What would you do?

[shadesofbay3]

What would you do?

Apologies in advance for the LONG post, but I am going to try to give everyone as much background information as possible to help me

You can see my post history to help but in brief

-I already have a pretty messed up body from riding, multiple concussions, a broken vertebrae from a fall that still has my back not right

-I used to be a pretty confident, even good rider, but certain horses and situations in my past have led me to having a real lack of confidence and now I am extremely timid and fearful at times in the saddle

-After retiring my mare who I had for 14 years, I shopped with my trainer and wanted something younger and fancy that would be competitive in the local hunters. In March of this year I bought a younger import and long story short he and I were not a match. He ended up throwing me with a nasty buck and that really was the final blow to my confidence. I had no interest in staying with that horse and thankfully the seller not only took him back but offered me an even trade for something that seemed to be a much better match for me – another gelding that seemed much quieter, 6 years old, not 4, and had been around the block a bit more. Still green but doable, especially working with both of my trainers

I brought him home in July and things have been great so far. I know the money I spent was due to his age and because he is a warmblood, but he still isn’t even cantering successfully both directions without throwing some tricks in and has already needed to get PRP in his stifles. So that has been a little offputting to me.

On Friday I went out to ride. I was timid because I had been out of town for several days so I knew he had some time off and it was chilly. The horses had all stayed in also on Thursday night due to weather. But I lunged him, w/t in the indoor, and decided to go hack outside. Horses were being turned out (never been an issue before) and they were going nuts in their fields. All I was doing was walking when out of nowhere he reared up and I mean straight up. I stuck it the first time but he came down and went up again and there was nothing I could do and I came off

Rearing is something I DON’T deal with; it is so dangerous. Obviously my options are sending him away for further training (at a couple thousand more a month) or selling him. I am so embarrassed at the prospect of getting rid of potentially another horse and even if I sent him away for training I don’t know if I would ever feel comfortable getting on him again; I don’t know if the issue could even be duplicated to be worked out of him. He has reared up a time or two on the ground when I disciplined him for being naughty but now that I know that its in him, Im always going to have that in the back of my mind

What would you do?

[endlessclimb]

Your situation sounds like a perfect storm of young horse + cool weather + one day of no turnout + outside stimulus.

I would have lunged him longer, with being out of town a day + a day of no turnout. Maybe just lunge and be done, but a good sweaty lunge.

that said

This is supposed to be FUN. If you don’t jive with your horse there is nothing wrong with selling and moving on. Suggestion to you is to put the brain and behavior FIRST in your next purchase, even if it means it’s never going to win. Something in the 10-15 year old range, where the horse is well known and well broke.

[luvmyhackney]

If it isn’t fun… move him along.

We can all go back and say what you should have done… but that is done and over. Rearing is a big nope, off to boot camp you go. I’d send him to a good trainer for a few months and sell him.

He didn’t work out… big woop. Go buy something that isn’t fancy but safe with some life experience, go enjoy your horse. Or even lease a lesson horse for a bit and build your confidence back.

[GraceLikeRain]

Lunging to try and get out any monsters without cantering is a waste of time in my book. The canter transition and willingness to smoothly transition in and out of the gait is the best indicator of where there brain is at.

If you won’t feel safe even post training, I’d send him out on consignment and see how he polishes up with consistency. Once sold, I’d drop the need for a warmblood and find something boringly safe even if it moves like a washing machine.

Go spend a few years being able to not ride for a week or haul off property in a brisk day and enjoying the gift of a solid brain. You may find you still want young and fancy but you may decide feeling safe and consistent is more important.

I really don’t play with rearing and also I’m not surprised a six year old went up on a brisk day after time off with outside stimuli. It’s okay to recognize it’s not abnormal and also decide it isn’t for you.

[shadesofbay3]

when we lunged we w/t/c both ways . only w/t under saddle in the indoor

[trubandloki]

Not every horse is meant to be ridden by every rider.

There is no failure in admitting that a horse is not the right match for you.

This horse might be perfect for someone else and then you can find a different horse that is perfect for you.

[mmeqcenter]

@shadesofbay3

-I already have a pretty messed up body from riding, multiple concussions, a broken vertebrae from a fall that still has my back not right

-I used to be a pretty confident, even good rider, but certain horses and situations in my past have led me to having a real lack of confidence and now I am extremely timid and fearful at times in the saddle

Also I would assume your injuries and current physical condition are part of why you are lacking confidence.

Sell the horse.
Find a horse better-suited to your needs.

[steelerino]

Sell him and buy something safe. Preferably aged in the middle double digits. Heck look for something that needs a step down job who is safe, safe, safe. Riding should be fun and being scared isn’t fun!

[LilRanger]

I would do as others suggested, sell the horse. Through whatever method works for you.

I would then either take lessons on schoolmasteres to regain my confidence and recovery from current physical injuries. (You state you have ongoing issues with at least one injury)
After my confidence is back, and I have an understanding of my current and future physical abilities, then I’d go horse shopping.

I’d you have on going/ unresolved injuries, any fall can make things worse, so I’d say you’re already behind just getting on. Give yourself time and a safe way to heal. It may be you can find the right horse now, or it may mean you need to step back and heal first before buying another horse.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

Age 6 is still pretty young, and he sounds very green “in the brain” if he can’t hold a canter without, as you put it, throwing in a few “tricks.”

I wouldn’t necessarily judge him by this one incident–it sounds like a perfect storm of a young horse, lots of stimulation, cold day, as everyone else said.

I know you know this BUT…let’s say you hadn’t ridden that day and just lunged him. Would you still trust him?

That being said, winter is coming and there are more cold days. I wouldn’t be ashamed of moving him on–it sounds like you need a much older, safe horse, and there is no shame of needing a different partner to enjoy yourself and protect your body from more grief. If he does get very fresh in the cold, it’s no fun to lunge all winter and have your trainer get on him to ride more than you ride.

If you’re not sure about the horse you need, are there any leasing options around you for a truly boring bombproof horse that might be a step down beneath your ability as a rider to build confidence before your next purchase?

[Christa_P]

There is no problem with changing the horses you want to ride as life changes. The horses we may have thought were fun and a little challenging when we were younger, fitter, riding more, and less broken are not the same as the horses we want later when we aren’t working them enough to keep them sane and us fit.

Move this horse to somebody that will enjoy him and find one that fits your current lifestyle and is doing what you want and don’t limit your breed choices. There are several threads with a lot of examples of competitive horses from many different breeds.

[fivestrideline]

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with saying “I can’t blame him for this, but also we aren’t a match”. Put him in training and sell him. It doesn’t sound like y’all were fitting well together even before this.

There’s a horse out there for you. It’s unlikely to be a big fancy young WB, but it’s out there. For example, both of my OTTBs are pretty dang safe. Wind blowing, freezing cold, neighbors shooting guns, horses galloping around, kids screaming and throwing Christmas decorations in the air? No problemo, ma’am, where to next? They are both just that chill by nature, and are managed in a way to encourage relaxation. Not all horses are wired that way, but they are out there.

If you want a horse that you can take out on a hack on a cold day with no turnout and his buddies going nuts, you’ll need to buy a horse that has the brain and proven track record of doing that. It’s likely to be older, and unlikely to be fancy (unless you’ve got deep pockets). OR, buy something that is safe and can canter without shenanigans, and commit to making better choices.

Have my horses spooked and dumped me? Yeah, they’re horses. But it was never dirty, and there was no rear/buck/shenanigans. Buy the brain and the training that works for you NOW. Or sell this guy and ride in lessons until you get your confidence! It’s okay to admit that the horse we used to want is not the horse we need anymore.

ETA: although I personally have horses that can handle a cold day and nonsense going on, a lot of horses just can’t. Sometimes even the most levelheaded schoolmaster needs to get lunged and kicked outside to blow off steam, and it’s up to us to decide when to call it! There’s no shame in admitting defeat on a given day and banking that confidence for later. It’s like schooling a horse - sometimes you gotta change your plan to avoid destroying confidence.

[sascha]

@shadesofbay3

He has reared up a time or two on the ground when I disciplined him for being naughty but now that I know that its in him, Im always going to have that in the back of my mind

IMO, it should be front of mind and of absolute immediate urgency. Escalating, or “back talking” after having a behaviour corrected is very, very, very bad, and very, very, very dangerous.

I want a horse to roll their eyes at me saying, “Yeah, I know. My bad. I won’t do it again. I’m supposed to keep you safe at all times.” rather than back talk to me, let alone back talking by rearing. (or biting, or kicking, or striking, or head flinging to be honest)

If I were you, and I’m not lol, I’d enlist professional help yesterday to either fix the horse or prep it for sale. It will be far better for both of you to get past this one way or the other - whether you can come to an agreement together, or whether you need to sell and try again.

Please, don’t get hurt, and don’t let your horse’s behaviour get any worse. The better behaved a horse is, the safer they are in the hands of any human who may find them in their possession and the less likely they are to be abused or worse.

[Pico_Banana]

I agree that your best path forward is to sell this horse and find one who’s a better fit for you.

A year ago I bought a steady eddy schoolmaster. I didn’t really “need” the steady eddy part, but can I tell you my confidence has had a huge boost from riding him! He’s such a blast to ride. Super fun. I highly recommend.

[NaturallyHappy]

@sascha

@shadesofbay3

He has reared up a time or two on the ground when I disciplined him for being naughty but now that I know that its in him, Im always going to have that in the back of my mind

IMO, it should be front of mind and of absolute immediate urgency. Escalating, or “back talking” after having a behaviour corrected is very, very, very bad, and very, very, very dangerous.

I agree 1000%. My experienced self says this horse already knew this trick, which was perhaps why the seller was so flexible. That day brought it out. Horses who get light in front are different from ones who stand straight up, in my opinion.

[endlessclimb]

It depends on how the discipline was delivered. I have handled many horses who will tolerate X correction but be mortally offended by Y correction.

[luvmyhackney]

Most, not all, horse rear when they feel trapped and can’t move their feet or their anxiety is just over the edge and handler missed 50 prior clues.

Mine will rear in hand in you yank on him and don’t let him go forward or move his feet. Disengaging his hind end or shoulders vs yanking and he wouldn’t think about rearing.

Note I said most not all. Some horses just go up cause that’s their tendency but doesn’t sound like OPs horse, just she’s scared so has him tight and he can’t go forward.

[shadesofbay3]

he was going forward though … he was walking

[GraceLikeRain]

I think there’s an important distinction between a horse that is physically moving forward and a horse that is mentally moving forward. I know that was my personal horse her feet can be physically moving, but she can feel very mentally trapped. That could be because of what I am doing as a rider or that could be because she is over her threshold. Even on a looped rein she mentally feels very trapped. acknowledging that your horse felt trapped doesn’t mean that you were ripping on her face or doing something that forced the rear response. Some horses can feel incredibly trapped and will engage in any other behavior before they go up and some of them are very light and the front end and easily go up. Personally, I don’t have a desire for one whose first inclination is to go up, but that also means that I’ve got one who feeling trapped is liable to spin or bolt.

There are plenty of horses that require so much pressure before they would consider trying to go up/back/sideways. I’m stuck with mine so I’ve learned to ride it but I do not fault anyone for being rational and opting for safety and sanity!

[fivestrideline]

None of us were there, so we can’t say whether OP caused the rearing, the horse had it in his bag of tricks, or if he just popped up in front a bit and it felt huge to the rider who was then dislodged. Who knows .

Some horses rear because they feel trapped and are being held back. Some rear out of plain exuberance. Some horses have been corrected mostly by backing up (looking at you, poorly executed “natural horsemanship”), and now have learned to sit back and go up in response to correction. Some horses are athletic enough that standing up is easy and have learned it gets them what they want. Some are confirmed rearers, and most horses at some point will pop up in front while being handled and may never repeat it. We don’t know what category/categories OP’s horse falls into.

What we do know is that OP is overhorsed and has taken several huge hits to their confidence. Someone else will likely be successful with this horse, and selling him will free OP up to reevaluate their next steps - which will hopefully include a more appropriate (if less competitive) animal. Be it in lessons, leasing, or a purchase. Or, OP could take a HUGE step back and wait for “the bug” to bite again before getting back in the saddle full swing.

There is nothing wrong or shameful about admitting you still haven’t found the right fit. What would be unfortunate is for OP to get hurt, or to continue riding inappropriate horses until they get scared enough to quit all together.