I can think of a lot of reasons that horses might resist or, in any case, not comply with their riders’ signals:
confusing or contradictory aids
requests that are beyond the horse’s training
pain/discomfort
exhaustion
pent-up energy that impedes focus
“Disobedience” in the sense of willful refusal to do what’s asked, even when it’s fair and reasonable—
how common is it?
Or is the term a sort of throwback to the time when horses were thought of as always trying to “get away with something?”
After riding horses over 50 years and training my own horses your list of reasons for “disobedience” pretty well covers it.
Nowadays when a horse is “disobedient” I blame myself FIRST.
I now ride lesson horses. Many of them have holes in their training. I end up doing remedial training (hey horse, this IS an aid). I find the horses learn stuff quickly if I put it in a form they can understand and I praise enough when they successfully try something so that the horse has no doubt about what I am asking for the next time I use that aid.
Now I find most horses to be amazingly obedient in spite of my problems with my body from MS.
I dropped punishing a horse for “disobedience” a long time ago, because any “disobedience” is often because my aids are muddled, improperly timed to the movements of their hind legs, or the horse really has no idea of what I want. I blame myself.
The last horse I rode (and re-schooled) had deep seated disobediences to many aids (his favorites were balking or backing up, often rapidly). The poor guy, in his late twenties, never had anybody explain stuff clearly to him. It took a while but he ended up being a remarkably pleasant, obedient ride except that on some rare occasions when he would test me out. No problems, I know what I am doing and my riding teacher is in the middle of the ring anyway.
\The more I learn, and the older I get, the more I understand that horses are not “disobedient”. They are not human beings (why do we continue to expect them to act like us?)…they either don’t understand, or are not capable (age, injury) of giving us what we are asking for.
Horses do not hold a grudge, they are not disrespectful, they are not bullies…simply, they do not understand what we are asking. This is not a failure on their part, it is a failure on my part!!
100% this. So well said.
Horses are animals. Animals are not people. They are primarily driven by instinctive reactions. Not planned disobedience, as humans define it. That’s what I think.
As a railbird at a show I can hear people exclaiming that a horse ‘really hates that’, ‘doesn’t like the rider’, etc. Horses don’t really have the capacity for nuanced human emotions. I believe they do have deep emotions, but basic ones like fear and attachment. And mostly wound up with their need for security.
“What is disobedience?” Technically, it is any time we are giving an aid or ask, and the horse is not performing. Actually, objectively, I too have abandoned the idea that horses are disobedient for disobedience’s sake. I think they are actually motivated by what they have to gain for it – didn’t understand; avoiding work; veering off the line to go closer to The Gate, The Barn or their Friend Horse; that kind of thing.
I think a lot of not understanding is expressed in ways that humans interpret through human emotions because of the way it looks to us. Pinned ears, tail swishing, hesitating, backing away, resistance … I think their more forceful ‘disobedient’ behaviors are really frustration at the situation they are in, where they don’t know how to get a positive outcome, as they perceive it.
Gonna be prepared for folks to not all
like this answer but…while the list of reasons the OP listed are all correct, there are SOME horses who do develop some independent thought and can question/be disobedient for none of the listed reasons. For example–a young horse is learning to jump. It has been started correctly and calmly over small simple obstacles to build confidence. One day it realizes “hey person it might be easier to not jump this or just go around”. It poses this question to the rider, who then “replies” to the horse it is its job in fact to jump it. Discussion over. Horses are all individuals, with different personalities, temperaments and attitudes. Some are pleasers, some are testers. Some are confident and have opinions, some like the security of being told what to do. Being ridden to perform is work. A thinking horse may question if it really is required to do the work, even if it understands and is capable. Education of horses (or any animal imo) is a dialog or discussion, where the trainer must recognize the question they are posing to the animal, if the animal understands the question, how the animal answers and then what is the follow-up response from the trainer. This takes place ideally in every interaction.
This fits in with the larger point I think the OP is making, which is that very few horses are “disobedient” to be malicious. They are performing a behavior that makes sense to them in their individual contexts. They don’t understand, they are uncomfortable, they feel they have found a good trick to do something they’d rather do in the moment, or- as all of us who have ridden a horse on the first nice spring day can attest- they have too many feelings to contain inside one body, and need to perform an interpretive dance. 
Some horses certainly have a punk attitude and will put you on your head because it’s fun, but the vast majority are “exhibiting a disobedience” because it makes more sense to them than the alternative. Our job is to make the “obedient” behavior easy, preferable, enjoyable, understandable, and comfortable.
I think that part of the question, the discussion, is what does that “disobedience” really mean. Our interpretation of it, based on our personal backgrounds and experiences.
Once upon a time, I would call that “attitude”.
Now I would call that “instinctive response to an uncomfortable situation”.
Maybe both of those things are true. But if a human fixates on one over the other, it can affect how the human responds quite a lot.
If the human thinks “attitude”, we want to fix the horse.
If the human thinks “animal behaving like an animal in an uncomfortable situation”, we want to understand what is making the horse uncomfortable, and fix that. Riding. Lack of confidence. Flowers. Etc.
If we think “uncomfortable”, some things need better riding, some things need desensitization, whatever it is, then suddenly we have a willing performer.
Are we looking inside the horse or outside the horse?
I agree that none of the things you list are “disobedient”. If a horse is fresh, it’s not being disobedient in my mind. If it’s in pain or incapable or confused or tired - those are rider/human problems, not horse problems.
I don’t like the term. I think “evasion” is more accurate, although I think they may ultimately mean the same thing. In my mind, it means they understand the question and are capable of doing it, but either don’t want to or have figured out how to get around it.
I think if that’s the definition, evasion is pretty common. I know plenty of horses who can, and do, behave perfectly well for me and others on the ground and under saddle who don’t always for others because they have figured out how to evade doing the work.
It can be as simple as “being difficult” to bridle or stuff ears by throwing their heads in the air, but when you are calm and firm, they drop their heads for you. It can be as complicated as horse knows if it does x, it will intimidate human and it gets out of doing what it doesn’t want to do. Horses are smart, and the ones I know who like to evade test boundaries and when human fails, they win. I find most times if you don’t react, they realize they don’t have your goat and it goes away. They aren’t being naughty per se, they are just smarter than the human.
This is what I was trying to say, what I guess I would call “disobedience”, although I prefer to call it an evasion.
Anyways, I think most “disobedience” can be overcome through good horsemanship and riding.
I think people who expect horses to be machines who can’t figure out how to get out of what they don’t care to do should maybe find a different pastime.
While I agree for most horses, I have known plenty of horses who are disrespectful and bullies - to other horses and to humans. They are individuals with different personalities. There are dominant horses and there are insecure horses. There are horses who have screws loose. And some horses do indeed carry trauma and apparently hold a grudge. One of the chillest horses I know will try to take your head off if you are a farrier, but would snuggle you to death otherwise, no matter what you do to him. Tell me that’s not a lasting grudge/trauma.
Horses in the wild or in domestic herds will be very harsh with one another. The difference is that when they are disrespectful or bullying to one another, more often than not, it isn’t catastrophic (although it can be). When they disrespect humans? It can be dangerous and fatal much more easily.
That said, I don’t think a horse who doesn’t understand the question or who is being mistreated by a human is disrespectful. I just think it’s a little bit Black Stallion to paint them with such a broad brush.
I agree with the term “evasion” as well, because i don’t think it’s fair to ask a horse to work through pain, therefore I don’t see the response as disobedient- more so instinctive and communicative.
But to add to the list for a reason to evade:
Fear (instinctual responses to stimuli… ie. Spook)
Sexual excitement (stallions)
Very well put!
Yes to all you said, although I would argue that spooking isn’t always fear. It can be an evasion too. My horse is a notorious fake spooker. I like to say she’s “making excuses”… which is its own sort of evasion.
ETA, a recent example of said fake spook: Sees horse and rider approaching indoor from afar. Hears rider call “door”. Hears me call “you’re good”. Is facing door when door opens. Promptly loses marbles.
So … interpretation by the human mind … is that “disobedience” as in “I know what you want but I’m not gonna do it”, or is it an animal seeking the best advantage for itself, not through any sophisticated decision process, but just because that is how animals naturally react?
When they sense a weakness that could better their standing against others, meaning more food, more protection, etc. Not a decision but an instinctive drive. That’s imo.
But are they “disrespectful and bullies” – that’s how humans interpret such behavior – or are they just responding in an instinctive way to the situation in which they find themselves? Do they intend to smush the opposition, or just make sure they get the best position, with no real animosity toward the other horse? They just do what they have to do in the moment.
Are they initiating this behavior, or just responding to the situation created by humans?
My personal view is that horses don’t make many real ‘decisions’, as in, they evaluate a situation and decide to advantage themselves at the expense of others. I think it is more of an automatic response. Especially for a more assertive personality, more adrenaline driven, but without any thinking behind it.
I think so because this behavior is so consistent across horses. In the end, they can be difficult for us, but they are fairly predictable once you get to know what is driving them. Any surprises are usually another instinctive reaction to a not-normal stimulus.
I know a 16.1hh warmblood mare with a big warmblood body. She understands what her talented-but-small 10-year-old rider is asking. She doesn’t exactly rebel. She just delays responding for 20-30 seconds (half-trip around a small arena) and then does it half-heartedly.
My observation: The mare isn’t defying or evading the rider. The mare isn’t focusing on the rider at all. It is a horse’s instinct to be easily distractable. To be alert to everything all around. This small rider does not have the mare’s attention. The mare understands the aids but kind of says “I’m looking at something else right now, I’ll get back to you on that”.
When we work on keeping the mare focused on the rider, it’s amazing. The mare is suddenly pure gold! Does everything asked, with a will. (She has a good riding background by an older and more advanced former owner.) The mare is no longer registering everything all around her because horses have a limited span of attention, and she’s now thinking about the rider again.
In my mind, the mare is responding to her situation, her environment. Because horses are very reactive animals. Not because she has a ‘fu’ attitude.
If we change what they have to react to, we change their behavior. So is this “disobedience” really originating from a crafty horse, or just a horse that is responding in a horsey way to horsey things that humans don’t think about?
What does horse see when door opens? Does the horse understand what it sees? They don’t see what we see.
I’m not there so I don’t know. But maybe her eyes see a big white space that suddenly appears with a noise from the sliding door. And a moving shadow appears within it. She can’t see the “picture” a human sees, the background, the context - just the sudden big light area, etc. Along with a wave of new smells that are somewhat different each time.
She’s seen it before, BUT it’s a sudden change in what she was looking at just now. Horses are pre-programmed that everything unusual, every sudden change, could be life-threatening. She responds accordingly. As we would if a predator jumped out at us. It’s like a scary movie we’ve seen before. We know it’s coming, but we still jump. That is how I would likely interpret the situation.
Horses are so adaptable. Possibly with help she could learn not to fear the door opening.
I often think this! It’s normal in the wild and even in domestic herds for horses to use nips in play fighting, real fighting, or just “hey, get out of the way of the hay.” Usually, the worst is a minor mark on another horse’s skin. The same little nip can result in a human getting a nasty hematoma. Similarly, a frequent hard spook and (small) bolt in the wild can be just that–a little spook at something weird–and the horse goes on with his day. A horse that spooks hard enough to unseat most riders and runs to the other end of the arena at every windstorm or whenever the winter sun looks weird isn’t going to be anyone’s first pick to ride.
Disobedience is often learned behavior, IMHO, it’s just people aren’t always sure what they’re teaching, like riders who unintentionally yank back when they lose their balance, even if the horse is responding correctly (jumping). Some horses are more forgiving than others, though, and I do think some seem temperamentally more rewarded by work/pleasing the rider than others.
This is an interesting discussion. My 6 year old has been finding things (or no things) to look funny at; at the canter in particular. Doors, lights, things on the outside of the arena. Trainer thinks he could be to get out of work but I dont buy that, he never used to be bothered by this kind of thing. We’ve moved twice since Christmas and any my best guess is his confidence in his environment has taken a hit esp being young.
At first I just rode him through it but it was clear and that was making nothing better. So we are back to bonding and groundwork for at least a week or so. When I get back in the saddle, it’s going to be slow. This horse has previously worked his heart out for me and he clearly is concerned about things for some reason.
More likely your “fake spook” is because of stacking.
Your horse is anxious about what it is being asked to do, so things that normally only slightly cause concern, suddenly cause a great amount of concern.
It’s like horses have a “coping bucket” and the more full that bucket is with difficult riding questions, the less it has left for dealing with the leaf blowing across the arena.
It happens in people too.
It can also be due to the rider/ handlers missing the “little things” a horse can do during daily interaction to assert their dominance in the horse / handler relationship.
Say a horse is slowing encroaching in the handlers " personal space" or getting a bit pushy or allowed to pin their ears, or act aggressively in certain situations ( grooming/ saddling etc) .
If these behaviors are not attended to they can manifest into under saddle problems , which could be a refusal to do as asked and an overall disobedient attitude.
Hmm. It’s not a word I use in my daily horse life because it is not particularly useful.
If I were to define it, I would say it occurs when a rider gives a clear aid and the horse chooses to disregard it for their own physical or emotional reasons.
I would not include bucking spooking bolting etc as disobedience. That’s explosive instinctual behaviour.
So with my definition of disobedience the first thing you need to check is the timing and clarity of your aids, and on a more basic level if the horse actually understands them. If you ask politely again and the horse does not respond appropriately then you need to think about what physically or emotionally is impeding him.
When horses get used to aids, they respond reflexively with their bodies automatically. Touch and go. But if something hurts, they will hesitate. If the rider makes them uncomfortable they will hesitate. If they are afraid or nervous or excited, that may override reflexive response to an aid.
I feel like h/j has a get 'er done ethos where horses get pushed a bit because the potential consequences of running out or stopping are so severe for the rider (big ugly fall). And at the same time riders often have to steel themselves a little to face a bigger or newer jump. I think this can in some cases lead to pushing a horse through attempts to duck a jump that are chalked up to “disobedience” but are a pain or fear thing building over time. Even just of the rider slamming down on his back.
I did once ride an older barefoot mare who was quite spooky on the trails until I got her hoofboots. The anxiety over her feet hurting made her generally nervous. So the stacking anxieties is really really important to remember. Also a horse that feels it will get inadvertently punished for spooking may spook bigger and bigger because he is also running away from the rider slamming on the bit.
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