What do you expect out of a jumping lesson?

[equestrian13]

At my first & favorite barn I rode at, we had a great program & instructor.

During jumping lessons (usually groups of 2-3), we would receive full instruction on the flat (haunches in, transitions, no stirrups), do interesting exercises over poles (canter circles, trot poles), and then fun jumping (several different/interesting solid 3’+ courses, sometimes a make-your-own-course, a mock-equitation final, fun ideas like no-hands through gymnastics, creative gymnastics/course combinations, new things every time).

Lessons lasted 60 minutes and often longer. We also had cross country jumps and would often school out in the field such as up and down banks or trotting/cantering up hills. The horses were fit, each lesson was a real learning challenge, and I felt like I got more than my money’s worth of instruction, time, and jumping practice.

Fast-forward to after I have relocated as well as experienced several different hunter/jumper barns, and I’m feeling like either my expectations are too high or these lessons are just not cutting it.

A normal lesson at several barns I have since ridden at: maybe 30 minutes, private, always in the ring (no field, no hills, no trails). Little flat instruction (you warm up yourself), no creative exercises or gymnastics. Basically you jump back and forth over a cross rail a few times to warm up, and then jump a couple low courses (often the same course twice with slightly higher fences). If you mess up, you may repeat a line or a jump, and then that’s basically it. Again, this is a similar scenario at multiple different barns.

Is this the norm for a jumping lesson nowadays? Do you expect more?

[CHT]

From what I have seen of students that have come to me from other barns (“A” barns) is that they don’t do much flat. They may be able to jump 3’0", but look at me blankly when I ask for a leg yield or Turn on the Forehand.

I think many barns don’t have a field to ride in, or don’t want their grass ring used outside of shows.

I think most coaches around here create good jumping exercises though.

[SnicklefritzG]

A good coach will keep you very busy throughout the whole lesson, with breaks as appropriate based on the skill and fitness of the horse and rider.

I think your gut feeling is already telling you what you need to know. The current lessons don’t cut it. I wouldn’t put up with that. What you described sounds more like “guided practice”, not a lesson.

In my jump lessons we warm up with any number of activities depending on whether we are working on me or the horse. Sometimes it’s equitation focused where I do work without stirrups or in two point (sometimes both!). Other times we do a lot of lateral work, shoulder-in, renvers, leg yield, etc.

Jumping exerciseds are always given a purpose. It isn’t simply, jump this thing over here or jump this course. There is always an explanation given as to what we are doing and why we are doing it. There is always a focus every single time.

[midstride]

My favorite lessons were those that involved making up my own eq flat test or course. It was a way to challenge myself.

[BITSA]

For me a private lesson is 30 minutes and group is 60 (with 2-3 riders). Sunday is a pure flat day for everyone (and if you miss that flat day your next day riding is a flat day). For jumping days we almost always do some warm up with the flat–usually specific to the horse or rider’s needs (for me–a lot of exercises to assist with straightness, or left side bulging). Then we jump. Again, it will depend on your level and aspirations, but the jumps always have some purpose. Bending lines versus straight lines, rollbacks to help with using the outside rein, adding or leaving out strides down a line. I will say its very rare for someone to ride for more than an hour; our trainer frowns on time beyond that as being too much for the horse.

Sometimes I would like to do more gymnastics and other mock-show type activities. But I rarely feel, if ever, that there isn’t some purpose in the lesson that I need to learn.

[NurseHorsey]

I agree that it sounds like you already know the answer yourself.

But, to compare experiences, no, my lessons did not typically follow the fashion you describe. A group lesson generally lasted about 60 minutes (less if it was hot, never longer unless it was a large group or we were strolling between field jumps and the ring) and a private lesson usually lasted about 30-45 minutes. I usually take group lessons and there would be an overall goal for the lesson, such as bending work (with work on circles and bending vs. broken lines), accuracy in striding (do 5 strides in a line, do 6 strides in the same, ect.), even a whole jumping lesson focused on rollbacks. My last instructor was a bit old-school in his methods and I had a few lessons where I had a few sniff-ly moments because of the criticism and hard tasks but overall, I have always walked away from a lesson feeling that I either improved a skill or found a weak spot I needed to work on.

[triplethreat]

Am I the only one who does NOT want the flat stuff? With my old trainer I was ready to start jumping when she got there. Lessons were about 45 minutes but never timed. We were done when we were done. Sometimes that meant 30 minutes sometimes that meant an hour.

I’m not saying that if my trainer has something specific to work on on the flat I won’t do it. But don’t have me warm my horse up. I already did that before you got here, including lateral work which we do pretty much every ride.

I do not like the first 20 minutes of my lesson to be stuff that I already know how to do just for the sake of doing it. Like I said, if there a specific exercise for my horse that has a point, fine.

[pacific_jumper]

[QUOTE=triplethreat;7630394]
Am I the only one who does NOT want the flat stuff? With my old trainer I was ready to start jumping when she got there. Lessons were about 45 minutes but never timed. We were done when we were done. Sometimes that meant 30 minutes sometimes that meant an hour.

I’m not saying that if my trainer has something specific to work on on the flat I won’t do it. But don’t have me warm my horse up. I already did that before you got here, including lateral work which we do pretty much every ride.

I do not like the first 20 minutes of my lesson to be stuff that I already know how to do just for the sake of doing it. Like I said, if there a specific exercise for my horse that has a point, fine.[/QUOTE]

I think it all depends on the level you are riding. As above mentioned, some people are able to jump a three foot course, but don’t know what leg yeild means. If you have already mastered warming up your horse to jump and know how to do it properly, then I understand wanting to cut straight to jumping. For much that I have seen (myself included) I find that the flat is the weaked part of the training, and jump work suffers tremendously because of it. I do think if you are having a jump lesson, it is good to keep the flat fairly simple and focused on the task ahead. On the other hand, I see way too many kids that are unable to walk and halt in a straight line, yet are jumping courses.

[JenEM]

@triplethreat;7630394

Am I the only one who does NOT want the flat stuff? With my old trainer I was ready to start jumping when she got there. Lessons were about 45 minutes but never timed. We were done when we were done. Sometimes that meant 30 minutes sometimes that meant an hour.

Generally, I agree. But that’s because I take dressage lessons, and do my flatwork there. If I’m doing a jumping lesson, I expect to be on and warmed up by the time the lesson is to start. If I notice a specific issue during warmup or that we’ve been having in general that I think we might want to address with flatwork/a specific type of exercise, I’ll mention it to my trainer at the start of the lesson, where we usually chat for a minute to see if there’s something like that I want to address, or something specific I’d like to work on, etc. Generally my private lessons are 45 minutes, 1 hr if we’re doing semi-private or small group jump lessons.

For a lower-level lesson, say a group doing crossrails, or your typical up-downer lesson kids, yes, I’d expect some flatwork to start. For more experienced riders, no, I’d expect that they, like me, are able to warm themselves up and be ready to ride. I mean, I warmup and am ready to work at the start of a dressage lesson, too.

[bits619]

My lessons are usually 45-50ish minutes for a private lesson, an hour for group (2-4 riders). It includes the warmup on the flat, since that’s where most of us need work… Meaning, fixing the flat, getting that right, sets us up for the jumping to be much smoother. Warmup may focus on specific exercises like pole work, especially if it’s a group lesson, or general fixes for my own issues (hello wonky hips).
It’s not always a jump course we do, but usually is. Our ring isn’t very big, which is a blessing in disguise because we end up working on lots of bending lines, rollbacks, single quarterline fences. Our courses look a lot like jumper courses or handy hunters. I’m never bored with the courses or exercises we do in lessons, even if a sequence of jumps looks familiar, she will probably have changed the angle/placement of a few jumps to keep us thinking.

[BK6756]

OP- This is pretty much exactly how I felt after my move last year!

I was suprised to find barns that consider flat work to be just a warm-up on your own type thing. And I’m not talking about upper level riders- I’m talking about 2’ riders that would just wtc both directions for about 10 min and that was the extent of “flatwork”. It was VERY disappointing. In the end I kept looking and found something better, though a farther drive. It still isn’t quite what I used to have, but at least there is some semblance of flatwork included in the lesson.
I can understand upper level riders being comfortable doing all the flatwork on their own, but the VAST majority can certainly benefit from someone on the ground that can help improve their position, lateral work, adjustability, etc.

[foursocks]

As always it depends on the level of horse and rider, and their goals, and so on. When I was doing the junior hunters our flatwork was pretty basic, and that was what I did the rest of the week. When we got to the point where my horses were less green and more made up my weekly lessons were usually half hour jumping lessons. So, I warmed up on the flat beforehand and was ready to jump when my trainer/s stepped into the ring. We would focus on whatever jumping exercises were needed- full course prep for a show, bounces and gymnastics, whatever. Sometimes we would do a flat lesson just to work on equitation, for the medal classes, but by the time I was showing 3’6" my flat education for hunters was pretty good.

I do jumpers now and my lessons (having one later today! I need to remember to bring lots of water! :lol:) are EXTREMELY intense. We do dressage on the flat and then transfer what we’re working on to the jumping portion. Sometimes they are 50 minutes, sometimes 1.5 hours or more if there are two or three of us. I always get a lot of homework from each one which carries through to the next time I see my trainer. I have been training with him for a few years now and I’ve never left a lesson where I felt like I didn’t learn something, or have something clarified that I was struggling with, and I always enjoy myself.

[trubandloki]

I think it is hard to answer this question if you do not know if the lessons are a person riding their own horse or riding lesson horses.

My experience is that with lesson horses you do not get to jump the bigger jumps and more intricate stuff as the horses already work plenty hard enough and no reason for them to be doing all that extra work. If you want to do bigger jumps (over 2’-6") you have to buy your own horse.

[BK6756]

I don’t think it matters at all whether you are on your own horse or a lesson horse… having focused flatwork instruction where you can work on your position, transitions and lateral work and challenging/technical courses is important for the rider regardless of who owns the horse. They might be kept at a lower height if it’s a lesson horse, but that would be the only reasonable difference I could see.

[merrygoround]

[QUOTE=triplethreat;7630394]
Am I the only one who does NOT want the flat stuff? With my old trainer I was ready to start jumping when she got there. Lessons were about 45 minutes but never timed. We were done when we were done. Sometimes that meant 30 minutes sometimes that meant an hour.

I’m not saying that if my trainer has something specific to work on on the flat I won’t do it. But don’t have me warm my horse up. I already did that before you got here, including lateral work which we do pretty much every ride.

I do not like the first 20 minutes of my lesson to be stuff that I already know how to do just for the sake of doing it. Like I said, if there a specific exercise for my horse that has a point, fine.[/QUOTE]

How wonderful that you are so accomplished that your flatwork needs no critique. :lol: :lol: Makes me wonder why those dressage riders, and open jumper riders spend so much time on the flat. Silly me!!!

[PoohLP]

When I do two lessons a week (which I’ve been trying to do to get me horse over a little training hump we hit), one lesson is dressage and the other is jumping. If I’m not doing two lessons, I’ll normally alternate jumping/dressage weeks, unless there is something I’m really having trouble with on my own and then I might ask to work on that particular thing.

Unless something happens with my timing, on jump days, I try to get on 5-10 minutes early and do my warm-up so I am ready to start jumping when my lesson begins. If I can’t warm-up on my own before lesson starts, we’ll do a quick guided warm up focusing on getting the horse moving off my leg and ratable. We usually start jumping with a warm-up fence and then my trainer builds in whatever direction she thinks we need to work on that day. Sometimes we do full courses, sometimes we build trot fences, sometimes it is certain types of lines, gymnastics, getting a particular ride, etc.

Lesson lasts approximately 45 minutes, which is pretty standard for a private. A semi-private is usually about 60. Sometimes we go a little long, if there is something we get stuck on, sometimes we stop short if we nail everything and want to end on a good note. A horse should really only school hard for about 45 minutes (anything after that starts to get counter productive) and when it is very hot, the need to get out, get work done and get off is very important.

If we go to start jumping and discover we are having a flat problem (horse won’t rate/won’t move off the leg/is generally being an a-hole), we will take a detour and school through it (heck we’ve had days where we never got over a jump because the flat issues were preeminent), but in general, we don’t school flat heavily on jumping days, we school flat on flat days.

For her less advanced students or those without their own horses who only ride once a week, my instructor often does the half-n-half lessons, because they usually want a little jumping every lesson, which is perfectly understandable. I think you see these types of lessons more with beginners, kids and infrequent riders, because they both want and need a little bit of everything and because school horses don’t need to be jumping for 45 minutes, 5 times a week or more. But generally, as you move up the levels and move into horse ownership, the lessons become more specialized.

[findeight]

Oh, it matters. Lots of schoolies are older and the more difficult flatwork is…more difficult for them , especially under more novice riders where their temperament trumps talent and agility. Lessons are structured for the good of the school horse, some of that flatwork is as demanding on aging joints as jumping.

With personal horses, the lesson should be structured for that particular horse and rider. Typically, I did my own flatwork and took a 30 min private. Sometimes joined a group and did the group flatwork before jumping. And sometimes I did a flatwork only lesson either 30 min private or 1 hour group.

Most trainers are delighted at riders wanting more flatwork but ASK for it if you would like it. This assumes trainer knows how to do and teach it… Too many don’t these days and that’s a problem. But please ask for flatwork if you want it before assuming it’s not taught.

[triplethreat]

[QUOTE=merrygoround;7631020]
How wonderful that you are so accomplished that your flatwork needs no critique. :lol: :lol: Makes me wonder why those dressage riders, and open jumper riders spend so much time on the flat. Silly me!!![/QUOTE]

Snarky much? If I want a flat lesson I’ll pay for one with a dressage trainer. If I need a jumping lesson I’d rather get what I’m paying for. And btw, the reason dressage riders spend so much time on flat is because that is what their discipline calls for…since they don’t jump…at all…is that confusing to you? And do you know a lot of open jumpers? Because the ones I’ve known don’t do a lot of flatwork in their lessons either. Because they’re paying for someone’s expertise over fences, not for someone to tell them to do a shoulders in down the long side.

[Pennywell_Bay]

Agree with F8’s statement regarding lesson horses verses personal owned horses. Schoolies are generally used to teach the basics, inside, outside, inside, outside. Higher level schoolmasters may only do more difficult turns etc prepping for shows.

As an adult ammy, when I was boarding and in a regular program, my private lessons were maybe 30 minutes and if warmed up by myself. Save your snark, I’m not that good but my horse was and my BNT did not need to watch me go up down.

I have lesson in the flat, usually 30 minutes but they weren’t frequent.

Now on a green horse and not boarding to the trainers, it’s an hour private flat and jumping.

OP sounds miffed it is not OVER an hour. I guess you expect NOT to get paid if you work overtime? (Some of us are expected but are compensated in other ways). And yes, let’s make the lesson horse work extra so you can go do more. Totally reasonable. (Sarcasm font)

[Linny]

I was always taught that jumping is just flat work with periods of more significant elevation. If I am on a trainers owned horse or schoolie, I like to have at least some supervised flatwork to get the horse ready to jump, on his terms.
I see riders all the time who say “Yes, were are all warmed up” after WTC each direction one time around the ring. No asking for circles, no moving off the leg, no extend/collect cycles, no lead changes… Nothing. The trainer asks them to trot a fence and the horse is half asleep, not in the bridle, not “prepared” to jump or do what it takes to complete a course. That rider needs to understand that flatwork in preparation for jumping is not the same as going out for a hack on the trail or stretching his legs.

If the client really knows how to prepare a horse to do courses, that’s fine but keeping in mind that most of your courses are flatwork and the jumps are the result of flatwork, I’d prefer to have at least a short drill (and I mean drill) on the flat. I’ve never seen a clinician walk into the ring and begin the jumping. I prefer my trainer not to either.