Where are the working students?

[eightpondfarm]

You too! So, are you closing this thread now?

[SillyHorse]

I’m pretty sure only a moderator can “close,” aka lock, a thread.

[BigMama1]

I’d be happy to help with re-wording if you like. Also I did think of someone who might be a great fit. Not sure if she’s looking to move geographically, but I sent her all the relevant info. Talented rider, hard working, experience competing at FEI Junior and at PSG, just started her own teaching / training business.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

I’m happy via PM to offer any writerly assistance, too.

Even though the thread went off course re: your original question, thank you for starting such a productive debate and discussion!

[sunkistbey]

I also disagree with you and I’m 65. People have been saying “kids these days” since time began. It’s a rude generalization.

[eightpondfarm]

rude possibly, but perfectly natural. It’s part of the evolution of years on people…(not you because you are not succumbing). We’ve all been the younger generation at one point and have all been defensive about ‘the youth of today’. Now, i find myself at the other end of the spectrum. (glad for you that you’re not!)

One thing that keeps it rolling is how technology makes life physically more comfortable with each passing year. I remember going to school with no airconditioning for example. And standing at a bus stop rurally with 10 other kids and waiting for 15 or more mins in the winter… playing in the snow (which there is none of now, and less each year). THe physical environment we grow up in has constantly improved…making older folks wax on about how things were harder for them as youths and how kids nowdays are soft… etc.

So, about Working Students…
Was giving this a lot of thought cleaning the barn just now. I wonder just as folks have mentioned, how economically improbable it is for young kids to enter into competitive horse sports. I’m thinking what people are saying is pretty true…that horse sports are pricing out the middle-class kid. And those coming from money really look to horse-sports as not so much a way to earn their living, but more as a hobby. So, along this vein, i would think there is a constricting pipeline of young folks entering the system. And those ones are able to buy-their-way rather than earn-their-way in.

[sascha]

@eightpondfarm

We’ve all been the younger generation at one point and still believe that we were the toughest, most hard-done-by, most pull ourselves up by the bootstraps generation and those of us who actually worked hard got what we deserved for that work. It’s a shame that generation after generation continues with this delusion instead of realizing that times change, stresses change, economies change and it is not fair to wax poetic about our achievements while running down subsequent generations for our inability to see their strengths in an ever-changing world.

There. I fixed it for you.

[sportyspicepony]

LOL I love it

[eightpondfarm]

Of course you’re right, but i’m not wrong. You yourself will probably be here one day…

[Scribbler]

Geberal comment.

800,000 Covid 19 deaths in the US
Many more long Covid sufferers
Fewer and fewer children over the past decades.
More only children and more children feeling its OK to live with their parents into their 20s
More college enrolment year over year
More service jobs and tech opportunities
More range of sports opportunities for girls
Horse competition prices and geberal cost of living going through the roof

I grew up in a time when there were more young people than opportunities.

[mvp]

@sascha

@eightpondfarm

We’ve all been the younger generation at one point and still believe that we were the toughest, most hard-done-by, most pull ourselves up by the bootstraps generation and those of us who actually worked hard got what we deserved for that work. It’s a shame that generation after generation continues with this delusion instead of realizing that times change, stresses change, economies change and it is not fair to wax poetic about our achievements while running down subsequent generations for our inability to see their strengths in an ever-changing world.

There. I fixed it for you.

Ok, there are some things that are legit and bona fide harder for the whippersnappers of today.

1. Getting into college. How many times did you oldsters take the SAT? Was that the only test involved? Did you practice? Did you compete against people who had tutors for that?

2. How hard was it to pay for college? A downpayment for a house?

3. How many adults in a family had to work for pay outside the home to cover basic expenses?

4. If you had a horse (leave out his price or how you acquired him for a minute) could you/did your teenage self make enough money to pay his board? I ask because people here report doing that. By the time I was in this stage of my life, I don’t think I could have made enough in a month to keep a horse fed and shod, no matter what kind of high school kid job I would have done (and I did work in barns every weekend, all summer and after school).

What I think is going on in horse world now is an expression of the increasing disparity in wealth that has been creeping up in the US for a generation. And to be clear: Good- and bad work ethics come in people in all tax brackets. I know some very hard-working trust-funders who have turned pro. But they turned pro, at least in part, because they had that backing it made sense to apply their hard work to the horse world they loved. It does not make sense for someone without that extra asset to do the same.

Hard work is a necessary- but not sufficient condition of making a WS gig pay off.

[atlatl]

@mvp

@sascha

@eightpondfarm

We’ve all been the younger generation at one point and still believe that we were the toughest, most hard-done-by, most pull ourselves up by the bootstraps generation and those of us who actually worked hard got what we deserved for that work. It’s a shame that generation after generation continues with this delusion instead of realizing that times change, stresses change, economies change and it is not fair to wax poetic about our achievements while running down subsequent generations for our inability to see their strengths in an ever-changing world.

There. I fixed it for you.

Ok, there are some things that are legit and bona fide harder for the whippersnappers of today.

1. Getting into college. How many times did you oldsters take the SAT? Was that the only test involved? Did you practice? Did you compete against people who had tutors for that?

2. How hard was it to pay for college? A downpayment for a house?

3. How many adults in a family had to work for pay outside the home to cover basic expenses?

4. If you had a horse (leave out his price or how you acquired him for a minute) could you/did your teenage self make enough money to pay his board? I ask because people here report doing that. By the time I was in this stage of my life, I don’t think I could have made enough in a month to keep a horse fed and shod, no matter what kind of high school kid job I would have done (and I did work in barns every weekend, all summer and after school).

What I think is going on in horse world now is an expression of the increasing disparity in wealth that has been creeping up in the US for a generation. And to be clear: Good- and bad work ethics come in people in all tax brackets. I know some very hard-working trust-funders who have turned pro. But they turned pro, at least in part, because they had that backing it made sense to apply their hard work to the horse world they loved. It does not make sense for someone without that extra asset to do the same.

Hard work is a necessary- but not sufficient condition of making a WS gig pay off.

I’ll play

1. I only took the SAT once, although I did take the PSAT as practice. No tutor, and don’t remember anyone else I knew having a tutor either. This is the late 70s.

2. I had an academic scholarship and also worked all through undergrad, then in grad school I taught undergrad math and got a break on tuition because of that job. It wasn’t too hard because I was able to live at home. My parents fed me and gave me a place to sleep, I was responsible for everything else. Down payment for a house wasn’t too hard because I was married and we both worked. Also, I didn’t have a horse.

3. My dad was career enlisted Air Force and while he had side gigs most of that time, my mom didn’t work outside the home. We also made due with what he made. Yes the refrigerator was pretty empty the day before payday, but we had housing, healthcare, and didn’t starve. I’ll make my pitch again for a mandatory 2 year public service (military or other) requirement for every citizen.

4. I didn’t own a horse until I could pay for it myself; I was 29 and established in my career.

I agree that the increasing disparity in wealth is a huge problem, however, even back in the day we had a saying that the rich get richer and the poor get children so it’s not new.

I have 2 friends that are trust-funders. They both work hard however they also do not have, IMO, a full appreciation of reality for most people.

My current barn has 1 working student. She gets housing for herself (and dog) and 1 horse, and works her tail off. I don’t think she is looking to make a career of the horse gig, and frankly I bring her leftovers and groceries because I’m worried she can’t afford to eat.

[eightpondfarm]

Animal culture is less and less part of children’s lives. I grew up with Fury, My Friend Flicka, Lassie, Mr. Ed, tons of westerns on ‘the idiot box’ (as my folks called TV. They hated televisions and how they occupied children’s attention probably more that folks now dislike devices.)

Culturally we are moving further and further away from the natural world. How far do you have to drive to get into actual rural landscape now? How many kids grow up going to their grandparents’ farms.

Horses are evermore a luxury. The kids who are coming up just aren’t seeing the horse-world as an option for themselves. So, they don’t aspire to horse competition. It’s just too far removed from their world. For those who are natural-born animal kids they maybe gravitate into Agility or something with their dogs instead …it’s more reachable.

So, a competition barn isn’t going to be such a mecca for young girls and 10-15 years on out, stables are going to have even less girls willing to earn their way up in the horse world.

I think the whole working student is a thing of the past. Young women who ride come from enough money to pay their way into schooling/horses. It’s kinda always been a rich girls’ sport, but there was enough exposure surrounding horses to middle class kids to have that influx of hungry to learn willing to work for nothing in order to learn.

[Cat.J95]

That’s not accurate.

[eightpondfarm]

yeah, it is.

[Texarkana]

No, it’s not.

[eightpondfarm]

yes. it is.
so, if you disagree, that is fine. You wish to argue the point then prove me wrong.

[Texarkana]

@eightpondfarm

The kids who are coming up just aren’t seeing the horse-world as an option for themselves. So, they don’t aspire to horse competition. It’s just too far removed from their world. For those who are natural-born animal kids they maybe gravitate into Agility or something with their dogs instead …it’s more reachable.

So, a competition barn isn’t going to be such a mecca for young girls and 10-15 years on out, stables are going to have even less girls willing to earn their way up in the horse world.

I think the whole working student is a thing of the past. Young women who ride come from enough money to pay their way into schooling/horses. It’s kinda always been a rich girls’ sport, but there was enough exposure surrounding horses to middle class kids to have that influx of hungry to learn willing to work for nothing in order to learn.

This is the part I don’t find accurate.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not just trying to be argumentative.

Yes, people are further removed from animals. Totally agree there. And yes, less children are getting in to horses than did in the past because of less access.

But within the horse world, I don’t think your observations and premonitions are an accurate portrayal.

[lenapesadie]

@eightpondfarm

So, a competition barn isn’t going to be such a mecca for young girls and 10-15 years on out, stables are going to have even less girls willing to earn their way up in the horse world.

Utter bologna.

Barns are absolutely still a Mecca of children eager to learn and work for horses. They’re just smart enough to realize that to fund a horse lifestyle they need a good paying job. And horses don’t pay.

[luvmyhackney]

I’ll play

1. Only took SAT once and no prep or internet at home to use as a resource.
2. Only completed 3 semesters of college on scholarships and had to move back home to help my siblings when parents divorced. Went back to school when I could afford it a few years ago.
3. Both my parents worked and myself and siblings all worked once we turned 13/14ish.
4. I worked enough in the summers and during the year as a teen to afford cheap board for a horse. Probably couldn’t show or lesson often, but could cover basics.