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baloubet du rouet son approved by Holstein - question

Sport Horse Breeding
#61

[QUOTE=AlterEgoME;6021936]
^Well said.

Personally, I think BdR is UGLY. I am also a believer in handsome is as handsome does and if the pony is FUGLY and it babysits my daughter then it is a beauty in my eye, but I am not going to breed for it.

As I have mentioned, my dad bred working dogs for the MP’s and police force and home and business protection. Those dogs did their job and then they tolerated anything the kids in the family threw at them. I ran over their toes with my baby bouncer, rolled off the couch on their backs and did all the stupid things kids do. And in the morning, they stood alert and attacked a threat on command. SELECTIVE breeding - whatever you are selecting for - is the important part. You have to know what you have in each parent and something about the dominant and recessive traits they have. You don’t breed for flukes and you are very careful when you breed to flukes.[/QUOTE]

Beautiful…

#62

[QUOTE=Darden19;6021740]
Was Balou du Rouet ever presented to the verband? What didn’t they like about him? And how do you think he compares with Barracuda?[/QUOTE]
Maybe you are confusing “Balou du Rouet” and “Baloubet du Rouet”
Balou is a son of Baloubet, he’s not a SF and he shouldn’t use the affix “du Rouet”, because this affix belongs to the Fardin familly who are breeding horses since a long time. It’s not fair from PS to have used that affix.
To answer your question Baloubet du Rouet was not presented for approval to the Holsteiner Verband as a youngster because he’s a SF (was approved for SF).

#63

I did mean to ask about the son, Balou (du Rouet). I think he’s out of a Continue (Contender) mare, so similar breeding. Just wanting to hear people’s thoughts :slight_smile:

#64

Another thought is that most of the good sport horse breeders I know breed their stallions and mares to compliment eachother… Not just because the stallion is good at a b or c.

One breeder I know will only breed to stallions that look VERY similar to the mare in every way (some have uncanny resemblence)… But she has some very nice mares that need very little correction.

Looking at the photos I dont see how he could compliment a mare at all conformationally… If the mare was in need of a better jump then you still run the risk of everything else and not getting that jump… And we all know the odds of actually getting a perfect ten jump on a foal as it is.

Throwing the proverbial darts at the board and hoping to get the jump but nothing else on a breeding??? Sounds RISKY!

#65

More photos of Baloubet during his Saint Lo presentation in 2010 (21y/o)

http://baloubetdurouet.blogscheval.net/archive/2011/12/13/baloubet-du-rouet-a-saint-lo-premiere-partie.html

http://baloubetdurouet.blogscheval.net/archive/2011/11/21/seance-de-photos-de-baloubet-du-rouet-lors-de-sa-presentatio.html

Nothing can replace looking at a stallion in front of you, photos and videos are limited in what they can convey.

#66

http://www.baloubetdurouet.com/english/gallery.html
More pictures --of an older stallion with a filled in top line–quite a different look. He looks like he is enjoying life with hs owners in Portugal.

#67

Omare, the link doesn’t work.

#68

Works for me…

#69

I see what you mean–it is his “official” web site…I cannot get it to work now eiither!

www.baloubetdurouet.com

#70

Really? Now that is strange. Because there’s a lot more to performance than how a horse looks standing still.

Then take a look at some of the Selle Francais and warmblood mares that he has produced successful competition offspring and breeding stallions with. Horsetelex is a good place to start looking…

Are you kidding me? :rolleyes: Again, I would suggest you take a look at his family if his competition record isn’t enough for you. Or better yet revise your idea of what makes a good competition jumping horse. :wink:

With his somewhat unorthodox jumping style I too wondered what sort of sire he would be, but his breeding record speaks for itself.

#71

[QUOTE=NOMIOMI1;6022986]
Another thought is that most of the good sport horse breeders I know breed their stallions and mares to compliment eachother… Not just because the stallion is good at a b or c.

One breeder I know will only breed to stallions that look VERY similar to the mare in every way (some have uncanny resemblence)… But she has some very nice mares that need very little correction.

Looking at the photos I dont see how he could compliment a mare at all conformationally… If the mare was in need of a better jump then you still run the risk of everything else and not getting that jump… And we all know the odds of actually getting a perfect ten jump on a foal as it is.

Throwing the proverbial darts at the board and hoping to get the jump but nothing else on a breeding??? Sounds RISKY![/QUOTE]Are you still talking about Baloubet du Rouet or any of the other stallions mentioned in this thread or in general?!! :confused:

Baloubet du Rouet is as previously mentioned in this thread ranked number two on the 2011 WBFSH list of show jumping stallions.

Me - and many with me - find it hard to believe he would be on that list for his performance as a breeding stallion if he didn’t have any good qualities but scope and jump since it’s kind of a more than well known fact you do need a good conformation in a horse to make it stay fit and sound!

#72

[QUOTE=equestrianism;6023599]
it’s kind of a more than well known fact you do need a good conformation in a horse to make it stay fit and sound![/QUOTE]

Yes, but BdR defies this rule.

#73

What part of his conformation makes you think he should be unsuccessful and lame instead?

If a horse is hugely successful and sound it seems to me the thing to do is to look at the horse and try to figure out why, not dismiss him as an exception.

#74

[QUOTE=grayarabpony;6025130]
What part of his conformation makes you think he should be unsuccessful and lame instead?

If a horse is hugely successful and sound it seems to me the thing to do is to look at the horse and try to figure out why, not dismiss him as an exception.[/QUOTE]

Really? Where in my post do I say that he would be unsuccessful and lame? Equestrianism said

you do need a good conformation in a horse to make it stay fit and sound
. The horse DOES NOT have good conformation, yet he remained sound, therefore he is an exception to that rule. I said nothing about dismissing him.

Of course we should figure out why a horse so poorly put together remained sound and jumped so well. I wrote one simple sentence and you extrapolated it into an opinion that I do not hold.

#75

[QUOTE=AlterEgoME;6025591]

Of course we should figure out why a horse so poorly put together remained sound and jumped so well. I wrote one simple sentence and you extrapolated it into an opinion that I do not hold.[/QUOTE]

There is no figuring out about the horse. We need our eyes re-trained big time.

It is not normal to think that one of the top show jumpers of all times is “ugly” or “badly put together”.

While we might not think a F1 is the most good looking car out there, it’s the best at its job and we appreciate its beauty as such. Same goes for horses! :wink:

#76

Artistic appeal and mechanical function are different things. An F1 is DESIGNED to perform. Equine conformation is designed to perform.

Ugly is a matter of opinion. Correct conformation is not. Which “faults” are acceptable and which are not, is a matter of opinion. The “faults” must still be acknowledged as such.

I don’t care one way or the other about BdR. I find him to be interesting genetically. Please see my original post for the point. This is not it.

#77

No need to be cranky Alter. :wink:

It seems most equate conformation with beauty, because conformationnally, this horse is the equine equivalent of a F1. Flawless for his job.

But we don’t have to agree, that’s the beauty of the art of discussion. :slight_smile:

#78

Ok. I cop to cranky. :wink: I just don’t like the way GAB likes to twist a simple statement. You cannot draw that many conclusions from one sentence.

#79

When I look at the photos of BDR, I see a lot of the influence of his Trotter granddam. Look at his neck and back (especially the length)…I can see why he would be tricky to breed with. What I find fascinating is that, just going from the video, it looks like little of that conformation came through to his son. Shows you the power of the mare.

#80

[QUOTE=AlterEgoME;6025636]
Artistic appeal and mechanical function are different things. An F1 is DESIGNED to perform. Equine conformation is designed to perform.

Ugly is a matter of opinion. Correct conformation is not. Which “faults” are acceptable and which are not, is a matter of opinion. The “faults” must still be acknowledged as such.

I don’t care one way or the other about BdR. I find him to be interesting genetically. Please see my original post for the point. This is not it.[/QUOTE]

There has to be a rule. Conformational standard cant change based on one horse… Or even 100 horses. The standard has been ideal for far too long and holding that measurement against stallions, mares, and their foals with so much success has proven itself abundantly clear on more levels then breed or even discipline.

You dont change something that MASSIVELY compiled because of this one jumper.

Your eye is trained to associate beauty with correctness and thats why people use the word “ugly” but really it is “incorrect” and thats a fact, not an objective ideal, no, because there is a standard set and so we cannot willy nilly decide what is and isnt correct. Fact is, against the standard he falls far below in terms of conformation. Therefore he HAD to go and be as successful as he was for this thread to even exist.

If there was no standard, there would not BE the effective breeding programs that PRODUCE horses like him.

If everyone chose conformation based off of their own experience or successful show pony we’d be in a heck of a lot of trouble because a horse that toes in can still do grand prix :wink:

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