Pratoni 2022

[FrittSkritt]

@Texarkana

We send the same people outing after outing because they are not only our best, they also have the most horse power.

It seems like nowadays you have to have a minimum of 2 horses to even be considered. Gone are the days where we had many solid riders with only one mount they’ve had for years - now it’s all about who is the soundest at that day and time.

I think Boyd and Philip are spectacularly talented riders. But it does seem like they go through horses quickly, and I think that’s part in due to pressure to run and as much as possible to prove themselves.

It also doesn’t help that our best riders are running in Area 2 - notorious for its rock hard footing in summer. I don’t know whether the area has always been like this or these droughts are a result of climate change, but I’m always surprised to see these big name horses running I/A in July when I don’t even like to go Novice because the ground is too hard. Can’t be good for long-term soundness.

[Texarkana]

I don’t like a lot of what USEF has been doing. But when it comes to investing in riders for team competition, it seems like you are going to get a better return on your investment if you consider riders with a deep string of horses first.

We as humans all love the underdog stories: the riders who came from “nothing” to reach the top. But a lot of times those riders fade from the leaderboard once their big horse retires. The team puts a lot of money into preparing these people for the games, yet they might only make one or two appearances ever. It would be wonderful if owners with deep pockets gravitated to these underdog riders to keep them well mounted, but that doesn’t seem to be what happens.

So I get why wanting riders with multiple competition horses coming up the ranks would be a big priority in today’s economy.

[Larksmom]

Thomas and Z have been around for at least 4 years each. I don’t remember a lot of Phillip’s horses, but several of Boyd’s have been older. In fact, his newest, Federman is already 15 or 16. He had Remington who was older, and Steady Eddie who was bad at dressage, but went around Burghley in only 1 second over time and clear. He was sound until he retired at 19. I do think the footing over here is much harder than overseas, I am thinking especially of the UK. Probably easier to keep high level horses sound overseas.

[Xctrygirl]

I agree that we miss out on the 1 superstar rider/duos.

In the past Gina Miles got to be on the team with McKinlaigh

Becky and all her greys got to go to team stuff.

Amy Tryon

Dorothy and Molokai

I mean everyone with multiple horses started as someone with one horse. I think it’s incredibly short sighted to not see the correlation between giving a person a shot, and attracting owners to them if they do well enough. Hell…I see a TON of people with owners who I wouldn’t let pet my dogs. Owners can help anyone, but how about we help the actual good riders.

Em

[Texarkana]

@Xctrygirl

I mean everyone with multiple horses started as someone with one horse. I think it’s incredibly short sighted to not see the correlation between giving a person a shot, and attracting owners to them if they do well enough. Hell…I see a TON of people with owners who I wouldn’t let pet my dogs. Owners can help anyone, but how about we help the actual good riders.

I’m not saying I agree with it. We will totally miss out on the superstar combos, probably to the detriment of the podium, if that is indeed how we continue to operate. I’m just saying economically, I understand why people riding for wealthy ownership is an attractive situation. The sport has changed a lot in the 21st century, especially the cost of it.

Once upon a time, owners were in it partly for the greater good of the team. Now they fund their own riders. I think that shift hurt us a lot, especially when so few can afford to go it alone anymore.

[FitToBeTied]

The problem with the multiple horses argument is that it becomes a circular argument. E.g. To get on the team you have to have multiple horses. Owners who want to be sure that they get to the Olympics or WEG are going to support people who already have multiple horses. So those with multiple horses get to get more horses.

[Jealoushe]

@Xctrygirl

I promise you the worst things I have seen were in the hands/barns of Olympians and REALLY expensive Hunter trainers with HUGE followings.

My barn, no cheating things.

The worst offensive item I have is 4x4 rails.

But in eventing a dangling front end is dangerous. So I get why its important to either try to fix that, or have the horse move to a less dangerous discipline.

Em

Thats gross and unfortunate about those barns. I am lucky to have not been around it but once at my coachs when I was a teenager and I stopped riding with her not long after.

Yes horses that hang their legs either need to be taught how to jump or find a new career lol

[Jealoushe]

@FrittSkritt

I think Boyd and Philip are spectacularly talented riders. But it does seem like they go through horses quickly, and I think that’s part in due to pressure to run and as much as possible to prove themselves.

I think BM does for sure but maybe not PD does not imo. Z has been around a while, hes also 6/6 clears at 5* now.

[Jealoushe]

Federman B is a new ride to Boyd still. He was competing FEI with his owner who passed away in a schooling accident since 2017.

They spent almost a quarter of a million on Blackfoot Mystery for BM and that horse was not around long at all.

4 or 5 years isn’t really that long when you see riders like the Prices have been eventing their horses for 10 years + FEI.

[Jealoushe]

@Texarkana

specially when so few can afford to go it alone anymore.

I think this is really the issue with the one offs now. Who can afford the $50k tickets to go overseas and even just campaign an upper level horse when they aren’t already big time? Not many.

[Texarkana]

@Jealoushe

@Texarkana

specially when so few can afford to go it alone anymore.

I think this is really the issue with the one offs now. Who can afford the $50k tickets to go overseas and even just campaign an upper level horse when they aren’t already big time? Not many.

Do you listen to RideIQ podcasts ever? I know one rider (not a secret, just not a name particularly relevant to this convo) was selected as the individual rider for one of the nations cups this summer, but to go she had to pay her own expenses to get her and her horse over there. This rider does have pretty big owners behind her, but she and her owners decided it wasn’t worth the trip.

If the people with wealthy owners can’t even justify the cost, how on earth can the “mere mortals” do it?!?

[Jealoushe]

Yes I do! and exactly. There are some with serious backing who are lucky. The rest…stuck at home with their potential.

[BraveSC]

Boyd actually got the ride just last year on Bruno…Annies accident was last summer which makes their accomplishments together all that much more impressive!

[Jealoushe]

Yes I still consider that new is all I meant!

[Larksmom]

why was Blackfoot Mystery retired? Was he lame or just not good enough in dressage or did he just find better horses? Most of Boyd’s horses until recently haven’t been very good in dressage.

[Jealoushe]

Soundness issues

[Xctrygirl]

Nope. Annie died July 14th, 2021. She’s been gone 1 year, and 8 weeks.

She did not die in 2017.

Bruno went to Boyd because he helped train her.

Em

[Marigold]

@Jealoushe

Federman B is a new ride to Boyd still. He was competing FEI with his owner who passed away in a schooling accident since 2017.

@Xctrygirl

Nope. Annie died July 14th, 2021. She’s been gone 1 year, and 8 weeks.

She did not die in 2017.

I believe Jealoushe’s post meant that Bruno has been competing at FEI levels since 2017, not that Annie died in 2017.

I get the sense that loss may be personal to you - my sincere condolences if that is the case. By all accounts, she seems to have been a wonderful rider and person, and it is lovely that her trainer has able to carry on her dream with her horse in her memory.

[Xctrygirl]

Very close to someone I am close to.

Like I didn’t have to google the day she died.

When I reread what @Jealoushe typed, I see what she was trying to say. Just missing a comma.

Em

[FrittSkritt]

@Jealoushe

They spent almost a quarter of a million on Blackfoot Mystery for BM and that horse was not around long at all.

I thought that was Shamwari?

But yeah, I can name a few other that didn’t hold up… Otis Barbotiere, BM, Ray Price, Trading Aces, Pancho Villa… But I think Boyd rides/has ridden more horses than PD because he couldn’t really afford to be picky when he was trying to really establish himself and not just the “new guy.”