I recently posted a blog about using whips with horses (NOT ABUSE IMO), and i got lots of … negative feedback from people who Don’t Approve. I’ve figured out that people have strong opinions and they’d rather give their opinion than read mine. So!
I’ve made a google poll about whips. And I’d appreciate it if everyone could take a minute (it’s just 3 questions) to give me their opinion on whips.
Here’s the poll: https://forms.gle/hv1yF53L2kxKvzNt9
and TIA!
There are probably other whip use comment threats here, and I will look for them later (and add blog link)… probably better to continue them than to start another discussion here but I don’t care really, I just want your opinion in my survey!
Is the blog still posted? I’d love to read it!
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Well, obviously a whip can be used in many different ways. I use it extensively in ground work as an extension of my arm and a pointer but if I’m out without a whip I can use my arm or lead rope. The cue for my mare to lie down is to drag the longe whip over her back. Then click and treat. I once had a clicker trainer coach tell me the “optics” of using the longe whip as a cue were bad. But that’s our cue and I haven’t had any luck replacing it with another cue. I just mention this as an extreme example of using a whip in a completely non abusive fashion.
As far as a whip for riding, for me it’s a balance between having my hand a little too full and having some extra aid precision. My coach wants us to keep the horse fast off the leg by following the leg aid with a tap tap of whip if the horse sucks back. It works and is not cruel!
My own mare is pissy about the whip but OK about being slapped by long western reins. So I have attached a flash strap to the end of our buckled English reins and I slap those around a bit and make noise when she gets stoppy, usually just at the start of a ride before she gets her head in the game.
I did follow through to the blog and it seems sensible and well written :). But I probably wouldn’t follow it because it’s saying things I already know. So the audience problem for the OP is if they are writing a well informed blog aimed at beginner or intermediate riders, that’s who will follow and the chance of getting beginner or even nonridrers posting stupid replies is greatly increased.
I don’t think any advanced or pro rider would say there is no role for a whip at all, even if they don’t use one on their horses. And note that Western riders typically don’t carry a whip because they have t
the long reins if needed. So it could be a discipline specific thing where beginner Western riders have no exposure to the usefulness of a long dressage whip in schooling lateral moves with clarity.
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I did your survey.
I ride with a clinician who teaches Equitation science, and the whip is an important tool to help the horse learn to be lighter off leg and hand. The theory/science is that strong rein and leg aids are more stressful for the horse than whip taps. Its also easier to recreate the same ground work whip taps from the saddle vs leg aids.
That said, my mare is very light, so I rarely carry a whip with her (perhaps lazy on my part), but I am more likely to carry on my green gelding. With my students, I prefer they carry a crop, but I don’t enforce it.
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I did the survey too. Whips have their place as both a training tool and in certain ( rare) occasions are used as a method to discipline. No matter what they should be used with a clear head and an experienced hand.
Too many times we see them used as a way to beat the horse senseless, causing more problems than the horse had at the start. In those cases it should be used on the handler in the same fashion…
I had a trainer tell me once that you can drop a whip, but you can’t drop spurs. I haven’t put a pair of spurs on since then, but I’ll almost always carry a whip/crop. There are some ‘training aids’ I’m fairly against, but whips, not so much.
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But you can easily not use your spurs while still wearing them …
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I always carry a whip when riding young/green ponies. I never “beat” them with it, but if I need an encouraging “you can go over this jump” kinda tap on the shoulder a stride before a jump, I find it just helps them get the idea of forward. If I don’t need the whip, no problem (I rarely need it), but at least I have it just in case (same idea as spurs).
And of course for driving it is against the rules to not carry a whip (you will be eliminated!). We actually tape a spare whip on the side of our carriage when we do our marathon as you must have one in hand to enter an obstacle or cross the finish line or you’re done! A whip can easily be caught in a tree or taken out of your hand by a moving tail.
It is the extension of our leg since we don’t have one on the ponies. Its used slightly differently, for bending mainly. But we also use if for forward motion, especially when driving a pair (or more) as one pony can be already forward and one could be sucking back. You don’t want to “cluck” as it just makes the one that is already forward, more forward. So we use the whip to encourage the sucked back pony to go forward. Again, never “beating”. 3 lashings in a row will get you eliminated as well, so there are strict rules for whip abuse in driving.
This is true, and I should hope that the ones who choose to wear them do in fact have a steady enough leg to be able to wear them and under any circumstance never accidentally put them on the horse when it was not the intention of doing so…BUT…How many times do you see little kids, shoot even new riders with weak legs, with spurs on…horse jumps forward, rider grips with heels…end scene. And by what you wrote, you are implying that you have NEVER been taken by surprise by a spooked horse and accidentally caught them with a spur…if so, that’s awesome. I wish that I could say the same. I trust my leg, with and without spurs, but I can’t say I’ve never gotten jostled in the saddle and made a mistake.
Anyways, I thought is was an interesting way of putting things. I’m not against spurs. I haven’t been in a place where I have needed to use them since then. The trainer was responding to my questions on working with horses that we were taking from harness work and putting them under saddle. The horses were more used to commands involving whip cues, and she said that in passing since neither of us were sure what the horses were going to do once we got on them. I just found what she said to be fairly non-arguable. In a bind, I can drop one thing, but I can not do that with something that is attached to me.
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I drove for years, and of course always carried a whip. My driving ponies accepted it as a cue, because they were trained to do so. They also appreciated it as an occasional backscratcher. I didn’t show, so I could be pretty casual about things.
Rebecca
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Demonization of devices has been around for a long time in the equine world, particularly in some branches of the NH world (but not the ones that sell "carrot sticks).
A whip, properly used, will allow you to touch the horse beyond the length of your arm. This can be a Good Thing. It can also allow you to increase the force of that touch in appropriate circumstances. Also a Good Thing.
The spur allows precision placement of the heel in cuing the horse, a Good Thing. It also allows more force to be applied in appropriate circumstances; also a Good Thing.
They can also be useful to riders with a limitation. I’ve got some spinal stenosis that has caused a loss of strength in my right leg. My horse has figured that out and if he wants to evade then that’s the way he will go. While I can still employ extraordinary effort and restore authority it is difficult and sometimes causes inconsistency in other things. So I wear M1911 Cavalry Spurs like this. https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fonlinemilitaria.net%2Fimages%2FM1911Spur.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fonlinemilitaria.net%2Fproducts%2F278-US-Spurs-M1911%2F&tbnid=2gaCSlHN-3vz-M&vet=12ahUKEwiP48XTurvnAhVRSKwKHaPECfcQMygGegUIARC0Aw..i&docid=gqkk6yTP88xwQM&w=350&h=505&q=m1911%20cavalry%20spurs&ved=2ahUKEwiP48XTurvnAhVRSKwKHaPECfcQMygGegUIARC0Aw I replace the leather strap underneath with these https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fonlinemilitaria.net%2Fimages%2Fchain_M.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fonlinemilitaria.net%2Fproducts%2F5853-Spur-Chains%2F&tbnid=ERrnVnNMT0PLQM&vet=12ahUKEwiP48XTurvnAhVRSKwKHaPECfcQMygzegUIARDGAg..i&docid=wdro_UeA4CSPgM&w=400&h=259&q=m1911%20cavalry%20spurs&ved=2ahUKEwiP48XTurvnAhVRSKwKHaPECfcQMygzegUIARDGAg My seat is secure enough the I don’t touch with the spur unless I intend to.
Nothing wrong with using aids like this correctly.
G.
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whips and spurs are both just a refinement of the leg aids. I am just begining (like, three rides) trying to get 2 tempis - we get them one direction, the other he waits a stride to change. So I am reinforcing my leg aid with the whip and gee, there is the change. I will, of course, work to not need the whip…
There is a link to the blog at the end of the survey.
I answered your poll questions. I thought the poll questions were well thought out. Hope you will share the end results here!
There are certain questions I would never bring up on social media for just that reason – people have a wide range of strong opinions, and every one of them owns the only ‘right’ opinion !!! 
:winkgrin:
Years ago I decided that the word ‘whip’ has a bad connotation with many people. And that those pre-conceptions are a real problem with the word ‘whip’. Pre-conceptions that may have nothing to do with what is actually going on at that moment with this item of horse management.
So I changed my term from ‘whip’ to ‘arm-lengthener’. :yes: If I had a telescoping fully-flexible arm, I probably wouldn’t ever need a ‘whip’. 
What I want is an arm design not seen outside of cartoons. :winkgrin:
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And by the way, the horse has no idea about all of our ideas, prejudices, pre-conceptions and misconceptions about a whip. They just know their own experience with it, be it benign or hurtful.
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@DiamondJubilee you beat me to it!
A whip is an aid. Badly delivered aids are bad, accurately delivered aids are good. Period.
And the driving whip reinforces the go and the bend because voice doesn’t always work and it surely doesn’t work without reinforcement. And for anyone who thinks you can loosen the reins and slap your horse on the back with reins, that is abusive. You’ve dropped the horse completely, utterly abandoned him when you lose all contact, and then you give him a mystery request? Most people (who are reasonably fluent in the sport) see the value of a whip when you have no legs, but the whip doesn’t change from the horse’s perspective… Riding or driving, it’s the same.
But I do feel the challenge of the sensitive horse. My guy has never had a misused whip aid, but OMG he’s such a sensitive pony! He LEAPS into the lightest feather off a lash. And for the longest time I could only used the dressage whip at walk work. Some of that was definitely due to MY weakness in holding/effectively using the whip, but even as I developed the strength to use it effectively, he was still a bit dramatic. I would carry it as long as I could, then set it aside when he started to lose it. It took about 18 months before I made it through an entire ride. As for driving, I pick and choose my moments to apply more than a tickle of the lash so I don’t have him leaping into transitions, but it’s the same process. It’s an aid and he needs to respond appropriately.
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I am all for buggy whips and riding crops under the right circumstances. I have one horse that has to know I have the riding crop when I ride him.
I wonder what the naysayers would say about my other “long arm of the law”? My cane, lollol. I have found unbelievable uses for that bit of aggravation I now have to use:)
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Humans are handsy.
Ever notice even babies, before they can do much else, already grab something and wave it around and hit with it?
We never seem to outgrow that.
It is hard wired in us, as an extension of ourselves, our arms.
No wonder we also go there around horses.
Is in our nature to reach out and touch someone.
Whips as any other kind of stick enhances that ability.
Well, as with all things, “it’s complicated”.
If one drives horses, a whip is a necessity, if for no other reason than you are without two key aids that a mounted rider has - seat and leg - and thus you need another way to communicate clearly. That, and you need something that will give the horse the impetus to go forward in a tough situation. Nothing scarier than a cart horse going over backwards.
For under saddle or ground work, they can be handy in getting across a point, but shouldn’t become a crutch and should never be used to inflict pain or punishment. I don’t agree with the OP in her blog where she states that there is a place for punishment in horse training, but I am also really not a fan of talking about how horse think using terms like “operant conditioning” because it ascribes a “negative” or “positive” to something a horse does and moves into territory of categorizing horse’s communication as isolated “behaviors”.
I always always always have a whip when I am working a horse. On the ground, in the tack, always. My whip is just an extension of me - I can use it to define my space, get attention by creating a bit of energy, give an actual aid, etc. Can they be cruel? Sure can! Can anything be cruel? pretty much.
Sometimes I have a horse who is very whip reactive/fearful - one of the first things I do with those creatures is to re-shape their understanding of a whip as just a communications aid, not a scare beating implement.
