Woman Shot at Barisone Farm

[clanter]

@BigMama1

Which is why having a gun easily accessible increases the likelihood that someone’s going to get shot. When someone is desperate and not thinking straight, the last thing you want is them to be able to put their hands on a gun in a moment of rage.

had he ever been known to have a gun …ever? … I do not know him but there has not been any mention anywhere of him being one who played around with firearms at all.

BSC person had pushed all buttons then more buttons and the he finally blew across the line of real world into insanity.

But do not expect this case to go to trial in the next few moments. I just looked up a case that I am pretty familiar with as it was my wife’s boss who killed two women nearly two years ago and there is yet to be a trial date set. He was the director of behavioral health quality and administration at John Peter Smith Hospital in Fort Worth.

Behavioral Health is the psychiatric ward

[MHM]

@clanter

But do not expect this case to go to trial in the next few moments. I just looked up a case that I am pretty familiar with as it was my wife’s boss who killed two women nearly two years ago and there is yet to be a trial date set. He was the director of behavioral health quality and administration at John Peter Smith Hospital in Fort Worth.

Behavioral Health is the psychiatric ward

Wow, that sounds like a long time to wait for a trial. Is he out on bail, or has he been locked up this whole time?

[2tempe]

@TMares

The first statement doesn’t bother me. I haven’t seen the second. That statement, if it’s in conjunction with some fictional reenactment vision of 'what really happened"… well, I don’t take those seriously, either.

THIS^ I doubt anyone here thinks generally that someone is “justified” in shooting another no matter how many buttons are pushed. I also think one could come up with scenarios (fictional versions ^^) that could lead one to snap - not a justification, so much as an explanation of circumstances.
And lastly, in some true self defense event, yes people could say a person was justified.

[ToN_Farm]

@clanter

But do not expect this case to go to trial in the next few moments.

No, but a Preliminary Hearing is the next step isn’t it. That I would think would be relatively soon.

[Maude]

@BigMama1

Which is why having a gun easily accessible increases the likelihood that someone’s going to get shot. When someone is desperate and not thinking straight, the last thing you want is them to be able to put their hands on a gun in a moment of rage.

We get it Big Mamma. You are anti-gun. But in a fit of rage anything can be used as a weapon. Grab a knife, hammer, shovel, etc. Presto…weapon.

[emgjoker]

@BigMama1

Really? I have seen a lot of people argue that she “pushed him to the limit” and “what else was he supposed to do?”

Agree with TMares. I’ve seen a lot of people say she pushed and pushed and certainly had a part in how this went down. I’m one of those. IMO, but for her actions, it’s reasonable to say that he’d have likely gone through the rest of his life, like his life up until now, violence free. However, he still should not have shot her! He screwed up, no question. I would guess he’s well aware of that now. I haven’t seen a single person say it’s ok that he shot her. There is a difference. Pretending that she was barely a bother and he simply did this so he didn’t have to go through the eviction process is as inaccurate as saying it’s ok for him to have shot her, I believe.

[MeisterMagnolia]

@clanter

had he ever been known to have a gun …ever? … I do not know him but there has not been any mention anywhere of him being one who played around with firearms at all.

BSC person had pushed all buttons then more buttons and the he finally blew across the line of real world into insanity.

But do not expect this case to go to trial in the next few moments. I just looked up a case that I am pretty familiar with as it was my wife’s boss who killed two women nearly two years ago and there is yet to be a trial date set. He was the director of behavioral health quality and administration at John Peter Smith Hospital in Fort Worth.

Behavioral Health is the psychiatric ward

Yikes! Sounds like he needed some of his own behavioral health.

[seahorse]

Within the past few years MB had many guns locked in a very large standing safe in the barn office.

You might check court records to see if he he was court ordered to do community service for verbally assaulting an officer when stopped for speeding in Loxahatchee, Fl.

You might check to see if there are elder abuse records.

[AnotherRound]

@Girl Joey

I personally have never met Lauren Kanarek however, I have been mentally tortured by her for four years. I lost my son via drowning and she accuse me on my Facebook wall of murdering him because a di#k was in my a++ while he drowned. S he has been stalking me for four years posting things about my fiancé she dated 25 years ago and lied and cheated on him. This girl is a pathological liar and I have proof for all my claims . I don’t have a couple pages I have thousands of text messages she sent me via Facebook messenger that are the most heartbreaking disgusting things you could ever read . She had the audacity to write on her Facebook wall which is still there that I was trying do you follow her on Twitter. When in actuality I was trying to block her because I knew what she did on my Facebook wall. I was new to Twitter and I didn’t know how to hit Block. Somebody went on her Facebook wall and deleted all of her and sick messages. I just so happen to have taken snapshots of some. I am not sure if I am allowed to attach her written text messages to me that are the most disgusting thing I’ve ever read . I actually feel bad for her fiancé Robert Guy Goodwin, One girl that was friends with him since childhood wrote hello to him on his Facebook wall and iLauren n return wrote that her that her vagina smelledl like cottage cheese out of jealousy. She is neurotic and jealous of every guy she’s ever dated but so freely cheats on each one of them. She is honestly one of the most evil, sick, vicious people I have ever met with such an ugly heart. I am a Christian and I never prayed for death, I truly hope she survives this For Michael Barisone,‘s sake. I am a witness to how she drives somebody so insane they would want to cause her physical pain. I would have never have taken the plunge of shooting her. However you all have no idea how much she tortured Mary Haskins and Michael Barisone, I have proof I am just waiting for the actual truth of the storm to get out on the news . I personally have contacted every new station to give them the truth about this lunatic. I am sympathetic to her family for everything they are going to deal with through it all. May God bless his blessings upon Michael, Mary, Robert guy and all their families . If somebody would let me know if I have the ability to attach text messages with cursewords in it please let me know

I think there is a paperclip link just above the post when you create it, and this is what you click to upload your pics. There are other icons, you try all of them to see.

[Angela_Freda]

@AnotherRound

I think there is a paperclip link just above the post when you create it, and this is what you click to upload your pics. There are other icons, you try all of them to see.

If this claim is legit., I sure hope you will not share it @Girl Joey and instead share what you have with the legal professionals involved. Sharing it here does zero good for anyone.

[BigMama1]

@Maude

We get it Big Mamma. You are anti-gun. But in a fit of rage anything can be used as a weapon. Grab a knife, hammer, shovel, etc. Presto…weapon.

I’m not anti gun. I’m pro better gun control laws. Anything can be used as a weapon, sure, but all the options you mention make it harder to attempt to kill multiple people at once, are less likely to be deadly, and the attacker is more likely to be overpowered and subdued without loss of life. Do you really think if MB had shown up at the house armed with a shovel instead of a handgun the outcome would have been the same?

I just think it’s sad all around for everyone involved that this awful situation could have been avoided in so many ways - if one or both parties had just walked away, if one or both parties had just let the conflict go through the appropriate (if slow) legal channels, if there hadn’t been easy access to a gun. …

[clanter]

@MHM

Wow, that sounds like a long time to wait for a trial. Is he out on bail, or has he been locked up this whole time?

out on bail… $400,000 for killing two people

it was his gun but …and there seems to always be a but these days… for some reason there is a question about just who shot who and how… as it appears the victims DNA is on the weapon

[clanter]

by the way this is not just a Thing that happens in the US

be a slow waiter in France…
https://www.foxnews.com/world/france-waiter-killed-sandwich-customer

don’t like the rival soccer team in Honduras
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/honduras-soccer-riot-rival-teams-deaths

[x-halt-salute]

A lot of us are not interested in having a gun control debate on a dressage forum. Those of us in the U.S. tend to hear and talk quite a lot about this topic recently outside of CotH, both because of current events and because of the upcoming elections. CotH is usually a nice respite from politics, and even those who are quite sympathetic to @BigMama1 's perspective may prefer to talk about dressage here, not gun control.

Which is, I believe, why there is so much discussion about what sort of circumstances could have led to a violent crime at a dressage facility.

In my experience, progress in dressage has required the cultivation of personal traits that are at odds with the actions that MB is reported to have taken. Making progress as a rider and moving a horse up the levels in dressage has, IME, required ever increasing self-awareness, self-control (both physically and emotionally), and patience. Part of why I love this sport is because those personal traits developed in the saddle have extended into my non-equestrian life and made it a more peaceful one. Individuals vary and I’m sure we all know some dressage riders who don’t necessarily use the sport for personal development, but at least for me, my experience in dressage and how training impacts a rider makes it all the more astonishing that someone who trains at MB’s level would behave in the way that is reported.

Which makes the discussion about how this might have come to pass relevant to dressage, and at least in part an attempt to reconcile the awful things that happened with the good that we’ve experienced in our sport. Not an attempt to excuse anything that happened or any of the individuals involved. Or a launching pad for a general U.S. gun control debate.

I see no sentiment here that the outcome would have been the same were there not a firearm involved. I see no claims that anyone deserved to be shot. I also see no malice in wondering how an apparently successful, high-level dressage trainer could end up feeling compelled to take the illogical and destructive actions that were taken. Or in pointing out that nobody in this situation smells like roses. The whole thing is tragic, but I don’t understand the animosity toward people who are trying to imagine how it possibly could have happened. It’s human nature to try to make sense of what seem like incomprehensible events.

[Silverbridge]

@x-halt-salute

I see no sentiment here that the outcome would have been the same were there not a firearm involved. I see no claims that anyone deserved to be shot.

You are not reading the same thread I am.

One poster here has stated very clearly that people who get shot are those who do something that gets them shot. Dozens of others have implied as much in their comments. without saying it right out, like that poster did.

[x-halt-salute]

@Silverbridge

You are not reading the same thread I am.

One poster here has stated very clearly that people who get shot are those who do something that gets them shot. Dozens of others have implied as much in their comments. without saying it right out, like that poster did.

I missed the “people who get shot do something that gets them shot” post in the 60+ pages of posts here. It’s apparently enough of a minority opinion not to have cropped up frequently.

But I believe that a lot is being read into many of the other posts here that is not intended by the posters. It’s possible to explore LK’s actions and motivations in the sequence of events that led to this tragedy without believing that she deserved an attempt on her life. There is no logical entailment that believing LK not to be blameless in the larger conflict requires believing that she is at fault in the specific event that put bullets into her body.

I have enough faith in the humanity of my fellow posters here not to jump to the conclusion that they all wish this woman ill, even if they find fault with her behavior.

[Scribbler]

As far as how it happens, I’ve been mulling over the interesting snippet way back that SW of the terrible DH site came out in support of MB and not LK. When in fact the similarities between SW and LK are huge. Similar family background, well off but not super wealthy lawyer fathers, estranged from the family, some kind of independent income, fake self presentation as wealthy socialite. Lower level rider with modest achievements, hopping towns and barns leaving a trail of conflict, but apparently able to make an OK first impression at each new place. Finally ends up with a high ranking trainer and then instigates a huge business/personal feud, and swears they will destroy the trainer by any means possible.

The difference here is that SW is only a keyboard warrior/internet troll, so while she’s been a nuisance, I don’t think she’s had any real effect on her former trainers, though she has destroyed her own crediblity in the process. In contrast, LK fights her battles IRL, as well as online. And LK has indeed probably succeeded in ruining her trainer, but at huge personal cost to herself which she never foresaw or intended, obviously.

Anyhow, I find the similarities really interesting, which makes me wonder if this is a fairly common type at that level, in that part of the world (coastal USA)? We wouldn’t really hear about them until they somehow get on the national stage. Are there potentially future SW and LK types, threatening everybody online for years, then finally focusing on their trainer?

[hut-ho78]

Please no rabbit trail on gun control. He could have beaten her to death before the boyfriend could have intervened even if he wasn’t armed. Big man/small woman. MB has been lauded on COTH forums as a favorite clinician and great guy. He could have filed to evict her. They could have taped her yelling, Facebook lived her, etc. to help with the evictions. This whole thing is so bizarre. Everyone’s conduct leading up to the inexplicable climax is so confusing, complete lack of self protection, professionalism and not long ago everything seemed in good standing. There are lots of articles on NJ eviction. He has no record with the criminal justice system, apparently she and her fiancé’ do. He was in good standing in the community. We all run into unstable people, a little compassion and legal and bureaucratic help are available. You can sit in a government office and they will help you with what forms, how to full out forms, etc. That usually makes a government employee’s day, being able to help one person you can see makes up for a lot of people you can’t help and people that are “harder to help than others” because they just don’t want to follow rules or they try to bully their way around.

This situation is so sad and unnecessary.

[MHM]

@clanter

out on bail… $400,000 for killing two people

it was his gun but …and there seems to always be a but these days… for some reason there is a question about just who shot who and how… as it appears the victims DNA is on the weapon

Thanks. I agree with the earlier poster who said maybe he should have gotten some help at his own mental health clinic. Physician, heal thyself. Or administrator, administrate thyself, depending on his role there.

The part about the DNA evidence just shows that all the theories here about MB and LK and what happened that day are all pure conjecture. We don’t know what we don’t know regarding all the evidence.

[OverandOnward]

@Mardi

Curious to know how long can he remain living there, considering he and LK are under an eviction notice,
and the Fire Marshall told them to vacate (according to MB) .

Just a little more specific information about the eviction process, from someone in another state than has been discussed.

It depends on the state and the local jurisdiction. In states where the process is longer, perhaps 3, 6 or even 9 months. In states where the process is more straightforward, depending on circumstances, at best 2 weeks but more realistically 1 to 2 months. The basic eviction process tends to follow the same general steps across jurisdictions, but the details and the timeline vary between states.

In some jurisdictions a farm eviction has a longer legal process, designed to give the tenant more time to find another farm home and relocate the animals.

The tenant is likely not paying during this process. Technically this creates a debt they still owe even after the eviction, but other than filing it in court it may not ever be possible to collect any blood from that rock.

There is a big IF on the timeline for any state or jurisdiction, and that is IF that the process is followed correctly and expeditiously by the landlord. There are a many formal steps that have to happen in just a certain way. The landlord has to keep the process moving forward by continuing to take the next step as soon as it is allowed after the last step. If the landlord stops or slows down, so does the process.

If the landlord screws up the process then the timeline will be extended, sometimes by months, depending on the mistake. And the landlord can screw up the eviction process by behavior mistakes, as well as by process mistakes.

I mention this because some of the prolonged eviction horror stories happen when the landlord messes up. Sometimes a landlord thinks they can get a tenant out faster by doing dumb stuff that ends up adding weeks or months to the process. Dumb stuff includes anything from certain confrontations with the tenant to cutting off the tenant’s utilities. Threatening or in any way intimidating the tenant is on the list.

Even in conservative, pro-business states, tenants today have far more rights than they ever have, particularly in eviction situations. Deviating from the process plays into the tenant’s hands.

Some non-paying tenants are experienced in drawing out the process to live in a property while paying less than the agreed rent, or no rent at all. Some tenants are experienced in getting into a property without a contract and without paying rent, and then planting roots and requiring a lengthy, expensive and protracted process to get them out. This is how some tenants live, even though it means they must move every so many months. And there isn’t always a legal record if they manipulate the situation to allow them to eventually move out without the landlord filing on them, which the landlord reluctantly agrees to do to save the legal expense.

And some tenants are very good at baiting a landlord into making mistakes that add months to an eviction process.

These are general informational remarks. I have zero knowledge, or even a guess, of what happened in the case under discussion. Also I’m not an attorney, so none of this is legal advice.

An eviction in process can be a profoundly frustrating, worrying and expensive situation for a landlord. Doesn’t matter, the landlord has to stand down and let the process work. In many ways the landlord has fewer rights in a pending or active eviction situation than at any other time. There are more legal constraints on their actions and behavior than at any other time. The landlord may not be legally allowed to be on the property at all. They absolutely cannot do stuff outside of the eviction process to try to get the tenant to move sooner. They sure as hell can’t go over to the property to have it out with a recalcitrant tenant.

Sometimes a landlord suddenly becomes self-aware that they are at the property where they should not be, confonting a tenant which they should not do, and are in the throes of making a huge mistake which will be very costly to them … and then emotionally carry on making it that much worse. Dunno if that is what happened here, of course.

Ironically, it may now be a very long time before LK & RG can be legally removed from that property. Not counting the Fire Marshall situation, don’t know anything about what is going on with that.