Working with unhandled, 8 month old filly

[eightpondfarm]

i’ve been training mustangs lately. I work with them in a large enough area, 45x90 or 90x90. And until i get to the saddling stage, i have three or four together. I find they are more comfortable in with others.

They all have lived wild, some for many many years. Some, for just 3 or 4 years. But all of them have been unhandled.

How i like to do it is similar to what you are doing… for about 30 days, i just do chores in their pen. Eventually i begin to hand feed them alfalfa hay. all of this is a process, and it would take too long and bore too many people so i won’t go into it. I go slowly…at their pace, and i never push them. With the whole alfalfa thing, i first have them take from my hand. Then i hold out one hand for them to touch, then deliver a small mouthfull with the other. Fairly quickly this becomes a game of: Touch me. I touch you. you eat. I add ‘touch it’ and have them nose touch all kinds of things, (one thing at a time…maybe when they get advanced i might have two things with me for them to touch)concentrating on horse stuff, esp halters. Then Touch It. It touches you. You eat. I have the halter touching them all around their face (again, one place at a time and gradually introduce ‘it touches you’ to new places on their face. I have the strap (or long part if its a rope halter) go over their poll. i feed them through the nose piece. Soon, that halter has been all over their head. It is not much of an ask to then, once their nose is through it to slowly lift the rope on over and through the loop. I IMMEDIATELY take it off. The big deal is to get them happy to shove thier face into a halter for a treat. I want to have them one day do the same with a bridle. I want them to WANT to get haltered. All of them, all i have to do is show them a halter and i’ll have four or five mustangs trying to get themselves into it first.

leading is a whole nuther thing. And i start that with baling twine. they need to learn to move away from pressure. So nuanced pressure is so easy to control with a piece of twine over their poll.

[LeatherLover]

Oh I like your idea about the halter. Im going to start this today. You are definitely working the same job Im working right now. I put my hand in her feed tuba while she eats and her nose will nibble around it and let me scratch her nose. Im on no time schedule at all .It’s such a rewarding journey.

[LeatherLover]

Im going to keep in touch once we get to the leading part.

[eightpondfarm]

to me, they are two separate things, Getting Haltered. Leading.
I don;t combine a leadrope to a halter until i have them leading on a twine over their poll. Then a rope, then a longsleeved sweatshirt… They learn the words with just the twine…
Which i am quite willing to let go of easily. No fuss, no pushing… just easy happy

WalkOn, Whoa. It’s pretty easy really, When they are really good with the twine then adding a leadrope to the halter is a slam-dunk.

[SillyHorse]

@LeatherLover

I’m going to say you are about 50 years behind in experience and knowledge, so let’s just leave it at that. I’m seeking “tips” from 30-50 year experienced professionals who have had a lifetime of arena and track success with horses of many, many horses of all ages, talents, diverse training in every aspect of racing, showing, breeding or training, just as myself. That is how the best horsemen succeed by sharing experience and knowledge from accomplished people in their field of expertise. This is not your conversation so please don’t say silly things.

If you have this “lifetime of success,” I guess I’m not sure, then, why you are asking us for input. If you don’t agree with what someone offers you, you can ignore it. There’s no need to be rude and derisive.

[Bluey]

Remember how people see, only in front of them, unless we turn our head or ourselves around, and how horses see and go by, when working with horses.
Some clinicians insist a horse “give them two eyes”, which doesn’t really make that much sense, they can see just fine out of one, on either side:

[IdahoRider]

@cutter99

There is a trainer, who posts on Facebook, on a page called Enck’s Training LLC.

Not wanting to step on any toes, but I have seen his videos and the guy is an idiot with his kid (very unsafe). If he can’t take some simple safety steps for his child, what kind of risks does he take with the horses that he doesn’t record and share?
Sheilah

[candyappy]

@LeatherLover

I’m going to say you are about 50 years behind in experience and knowledge, so let’s just leave it at that. I’m seeking “tips” from 30-50 year experienced professionals who have had a lifetime of arena and track success with horses of many, many horses of all ages, talents, diverse training in every aspect of racing, showing, breeding or training, just as myself. That is how the best horsemen succeed by sharing experience and knowledge from accomplished people in their field of expertise. This is not your conversation so please don’t say silly things.

With all due respect to your personal opinion of me and my " expertise" I will say that I have been raising and training all my own horses since I was a teen in 1976. I have also trained horses for others. From grade horses to OTTBs. I have also worked with a lot of foals. some mine , some for others.

I may not be the professional opinion you seek but I have enough experience to know you don’t force a young, scared and unhandled horse enough that it kicks at you.

Time , patience and working with a horse( foal or adult) so it has the time and ability to understand what you are asking is my preferred method. If you don’t agree then just disregard my answer and move on. There is no need to be insulting.

I hope for this horse you can find the expert advice you are looking for.

[Laurierace]

@LeatherLover

I’m going to say you are about 50 years behind in experience and knowledge, so let’s just leave it at that. I’m seeking “tips” from 30-50 year experienced professionals who have had a lifetime of arena and track success with horses of many, many horses of all ages, talents, diverse training in every aspect of racing, showing, breeding or training, just as myself. That is how the best horsemen succeed by sharing experience and knowledge from accomplished people in their field of expertise. This is not your conversation so please don’t say silly things.

Ok I’ll bite. You say she is 50 years too late with her advice but you are looking for tips from people with 30-50 years experience? What exactly is 50 years too late about her advice? I have over 30 years professional training experience including being a licensed race horse trainer for 30 years and four generations of homebreds on the ground and I agreed with her take it slow but start touching where you can advice. The easiest way to win a foal over is to scratch their itchy spots which are plentiful. So what exactly are you incredibly rudely I may add objecting to?

[LeatherLover]

Because there is a first for everything. This is my first totally unhandled weanling so I’m asking for input from others who have handled such. Always someone ready to fight or criticize. I’ll try to paint the picture again, you cannot scratch their itchy spots until you are able to gain their trust. Please just stop.

[LeatherLover]

I don’t pay any attention to the online trainers. The best trainers never advertise.

[LeatherLover]

I’m not being rude. No one makes a comment that "you’re doing something wrong if you worry about a weanling kicking you. " That is utter nonsense. An unhandled weanling isn’t much different than a deer, my friend and if anyone thinks they are never at risk of being kicked because they know all, they aren’t too knowledgeable in my book and shouldn’t comment.

[LeatherLover]

and once again “who said I was forcing my weanling to do anything?” That was an assumption on your part and that;s where you lost me.

[LeatherLover]

Soooo, baby girl has come a long way in a month. She loves her smaller enclosure too. I have been able to brush her all over with exception of her head. She seems to appreciate that many times I don’t ask anything of her, then, that’s when she comes to me for a snack. She likes to eat out of the feed scoop now, before I pour it into her tub. I have laid a rope across her neck with no issue so far. She also doesn’t seem to mind me leaning on her or laying an arm across her back. She really enjoys her tail brushed and having her full body massages. I think, soon, we will be able to work up to the halter. The biggest protest that she had, was working on her right side. She didn’t seem to mind having hands all over her left side, but it was like starting at the beginning on her right side. She is really starting to settle and bond.

[Bluey]

@LeatherLover

Soooo, baby girl has come a long way in a month. She loves her smaller enclosure too. I have been able to brush her all over with exception of her head. She seems to appreciate that many times I don’t ask anything of her, then, that’s when she comes to me for a snack. She likes to eat out of the feed scoop now, before I pour it into her tub. I have laid a rope across her neck with no issue so far. She also doesn’t seem to mind me leaning on her or laying an arm across her back. She really enjoys her tail brushed and having her full body massages. I think, soon, we will be able to work up to the halter. The biggest protest that she had, was working on her right side. She didn’t seem to mind having hands all over her left side, but it was like starting at the beginning on her right side. She is really starting to settle and bond.

Sounds like you are doing great gentling her.
I am sure you already know this, before you try to give any little pulls on the rope, you can have her taught to give with your body handling, a little gentle push here and there to move over as you ask politely, an invitation to come into your space other times by taking half steps back and standing sideways, is a whole body communication, is how horses talk to each other.

By the time you have a rope, over her neck or withers or belly, not attached to itself or a halter, she may be already following the feel of that rope and going with it.

Every horse is different, you invent what works for each one on the spot and go with it, as you are doing with her now.

To work on her letting you around her head without resisting, try the lowering head cue.
That is an important cue nature has installed for us as horses evolved.
When a horse puts head down, the autonomic nervous system takes a back seat and horse relaxes, eyes and mouth soften.
You can teach it with offering a treat/food and lowering it so horse has to reach down.
A bit lower first, then ask for more if horse cooperates, eventually you can keep your hand on the neck as it gains confidence, first around the shoulder, then higher and higher, until it rests on the poll, horse relaxed into the feel.
Do it only when horse is already relaxed, don’t want to provoke the contrary, a resistance if horse is anxious, protective and insecure to get the offering and snatches and jerks head back up and away.

Try to always ask for any behavior when horse is where it can offer it happily and willingly, is how horses learn with the least stress, as I am sure you already know.

[SillyHorse]

@LeatherLover

Because there is a first for everything. This is my first totally unhandled weanling so I’m asking for input from others who have handled such. Always someone ready to fight or criticize. I’ll try to paint the picture again, you cannot scratch their itchy spots until you are able to gain their trust. Please just stop.

@LeatherLover

I’m not being rude. No one makes a comment that "you’re doing something wrong if you worry about a weanling kicking you. " That is utter nonsense. An unhandled weanling isn’t much different than a deer, my friend and if anyone thinks they are never at risk of being kicked because they know all, they aren’t too knowledgeable in my book and shouldn’t comment.

You clearly misunderstand how this forum works. You do not get to dictate who comments. Again, you are free to ignore what anyone posts. Being rude and dismissive is not a good look. I’m not surprised you have found a kindred spirit here.

[SuzieQNutter]

@LeatherLover

I think, soon, we will be able to work up to the halter. The biggest protest that she had, was working on her right side. She didn’t seem to mind having hands all over her left side, but it was like starting at the beginning on her right side.

With horses they have to be taught on both sides. Because you can do something on one side does not mean you can do it on the other side. Do not try and mount a horse you do not know on the off side.

[eightpondfarm]

Sounds like you’re taking care to be considerate to your young mare. That you are taking the time to get to know her as an individual, and she you, that’s the important thing. Trust and mutual respect begins with a kernel and grows from there. Sometimes it feels like things are taking ForEVer! but when you think about building a solid foundation than it makes more sense and is easier to swallow all that careful time spent. I swear to you, when you get the base part solid, the sky’s the limit.

[LeatherLover]

I agree with you 100%. We have had a bit of a setback because of my job taking so much of my time and then we had a feed issue with the feed I was using. My feed store couldnt get Omolene 300 for a few months and they suggested Strategy. After 3-4 weeks on Strategy, her personality changed… a LOT! So, she has been back on the 300 for a week and she is starting to calm down again. (BTW, I asked why they did not have Omolene 300 at my Tractor Supply store and they told me that they had a beef with Purina because their warehouse was not being kept clean and mice, mouse droppings, inspection complaints, etc were getting bad. So TSC stopped receiving foods from that warehouse for a few months). Anywho, with filly face, we are kinda getting caught up to speed. She is roping horse/cutting bred and that’s where I am finding the difference in working with her. I have always handled western pleasure and halter weanlings and their dispositions are a whole lotta sweetness. My new girlie with quick, reactive and has some of the fanciest foot work I have ever seen. It’s a whole different approach to this girl.

[pony_grandma]

Since you ‘asked for advice’ My advice is to learn to scroll.