When your relationship with your horse is toxic...but you love them

If you were paid to do it, by definition it does.

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I’m not going to dignify this with a response except to say that my business name is right there :point_up: and maybe you should take two seconds to look someone up before you go making ridiculous statements.

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Thank you for saying this

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A couple things pop out to me…

I think as athletes and horse lovers we don’t invest enough in our own sports psych.
There are some great books out there to help riders overcome the portion of our riding issues that are ours.
Two I highly recommend are
Lessons with Lendon
That Winning Feeling

Secondly, I agree with those who suggest a trainer who rides the horse and works with you both. If they have a schoolmaster for you to ride, all the better. Growing your confidence will grow your horses confidence.
I think that’s a valuable endeavor for your riding future even if you sell this horse.

Good luck.

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Yes, anyone can look you up and see that those statements are not ridiculous.

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This honestly really bugs me about the U.S.

Anyone can just hang their shingle out there. I could call myself a pro tomorrow. I just don’t take it so seriously anymore. Almost all of the real “pros” that I know, with actual credentials and achievements, don’t go around saying, “I’m a pro” or “look me up” they simply don’t have to.

I’m fine with someone putting themselves out there and developing themselves as a pro, but it just gets a bit cray here at times.

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Which is kinda the problem, if you ask me.
You didn’t, but …

However, not everyone claiming to be a pro has even been paid to do it.
They just say it.
And who checks?
And where does one check?

.
I’ve ridden and worked for some top level, you’d recognize the names pros who walked the walk.
And some you wouldn’t know from Adam who did also.

But there are many in both pools who talk the talk, but trip when walking the walk.

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I mean, just because you get paid to do it, that doesn’t mean that you’re any good at it or even better than some that aren’t paid to do it :wink:

I know that defines “pro” but it’s just a part of being a true pro. To me, anyway.

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I mentioned that I was a pro so that the OP would understand where I was coming from, not that I was an amateur at home alone tackling a complicated horse.

Not sure why you think that I’m not a legitimate pro, but I don’t need to defend myself to anyone, and I’m frankly not sure why this thread is even devolving into a discussion about my credentials. If you have an issue with me calling myself a pro you’re welcome to DM me but I’m going to leave this thread to the discussion at hand.

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OP, it sound like you love the horse, but the two of you make each other miserable from a riding standpoint. If you want both of you to be happier riding in the near future, you need to consider selling her.

If possible I would mention to the trainer that I might be open to offers to a good home (and what would trainer’s commission be).

And then use trainer help to find a confident, non-reactive horse that you can enjoy. They are out there!

At 6 she has a lot of potential. Is it possible for you to work through her issues and for her to settle down with age? Sure, but it will take considerable time and training for you both to try to make a bad fit work. I think you know now that it is not what you want to do.

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A few things of note here:

I said “almost all pros” so that does not encompass all pros.

If the shoe fits, wear it. If it does not, then don’t.

In some cases, there really isn’t much difference between an amateur at home, alone, tackling a complicated horse vs a pro. Especially with the definition of pro in the US being so…money based vs credential based. No formal nationally regulated testing, credentials, or anything required, really.

I did not expressly state, “you are not a legitimate pro” if that’s what you took away from what I said or feel to be applicable, then that’s on you.

But back to to discussion at hand.

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Ultimately this hobby should be fun. I have seen instances where some fall in love with the horse, but can’t ride one side of said horse or they just aren’t a good match for whatever reason(s). The only time this concerns me is when someone repeatedly matches themselves with the incorrect horses. If it’s the odd event, that can happen. Or in some instances, our ambitions or desires exceed the horses capabilites as we progress.

We have to be fair to ourselves, and more importantly, the horse. I’ve sold on a horse that I got along with well enough, but when someone expressed interest in him, I knew that they’d actually be the perfect home (male rider, only concerned with show jumping and hacking, it just fit if you knew that horse). As a result of selling that horse, I found my heart horse and also gained experience with a breed I wouldn’t have considered before, and now, I’d never go back.

Could I have stuck it out with that other horse? Sure, we got along ok enough, but when that door closed, another one opened, and I think all parties were happier and more fulfilled as a result.

This hobby is an extremely selfish one and often driven almost solely by human desires. Sometimes we really need to step back and think of the horse. If a horse and rider aren’t constructive together or feed off of nervousness, that’s no good for anyone. There’s no issue with selling that horse to a more suitable rider and that rider finding a horse that’s more suited to them. Sometimes you just have pairs that don’t click.

Learn from the experience and do best by the horse.

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This reads as very rude, what did it contribute to the conversation?

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It may have contributed absolutely nothing to the conversation.

The poster said that one could look up her business since the business name is right there. Said poster said to do this before making ridiculous statements. I did not believe that the statements made were ridiculous, even if one were to look up the poster.

That is my opinion. You do not have to agree with it or how it was expressed. Nor do I have to justify my posts or meet some threshold for contributing to the conversation, but I am always willing to explain why I said something in an effort to clarify. Perhaps I’m not sure what your post contributed either?

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I guess I just don’t understand why you’re getting into a pissing contest with someone over them calling themselves a pro. Seems unnecessarily inflammatory. Did you have a good Christmas?

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Pro is a very wide term. It stretches from 20 year old former cross rails competitors teaching group beginners at the lesson factory barn that created them, to top international competitors. It just means you’re being paid to do something with horses. That said, it’s also true that in general most pros have more competency than their clients, which doesn’t mean that any given pro has more competency than every amateur. But they often have more breadth of experience.

Anyhow, whether someone says they are pro or ammie, I evaluate what they do by what I see, and what they say by the same standards of common sense. I’ve seen disastrous lessons given by pros, and really bad coaching. And really stupid advice. And absolute ignorant opinions on diet, saddle fit, hoof care, soundness, etc but opinions held with authority.

And then there can be small time pros who really do have earned wisdom and are worth listening to.

Both things true for nonpros as well

So I don’t think arguing over whether someone who is technically getting paid to do horses is “really” a pro or not is terribly useful. They are a pro in terms of competition rules, which is the only universal written definition we have.

If their advice seems stupid, arrogant, or useless then respond to the content of the advice. And if you give silly advice, don’t expect “being a pro” to confer automatic authority.

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Why are you getting oddly personal? Do I know you?

There is no pissing match at all. I haven’t even posted all that much on this thread, but I do find your fixation on me and comments to be interesting.

Anyone can call themselves a pro, and I can have feelings about it and express my opinion. I am sorry if that is offensive to you. Yes, I do take issue with some of the “pro” classification and qualification methods in the US. I do feel as though many inflate their abilities and give advice “as a pro” that can be questionable and borderline dangerous, never mind inconsiderate to the welfare of the animal, generally speaking.

You may think it to be unnecessarily inflammatory, that’s fine. I feel that your “Did you have a good Christmas?” is disingenuous and I’m not sure what it contributes to the discussion?

I did have a good Christmas though :woman_shrugging:t3:

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lol two comments wondering about your unwarranted hostility towards another poster is hardly a fixation, do not flatter yourself. Have a blessed day

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I agree with this. Whether the person is a pro or ammy I am going to look at more than just their status. As I said up thread, just because you are paid or have been paid, that doesn’t mean that you’re necessarily good at what you do :wink:

While I accept the definition of a “pro” and it is the only universal written definition we have here, I just have my feelings and opinions on the matter. Is that relevant? Probably not to anyone other than myself :rofl: which is fine.

It’s just that some amateurs can actually have more experience, knowledge, and give better advice than certain pros out there, so it’s never a bad idea to remember to do your due diligence when listening or otherwise using a pro.

There are some absolutely fantastic pros out there and I’ve worked with quite a few. I’ve no beef with pros on the whole, I just think that there could be a better system or more credentials required to wear that title (which is a thing in some other countries). I get that it’s not that way though.

It just chaps my arse when someone takes bad advice from someone because they thought it to be good advice solely on the basis of it coming from a pro. Not the situation here, exactly, but somewhat relevant when someone is making a big decision as the OP is.

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Thank you for your useful contribution to this thread.

A little quick to use the word hostile, but I’ll forgive that.

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