Just as a general FYI, the horses are not rejected at the plant, but at the border. A lot of those border rejects get dumped somewhere in the desert cause the “owners” don’t want to take them back.
[QUOTE=luvmytbs;8006286]
Just as a general FYI, the horses are not rejected at the plant, but at the border. A lot of those border rejects get dumped somewhere in the desert cause the “owners” don’t want to take them back.[/QUOTE]
Horses are also rejected at the plant.
The border doesn’t care about the horses weight or color or size, they care about it matching the papers and health.
The plant do care about size and color and weight… as well as health.
So while yes, horses can get turned back at the border, they also get rejected at the plant, and in some cases the person presenting the rejected horse at the plant get’s ‘dinged’ in that they lose $$.
So, where DO you draw the line then, and scrutinize them more closely?
If MOST of their money , and efforts results in saving horses, finding them homes etc, then I will cut them slack on bookeeping, overpaying to get a horse from auction, or not quarantine per standards.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8006552]
So, where DO you draw the line then, and scrutinize them more closely?
If MOST of their money , and efforts results in saving horses, finding them homes etc, then I will cut them slack on bookeeping, overpaying to get a horse from auction, or not quarantine per standards.[/QUOTE]
What does ‘most’ mean? How much is it ok to stuff in your pockets and not claim as income on your own tax returns?
How much is it ok to take from the rescue account and for the rescue to not report as paid to you?
10%? 20%
How do you define ‘find them a home’?
Of those Copiah Co horses, for example, they paid about $700 each for those horses to save them from the slaughter guy… they then adopted out most of them within a month, for adoption fees of between $25 and $100 each.
How do you screen 60+ homes in a matter of 4 weeks? How do you insure that 60+ horses are and stay safe? Especially when many went to their homes before being fully rehab’d, meaning that who knows what could be wrong with some of those horses that might disappoint the adopter to the point that they then flip it?
This also goes to the question "How do you define ‘save’? "
And I would think all of us horse owners and caregivers would be concerned with lax quarantine standards, regardless of who is doing it. Is that just me?
IF you are concerned , why not volunteer your help, book keeping expertise etc to these rescue groups.
I personally don’t care if they use 10 or 20% as profit, I dont’ expect them to work for free, as long as , "most ", of the funds, aka majority of funds go to rescue, that rescue is doing more than most of us so I don’t see the point of ripping them apart on threads.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8006655]
IF you are concerned , why not volunteer your help, book keeping expertise etc to these rescue groups. [/QUOTE]
LOL what makes you think I don’t?
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8006655]
I personally don’t care if they use 10 or 20% as profit, I dont’ expect them to work for free, as long as , "most ", of the funds, aka majority of funds go to rescue, that rescue is doing more than most of us so I don’t see the point of ripping them apart on threads.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the information on your pov.
[QUOTE=Countrywood;8006655]
IF you are concerned , why not volunteer your help, book keeping expertise etc to these rescue groups.
I personally don’t care if they use 10 or 20% as profit, I dont’ expect them to work for free, as long as , "most ", of the funds, aka majority of funds go to rescue, that rescue is doing more than most of us so I don’t see the point of ripping them apart on threads.[/QUOTE]
I don’t expect them to work for free.
I also don’t expect them to outbid non-slaughter homes. Rescues should be for the horses who need them, for those actually at risk, being bought by the meat man. Not being bid on by private buyers for private homes.
[QUOTE=Lady Eboshi;8000377]
I did, and I’ll stand by it. ONE PERCENT of all horses in the U.S. ship to slaughter every year. Where do the rest go? New owners.
Want to make that number ZERO? Lobby Washington for passage of the SAFE act. Failing that, we all do the best we can. How many rescue horses in YOUR barn, TTSP? I’ve got FIVE right now, mine and a boarder’s.
Put your money where your mouth is.[/QUOTE]
I’d love to know where your 1 percent figure came from, as I’ve not seen it anywhere.
[QUOTE=Lady Eboshi;8000672]
I am HARDLY in denial as to the realities of auctions, and I blame overbreeding and undertraining by people seeking tax shelters, hoarder/compulsive breeders,
and the Amish who breed horses that don’t translate well to non-Amish uses.
It seems at the moment we also have ridiculous overbreeding of minis and donkeys.
The figure of 1-2% per year shipped for slaughter is the best estimate of the large national agencies like AAEP and USDA who monitor such things, I didn’t make it up. NO ONE would like to see horse slaughter ended more than me. Back in the 70’s and 80’s believe me those figures were a great deal higher. We are within sight today of FINALLY of ending this if horse owners would agree to get it done!
So instead of snotty snipes at other COTH’ers, write out a letter and mail it to your Senator and Representative, asking them to support the SAFE act. Then write out a check to the nearest legitimate rescue that pulls, retrains, and places horses from auctions. Maybe enough for a week’s worth of hay in this winter weather. Then you MIGHT have some minor cred to preach to me, OK?[/QUOTE]
Do me a favor and provide a link to a site that provides this “information.”
OK, came across the clarification. But I would say then that the number is simply a red herring. And, btw, 1 percent of a very big number is - a very big number.
[QUOTE=SportArab;8006955]
Do me a favor and provide a link to a site that provides this “information.”[/QUOTE]
[I] ’ Q: How many unwanted horses are there?
A: In 2005, the American Horse Council (AHC) estimated there were 9.2 million horses in the United States. An accurate census of the U.S. horse population has not been performed, and the AHC has requested that USDA perform a national equine census at regular intervals. We do not have reliable statistics on the total number of horses that become unwanted each year. We do know that 90,000 to 140,000 horses have been sent to slaughter annually (the GAO estimated the 2011 number at 138,000), and that the total number of unwanted horses is greater than this. In 2007, the Unwanted Horse Coalition estimated there were 170,000 unwanted horses in the U.S. (including animals in the BLM adoption pipeline and unadopted feral animals housed in BLM facilities).
'[/I]
[I] Question: If slaughter is not an option, what will we do with sick, old and unwanted horses?
Answer: Approximately 920,000 horses die annually in this country (10 percent of an estimated population of 9.2 million) and the vast majority are not slaughtered, but euthanized and rendered or buried without any negative environmental impact. Just over 100,000 horses were slaughtered in the US 2008. If slaughter were no longer an option and these horses were rendered or buried instead, this would represent a small increase in the number of horses being disposed of in this manner - an increase that the current infrastructure can certainly sustain.
[/I]
What I want to know is WHO BREEDS THIS STUFF and how can we make them STOP?
Go to the CHW site for today’s “rescue” lot and take a look–WTF can ANYONE do with this many misbegotten minis, mules, and donkeys? Who BREEDS these animals that have no use except as expensive pets? If it’s the Amish it’s way past time SOMEBODY explained to them that their horsey-puppy mill is a disaster for the animals and can’t be doing them much good financially, either, if they’re running through New Holland for twenty bucks.
Where are they COMING from? :mad:
Notice also that a number of the usable horses are grays again; I’d imagine being kicked around and around the auction circuit endlessly is WORSE than the one-way ride, and there’s got to be an extra-hot corner in hell for creeps that dump a schoolie in this day and age. Takes a lot to get my Outrage up but this week did it.
[QUOTE=Angela Freda;8006539]
Horses are also rejected at the plant.
The border doesn’t care about the horses weight or color or size, they care about it matching the papers and health.
The plant do care about size and color and weight… as well as health.
So while yes, horses can get turned back at the border, they also get rejected at the plant, and in some cases the person presenting the rejected horse at the plant get’s ‘dinged’ in that they lose $$.[/QUOTE]
Please provide a credible link to support your statement.
Food products" rejected horses are put into the rendering lineup.
A classic double speak post from this individual
They are at fault because the horses were ARMs, not with new owners
Stated with authority.,…and then followed up with:
but then again, even if they were with new owners, most rescues I know and respect would be watching out for the welfare of even those they had found new homes for
Now she proves her statement had absolutely no validity as she backtracks.
I thought this thread was about the six horses that ARM outbid private homes to get and how they are fundraising now for the horses that could have already been in good private homes?
[QUOTE=Fairfax;8007030]
Please provide a credible link to support your statement.
Food products" rejected horses are put into the rendering lineup.[/QUOTE]
[I]The truck could hold more, but he chooses to load light instead of heavy to make certain that the horses arrive at Shelby or the Fort Macleod plant in good condition.
In the five years that he has been purchasing horses and sending them to the Bouvray plant, he says, only one has arrived there in an injured state that caused it to be rejected.[/I]
http://www.thehorse.com/articles/10394/horses-destined-for-slaughter
Fort Mcleod, isn’t that were you did your volunteer work?
Yes, that is the facility I volunteered at. I am surprised beause we had some walked up from owners having unloaded them…and they were immediately dead bolted due to the severity of their injuries…one by a pack of dogs.
Haven’t been there for a long time now and so maybe things have changed
Thanks for the link
Great idea:
From the ARM Facebook page:
THANK YOU to all the donors who have helped us over the last 10 years to rescue, rehabilitate and place over 2000 horses! As we enter our 11th year of helping horses, please take a moment to watch this video CJ made for us and consider donating to our KY Farm fund so we can purchase a larger farm to help even more horses. Paypal addy is donate@arabianresccuemission.org Happy New Year everyone!
Looks like ARM is standing by their “any cheap crap hole QT will do” policy.
The “Circus” horses are tucked away in a PA “QT” facility in stalls that are small, with concrete floors and all nose to nose with the other 20 something horses at the property.
Locals are hearing that horses are very sick at the place. Wonder if the 6 will make it out.
There were issues with the transporter who said these horses are wild. Highly doubt a circus would use wild horses for at liberty performance.
[QUOTE=Lady Eboshi;8007016]
What I want to know is WHO BREEDS THIS STUFF and how can we make them STOP?
Who BREEDS these animals that have no use except as expensive pets? If it’s the Amish it’s way past time SOMEBODY explained to them that their horsey-puppy mill is a :mad:
.[/QUOTE]
Every Amish guy I know, and there are several, breed horses for the road or field. They breed what they want in a work horse. Many, probably most, of the horses, at least the saddlebreds, going through NH were NOT AMISH BRED. They were bred by show horse people, the same people who have conniptions if the horse they bred has an actual job and does actual work.
The Amish do sell horses through sales. They sell at a lot of sales TO EACH OTHER. No kill buyers at the sales I’ve been to - the prices are too high. Often times selling a horse is a vehicle to give another family member needed dollars (i.e. buying a $500 horse for $1K).
Sure some horses go to Shipshewana or New Holland. The bulk of them don’t. As so many point out, Amish see horses as property. That property is sold much more cost effectively outside of low end auctions.
Most of the “rescued ASBs” were not bred by Ams, they were bred by back yard ammies & other breeders. If it were not for the Amish picking up their (English people) rejects, they (English) would be SOL.
The “rescued DHH” are bred by the Ams, & they are bred for use as road horses. Not too many $15K road horses are bought by kill buyers. Not too many $2K ones either.
The people who breed horses for “expensive pets” are not the Amish. Go mosey over to the sport horse breeding page or Craigslist if you want to see who’s breeding/selling expensive pets.
Why you have to bring the Amish into a thread about Arab rescues, I have no idea. Most Amish won’t touch an Arab with a 10’ pole & sure as heck aren’t breeding more than a handful a year.
Sorry, I didn’t realize this got this long.
