Where are we to discuss *ok, below expectations* performance of US eventing?

[JER]

[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;6466818]
Seriously??? It is NOT an abysmal performance. It is just that the other countries were outstanding. [/QUOTE]

Not abysmal but between the dressage scores and today’s XC, it is apparent that in 2012 the US team is not up to top international standards.

(The US would be one place further back had Clayton Fredericks not had that slip between fences. That was very unlucky.)

The good news is, there’s a new coach on the way in. The bad news? He was coaching the Canadians today.

(That last bit is notsoserious. :winkgrin:)

[subk]

[QUOTE=voltaire51147;6466839]
I also don’t see how Sinead could have been the savior today but that’s my opinion. SJ is yet to come. Why not wait until then to start complaining.[/QUOTE]
If Sinead had post a clean fast round–considering the horse has never had a XC stop–both Will and Phillip could have been much more agressive XC. Watching Will on the live feed a bit of agression on his part could very well have been all that was missing to prevent his silly stop. With Will’s stop Phillip couldn’t push very hard either as he was the last chance to post 3 clean rides.

I don’t see Sinead as a possible hero, but I do see that we lost some points without the flexibility of having 3 clean in the bag after the first 3 horses went.

[Weatherford]

Well, you do realize that the US was dropped from the Super League in Show Jumping last year, don’t you?

So it’s not just Eventing that has a “problem”…

[Larksmom]

‘If Sinead had post a clean fast round–considering the horse has never had a XC stop–both Will and Phillip could have been much more agressive XC. Watching Will on the live feed a bit of agression on his part could very well have been all that was missing to prevent his silly stop. With Will’s stop Phillip couldn’t push very hard either as he was the last chance to post 3 clean rides.’

The problem with that logic is just that he only had about2 time penalties. Where would that get us? We would still be in 5th. For all ou grumbling, Tiana didn’t do too badly. She had a VERY rocky start, But to finish with only 5 time penalties with a stop is amazing! And Will didn’t do too badly either. Especially if they don’t have to count. Besides, all of our riders had time penalties. Now even if they were all clear, I think that would not be enough to pull us up from our bad dressage scores. Just closer if the ones above us mess up. We need better dressage, WHEN IT IS NEEDED. Not at home, not schooling but in the ring. When it counts.

[fordtraktor]

[QUOTE=Weatherford;6466944]
Well, you do realize that the US was dropped from the Super League in Show Jumping last year, don’t you?

So it’s not just Eventing that has a “problem”…[/QUOTE]

That’s unfair. A US jumper just won the World Cup, and the 2008 team won team gold and indiv. silver. Much better performances than US eventing has been able to muster in recent years. We’ll see soon whether they’re competitive at this Games but sniping at them now is premature.

[kcmel]

Abysmal? Seriously? You must have been watching a different feed than I was:lol:.

Can’t wait for tomorrow!

[subk]

[QUOTE=Larksmom;6466948]

The problem with that logic is just that he only had about2 time penalties. Where would that get us? We would still be in 5th.[/QUOTE]
And if Will had been able to ride a little more agressively and it helped avoided a stop and we’d been able to use his score in the 40s instead of Boyd’s in the 50s? Might still be 5th but we’d be a few rails closer which could make a difference tomorrow–considering the 1st place horse has never jumped an advanced CCI/CIC clean and the 2nd place horse has never competed a 4 star.

Anyone disappointed with Team USA’s performance today hasn’t been paying attention to the records of the horses we sent. We sent 5 horse of which only one pair could be called experienced at the level, and one pair niether horse nor rider had ever completed a 4 star. I agree they are lackluster on an international stage, but to say they are abysmal is just silly.

[Anne_FS]

If, if, if…

If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a bicycle (which is the clean version of the real saying).

[Anne_FS]

[QUOTE=subk;6467005]
If Sinead has posted a clean fast round…

And if Will had been able to ride a little more agressively [/QUOTE]

If, if, if…

If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a bicycle (which is the clean version of the real saying).

[voltaire51147]

[QUOTE=Anne FS;6467020]
If, if, if…

If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a bicycle (which is the clean version of the real saying).[/QUOTE]

My mother used to say, “If wishes were horses then beggars would ride”. I guess that’s what took so long for me to finally get a horse.

[FrittSkritt]

So much for “high risk, high reward” on Tiana. :sigh: She didn’t pull herself together and start riding until halfway through the course, but by then it was too late.

I think the dressage judging was pretty inconsistent as well. Ingrid’s horse was TENSE – def not worth of a <40 score IMO, and MW looked better than a 44.

IMO you should get a 10 point penalty if you can’t sit the extended trot without throwing your hands around. (See: Italian rider on super nice horse.)

[DMK]

@voltaire51147;6467033

My mother used to say, “If wishes were horses then beggars would ride”. I guess that’s what took so long for me to finally get a horse.

I used to get that and in response to “I want” I got “A lot of people wantin’ out of jail too”

A bit unfair about the loss on the super league. Not saying we are anywhere as deep in horse flesh as the Europeans, but what we bring to the table (Spooner, Fellers, Ward, Madden and Kraut) has been very successful in Europe. Laura and Cedric are kicking some ass in the Global Nations Tour and Cristallo is No. #1 in the world rankings and neither of them are even on the team (another thread, I’m sure).

[WNT]

[QUOTE=FrittSkritt;6467045]
So much for “high risk, high reward” on Tiana. :sigh: She didn’t pull herself together and start riding until halfway through the course, but by then it was too late.[/QUOTE]

I agree, the Olympics is not the place to start out sticky and green and improve as the you go through the course. A positive ride, yes; but not one your want to count on for an Olympic medal. Water under the bridge, now.

[snoopy]

I have some serious issue with the idea of a high risk/high return combination at a championships. You did not see the British take this approach. The obvious down side to this gamble is that ANYTHING can happen out there. The vet inspection on the third day could very easily change the leader board…drastically. A drop score after XC could easily be needed if one of the higher scoring horses is not fit for SJ. Why not have a drop score that is still competitive??? Why take that gamble, especially at a championships. In this sport, you really have no idea what is going to happen so you might as well have the best you can field for all 5 places.

[TBEventer439]

[QUOTE=subk;6467005]
Anyone disappointed with Team USA’s performance today hasn’t been paying attention to the records of the horses we sent. We sent 5 horse of which only one pair could be called experienced at the level, and one pair niether horse nor rider had ever completed a 4 star. I agree they are lackluster on an international stage, but to say they are abysmal is just silly.[/QUOTE]

That is the problem exactly. We could have sent a much more experienced team, but we didn’t. Maybe the riders and horses we sent put in the best rounds they could based on their experience, but in that case, maybe they shouldn’t have been there in the first place. We certainly have plenty of qualified horses and riders in this country that have completed many 4*s successfully.

[FalseImpression]

boy, you are harsh… you can’t win ALL the time!! the Brits and the Europeans are great riders and I think North Americans tend to forget it… I am disappointed in the Canadian showing, but it’s life! It happens to the best.
I enjoyed the show!! and I am delighted that some riders had great rides, not just the ones I was cheering for.
Now, Canada better pulls their socks for Show Jumping… but I also know we have young horses…

[FrittSkritt]

[QUOTE=TBEventer439;6467083]
That is the problem exactly. We could have sent a much more experienced team, but we didn’t. Maybe the riders and horses we sent put in the best rounds they could based on their experience, but in that case, maybe they shouldn’t have been there in the first place. We certainly have plenty of qualified horses and riders in this country that have completed many 4*s successfully.[/QUOTE]

Not to mention we have the most ridiculous, drawn out, and expensive selection procedure of any of the teams. :mad:

[TBEventer439]

Very true. I think we would have ended up with a much different team had the selections been made earlier in the season. And much less stress AND expense on everyone involved.

[subk]

[QUOTE=Anne FS;6467020]
If, if, if…

If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a bicycle (which is the clean version of the real saying).[/QUOTE]
Well, if you were going to bet on a clean XC would you pick the horse and rider who had never completed a 4 star or the one who had not only not ever had a XC jumping penalty, but was also one of the only US horses to go clean at 2 different 4 stars last year?

Looking at the competiton records of the short listed horses Sinaid and Neville were the best bets we had for a clean XC today. All our team horses performed pretty much in line with their records today–including the disappointing ones. To not speculate on the possibles without making some reasonable speculations based on fact is kind of stupid–there is no learning curve to it. It would also be short sighted not to realize that when riding for a team score the ride of one member of the team DOES affect the way others ride. It is what makes CCIOs unique and interesting.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

[QUOTE=TBEventer439;6467083]
That is the problem exactly. We could have sent a much more experienced team, but we didn’t. Maybe the riders and horses we sent put in the best rounds they could based on their experience, but in that case, maybe they shouldn’t have been there in the first place. We certainly have plenty of qualified horses and riders in this country that have completed many 4*s successfully.[/QUOTE]

But in all honestly…there is no one who was left at home that I think would be in any kind of remote competition here. I like Sinead…but I doubt having had her on the team would change the outcome. I don’t see them scoring a sub 40 dressage or even sub 45.

There are very few in the US who would could get a sub 45 dressage score…and even fewer, if any (from the ones we sent), who would finish xc with that.

Watching MJ ride xc…my god, that guy is scary in what an outstandingly good rider he is. And he isn’t the only one…I saw several riders who are just at a different level than most of the top riders here in the US.

I personally don’t think we currently have a team very close to compete at that level. We are close…but not quite there. We do have some riders that good…and do have some horses that good…but often do not have the best horses with the most competitive riders. But a bit of that is just the way it goes with horses.