Where to find higher level, quality dressage horse

[Roni4444]

Short of going to Europe, where can I look for a quality horse that’s at or below 10 years of age, 4th or above with good gaits? I have looked at FB groups, Warmbloods for Sale, Dressage Daily, Dressage Market, Eurodressage, Dreamhorse and some other websites. I dont seem to find many that look correctly trained. Any suggestions as to good sales barns, Breeders or Trainers with trained horses for sale? I have been down the “younger dressage prospect” road before and am not looking to do this again at this time.

Any suggestions or referrals would be welcome!

[Scribbler]

I expect it depends on how you define correctly trained.

If the horse has a show history of getting good scores than he is correctly trained for the purpose of competitive dressage.

If you find horses who are scoring well but you don’t like how they go, overbent or sloppy piaffe or what ever, then you may not agree with the general parameters of contemporary dressage. In that case you need to train your own horse from scratch.

I would suggest getting your trainer on board in your search.

[Roni4444]

@Scribbler

I expect it depends on how you define correctly trained.

If the horse has a show history of getting good scores than he is correctly trained for the purpose of competitive dressage.

If you find horses who are scoring well but you don’t like how they go, overbent or sloppy piaffe or what ever, then you may not agree with the general parameters of contemporary dressage. In that case you need to train your own horse from scratch.

I would suggest getting your trainer on board in your search.

@Scribbler

I expect it depends on how you define correctly trained.

If the horse has a show history of getting good scores than he is correctly trained for the purpose of competitive dressage.

If you find horses who are scoring well but you don’t like how they go, overbent or sloppy piaffe or what ever, then you may not agree with the general parameters of contemporary dressage. In that case you need to train your own horse from scratch.

I would suggest getting your trainer on board in your search.

@Scribbler

I expect it depends on how you define correctly trained.

If the horse has a show history of getting good scores than he is correctly trained for the purpose of competitive dressage.

If you find horses who are scoring well but you don’t like how they go, overbent or sloppy piaffe or what ever, then you may not agree with the general parameters of contemporary dressage. In that case you need to train your own horse from scratch.

I would suggest getting your trainer on board in your search.

Thanks and a good point to clarify I am not interested in showing but in riding correctly and classically. I enjoy riding for the feeling of oneness and self carriage. So, show records don’t mean much to me and yes, we are in the search together.

[Dutchmare433]

I think it’s going to depend a lot on your budget where you’ll find these horses. The really nice, talented, young, correctly trained horses are more likely to be sold by word of mouth and trainer connections than advertised on the internet.

[Scribbler]

@Roni4444

Thanks and a good point to clarify I am not interested in showing but in riding correctly and classically. I enjoy riding for the feeling of oneness and self carriage. So, show records don’t mean much to me and yes, we are in the search together.

If you don’t care to show but want to ride classically and correctly you might want to check out horses trained by coaches affiliated with the Philippe Karl program in North America. There is no reason you couldn’t show such a horse of course. However the foundation on such a horse might be more what you are interested in. I would start by looking at the PK website for the names of people in the teachers program and then find Stables in your region. Or attend and audit a 2018 clinic.

Obviously this is a relatively small group of coaches but that would be a good starting point.

[J-Lu]

OP, what is your budget for said horse? Are you looking for said horse right now or in the near future?

There are lots of good sources who advertise on their own websites and through connections. For fourth level under 10, you are looking at professionals and warmbloods with a show record through fourth (how else will they confirm Fourth level?) heading towards FEI. You will pay $$$ for this horse because it is an FEI prospect! The exception might be a talented horse who, for example, likes to stick its tongue out. I knew someone who purchased a FEI baroque horse who loved to keep his tongue out, she rode him FEI and did regular clinics but did not show.

[Scribbler]

Yes, very good point that whether or not you want to show, the only way to know if a horse is confirmed 4 th level or any level is to have show scores. The levels only have meaning within a testing system.

I certainly see horses that have shown at training and maybe once not very well at level one, advertised as “schooling level 2” or higher. I expect such grade inflation exists right up the levels.

It’s common enough for a horse to do some higher moves but have gaps in his training such that he can only successfully test at a lower level.

[Roni4444]

@J-Lu

OP, what is your budget for said horse? Are you looking for said horse right now or in the near future?

There are lots of good sources who advertise on their own websites and through connections. For fourth level under 10, you are looking at professionals and warmbloods with a show record through fourth (how else will they confirm Fourth level?) heading towards FEI. You will pay $$$ for this horse because it is an FEI prospect! The exception might be a talented horse who, for example, likes to stick its tongue out. I knew someone who purchased a FEI baroque horse who loved to keep his tongue out, she rode him FEI and did regular clinics but did not show.

Thanks - I have a good budget as I know these horses demand a price. I have checked some websites but often the info is outdated and I don’t know enough names to check. That’s why I am looking for suggestions on how to find these horses. I wish there would be one or two sites everyone would list their horses. I have spent many hours online and dont mind doing a lot of work but general searches don’t provide many satisfactory results.

I looked at a few German sales barns and it seems that some have a quite nice selection of horses in one place. But I want to search here first before heading to Europe.

[Roni4444]

@Dutchmare433

I think it’s going to depend a lot on your budget where you’ll find these horses. The really nice, talented, young, correctly trained horses are more likely to be sold by word of mouth and trainer connections than advertised on the internet.

I do think so too - there are plenty of nice horses out there but many advertised ones are not this quality.

[Roni4444]

@Scribbler

Yes, very good point that whether or not you want to show, the only way to know if a horse is confirmed 4 th level or any level is to have show scores. The levels only have meaning within a testing system.

I certainly see horses that have shown at training and maybe once not very well at level one, advertised as “schooling level 2” or higher. I expect such grade inflation exists right up the levels.

It’s common enough for a horse to do some higher moves but have gaps in his training such that he can only successfully test at a lower level.

Not showing doesnt mean I don’ride through the tests. And seeing some horses doing a certain level of test does also not mean that they are confirmed at that level, as some are done badly. And yes, a lot of frustration is seeing the videos after reading the description of what level the horse is supposed to be and often they are not

[CanteringCarrot]

First off, I am glad that you are trying to shop in North America before Europe. A lot of people jump straight to Europe, and I know that they have their reasons, but I feel like the American market needs to be supported too. This coming from someone that lives in Europe…

There are sellers that import and resell, so you may not have to import yourself. I find that a lot of people are advertising on Facebook these days. Are you open to anywhere in the US and Canada? Or are you trying to stay within a certain region/states?

[Kemosabe]

If you want to see many sales horses in one small geographic area, go to Wellington and Loxahatchee Florida this winter

[CFFarm]

@Kemosabe

If you want to see many sales horses in one small geographic area, go to Wellington and Loxahatchee Florida this winter

Ditto this

[2tempe]

OP - Heidi Degele in Loxahatchee sells a lot of horses, generally very nice and almost entirely 3rd level and above. She also knows a ton of people and may be able to send you in other directions as well. Her sales list is not as long now as it has been but its still early in the season.

And, if your budget allows, contact the new Helgstrand barn in Wellington.

I’m also going to ask why you wouldn’t consider something w/ less than perfect training? My current horse came with some contact issues and a brain that would get ahead of himself. But he was so much fun to be around and on; such an amazing work ethic and so capable, that I fell in love. Way better now, he got me my silver medal and we will soon do I-1.

[Magicboy]

If I had the Budget, I would be in contact and perhaps visit clinicians that I know and admire: Volket Broman, Rebecca Rigdon, Heather Blitz

[MysticOakRanch]

You can always put an ISO listing on the Dressage Horses for Sale FB page. You’ll have to sort through a lot of horses that don’t meet your criteria, but you might find some good prospects there. Then second the comments - Welly World, or some of the bigger shows in California, and contact a few of the bigger name trainers.

[Edre]

I agree with MysticOakRanch above: I think your best chance is going to actually make an ISO post. There’s at least one FB group I know of that focuses on dressage horse sales that has in excess of 36,000 members. Now, only a fraction are selling but there’s still dozens of horses that go up each day and most sellers seem very responsive to actually reading an ISO ad and posting their horse if it fits their criteria.

I also think you’ll be successful in your search if you’re willing to accept horses that are marketed as “schooling” fourth level or above as opposed to “confirmed”. Like an earlier post mentioned, a 4th level 4yo is a fast-tracked young horse prospect. If you’re flexible on age (extend it to 6yo, maybe?) you might find more horses as well.

[Angela_Freda]

OP it would help to know your location, your budget range, and can you clarify you say you want:

‘a quality horse that’s at or below 10 years of age, 4th or above with good gaits’

But then state… 'Not showing doesnt mean I don’ride through the tests. And seeing some horses doing a certain level of test does also not mean that they are confirmed at that level, as some are done badly. And yes, a lot of frustration is seeing the videos after reading the description of what level the horse is supposed to be and often they are not "

So how is it that you will determine that the horse you become interested in is 4th or above anyway without show recordS?
You might not think much of a show record, and indeed one score in the 60s could be evidence of the pair having had a really good day on show day… but several scores in the 60s from a variety of judges does speak to a more likely proficiency at that level.
Conversely, if the pair has a couple scores in the 40s, I think one can say that the show record confirms that horse is NOT 4th level proficient, and maybe not 3rd either if there are no scores at 3rd either.
A show record, in part, can often show us the horses progress up the training scale, and should/could reflect the appropriateness of the move up to a new level, as evidenced by the quality, consistent scores at the former level. Ie that Classical, quality training you seek.

And why 4th? If you are already riding at 4th level and ready to move up, I am surprised your trainer doesn’t have sources of horses suitable for you to consider, to cut out that whole ‘bait/switch’ you are experiencing with horses being advertised as ___ while demonstrating they clearly are not proficient at that level. Most trainers have a good network especially if they themselves still work with other trainers as most quality, UL trainers do.

[Angela_Freda]

@Roni4444

Thanks - I have a good budget as I know these horses demand a price. I have checked some websites but often the info is outdated and I don’t know enough names to check. That’s why I am looking for suggestions on how to find these horses. I wish there would be one or two sites everyone would list their horses. I have spent many hours online and dont mind doing a lot of work but general searches don’t provide many satisfactory results.

I looked at a few German sales barns and it seems that some have a quite nice selection of horses in one place. But I want to search here first before heading to Europe.

Perhaps the OP can start that… what a way to fund your Dressage career, a website for marketing ‘Higher level Dressage horses’ that have been pre-screened by a Maestro of Dressage so that a listing on the website would indicate that the ad indeed represents the horse offered!
Cha-Ching!

[BigMama1]

@Dutchmare433

I think it’s going to depend a lot on your budget where you’ll find these horses. The really nice, talented, young, correctly trained horses are more likely to be sold by word of mouth and trainer connections than advertised on the internet.

This