Barisone assessment

[BrendaJane]

@Knights_Mom

I would use the term “paramour”.

I have a different term, but it keeps getting flagged and edited…

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

@Seeker1

The rescuers were desperately trying to save lk life. They had no time to video anything. Again…all of the medical issues were reported and submitted as cold hard facts.

I don’t dispute ANY of that.

Emergency personnel clearly focused and did their jobs well. Her injuries were VERY serious.

It’s just interesting that those cameras were shut off 15 minutes before the shooting happened.

You must be INCREDIBLY frustrated by that fact… right? I mean, if only RG hadn’t turned those cameras off, the whole situation would have been caught on video. And if it happened the way LK said it did, MB would be in jail for life right now.

Re bolded. I don’t understand this statement at all. Suppose the cameras were turned on and had the correct angle to capture the shooting.

Let’s say everything happened the way the prosecutor contended that it did. (Did LK say that it happened in a way significantly different?)

But let’s say the video shows MB pulling out the gun while talking to LK, shoots her twice in the chest, then takes a third shot in RGs direction. If the video shows a shot sort of in RGs direction, but it could be interpreted as a wild, uncontrolled shot, the jury might still go with straight NG on RG. But if it happened exactly as LK said with two shots by MB into her torso and no “scuffle” between RG and MB prior to LK being shot, then it’s clear the prosecution has established its case with respect to LK on all elements aside for state of mind.

Even if the physical events on the shooting wrt LK were crystal clear via a video, the jury would then move on to considering whether MB was legally insane, or not, when he fired the shots. The testimony of the psychiatric experts is the same, and the defense prevails so he is found NGRI on one count of attempted murder (plus gun charge). Even if the jury found that the video established that he did directly shoot at RG’s head, in that case the verdict is 4 counts of NGRI.

MB would not “be in jail for life right now”, he would be in the exact same psychiatric facility right now, with the exact same prospects for release.

How would a video showing exactly what LK/the prosecutor contended about the physical event make any difference at all to where MB currently is, or will be in the future?

[Fiesta01]

Thanks! Not a country western listener, but I love me some Patsy Cline.

[eggbutt]

Okay, I’ll address the elephant in the room and ask the question, when will Lauren Kanarek, Rob Godwin, and potentially others, be held accountable for their actions for many, many years?
Will any of them face criminal charges or has the justice system in the Livingston area decided to wash their hands of all the wrong doing and be done with them hoping they never return? Will the civil trials be used to hold them accountable? But RG isn’t named in the civil complaints is he? So he just goes his merry way with zero responsibility? Would any USEF/SS decision take all their terrorism and bullying into account? Seriously, who will hold the Kanarek gang accountable for all they have done to others?

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@eggbutt

Yes and RG himself testified that MB was calm, rational and pleasant when he arrived at his farmhouse, apparently until a dog and large man and skinny woman with a cell phone attacked him.

How would RG know from looking at MB for one minute that MB was “rational”? Perhaps he said that MB appeared calm, and rational?

There is no evidence that RG, LK, and the dog attacked MB before he started shooting.

[MorganSercu]

Lauren did state she was flown to the hospital. In December 2019 (That’s A Twist). Plenty of time to walk it back before the trial.

[eggbutt]

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

• he was found NGI, and that is why he is currently in the custody of the state mental health system.

Come on now @Virginia_Horse_Mom, get it right! He’s in a *maximum security state mental health security! <s

[BrendaJane]

Karma is a old female dog.

FWIW, Florida is a ‘stand your ground’ state…
one day her aim will be off taking pot shots at her ‘paramour’ or he will turn on her the way she has turned on everybody in her circle.

It won’t end pretty, I bet.
Will they see the inside of a courtroom as defendants? /shrug.

I don’t see how the other side of the family, the daughters whio turned out ‘alright’ will endure…they luckily took the names of their spouses. The world is a lot smaller than we think. I can’t see that this episode will be passing the clan by unscathed.

[jvanrens]

@hut-ho78

oo much information about where she lives and where MHG lives has already been posted. Please don’t encourage anyone to post it again. If y’all are wrong and MB is still a danger to himself or others and is fooling everyone, I wouldn’t want to be either of those two. May they be safe and successful and may he recover and rebuild his life.

I don’t recall any mention about where MHG lives, just the general neighbourhood she’s riding in. Why on earth would you think MHG would be in any danger from him? She celebrated the jury decision on facebook, so I don’t think she holds any hatred for MB, or fear. LK was the one that did what she could to drive him insane, and testified to it in court.

[eggbutt]

Sort of like Finish the Bastard?

[LilRanger]

@CurrentlyHorseless

But let’s say the video shows MB pulling out the gun while talking to LK, shoots her twice in the chest, then takes a third shot in RGs direction. If the video shows a shot sort of in RGs direction, but it could be interpreted as a wild, uncontrolled shot, the jury might still go with straight NG on RG. But if it happened exactly as LK said with two shots by MB into her torso and no “scuffle” between RG and MB prior to LK being shot, then it’s clear the prosecution has established its case with respect to LK on all elements aside for state of mind.

I think a video could absolutely go toward illuminating the defendant’s state of mind, even without sound. This, of course, depends a lot on angles, but body language and the reaction of others could reinforce or contradict the defendant’s claims of insanity. So IMHO, yes, it could have made a big difference in the outcome of the case.

[Fiesta01]

@DownYonder

(And sorry to everyone else on this thread for the sidebar.)

I don’t think any of us on this forum would ever object to an expression of grief for a dearly loved horse, no matter the topic of the thread.

[MHM]

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

Also… hasn’t it been a while since LK has shown any horse? The whole issue might be a non issue in the long run…

Her most recent USEF competition records are from August of 2020.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@jvanrens

@hut-ho78

oo much information about where she lives and where MHG lives has already been posted. Please don’t encourage anyone to post it again. If y’all are wrong and MB is still a danger to himself or others and is fooling everyone, I wouldn’t want to be either of those two. May they be safe and successful and may he recover and rebuild his life.

I don’t recall any mention about where MHG lives, just the general neighbourhood she’s riding in. Why on earth would you think MHG would be in any danger from him? She celebrated the jury decision on facebook, so I don’t think she holds any hatred for MB, or fear. LK was the one that did what she could to drive him insane, and testified to it in court.

The danger to anyone, MHG, LK, anyone, would arise if he wasn’t fully recovered from the delusions.

[eggbutt]

@Ghazzu

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

The whole issue might be a non issue in the long run…

I expect it might be possible to arrange ride times in such a way as to eliminate the necessity of contact.

Well, If MB is competing I would expect he would be in the CDI/FEI classes. I can’t imagine LK is at that level yet IF she is showing at all. Obviously we are putting the cart before the horse. MB still must be cleared by SS/USEF.

[MHM]

@FitzE

Would there be a first in time/first in right approach with respect to the two FL dwellings? I.e., MB bought his years ago whereas JK bought knowing full well where MB’s home was. If there were issues involved with that proximity, would the first party who bought in the area get to stay put and the party who bought much later with full knowledge of how close they were would need to accommodate?

I don’t know the exact location of their respective properties, but there are two Publix stores in Loxahatchee that are just a couple of miles apart. Maybe they could come to an agreement that each person would only go to one of the two Publix stores.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@LilRanger

@CurrentlyHorseless

But let’s say the video shows MB pulling out the gun while talking to LK, shoots her twice in the chest, then takes a third shot in RGs direction. If the video shows a shot sort of in RGs direction, but it could be interpreted as a wild, uncontrolled shot, the jury might still go with straight NG on RG. But if it happened exactly as LK said with two shots by MB into her torso and no “scuffle” between RG and MB prior to LK being shot, then it’s clear the prosecution has established its case with respect to LK on all elements aside for state of mind.

I think a video could absolutely go toward illuminating the defendant’s state of mind, even without sound. This, of course, depends a lot on angles, but body language and the reaction of others could reinforce or contradict the defendant’s claims of insanity. So IMHO, yes, it could have made a big difference in the outcome of the case.

Really? A video showing him calmly approaching a petite woman, chatting briefly with her and then pulling out a gun and shooting her twice in the chest would somehow establish that the man doing that was sane and rational? And override the conclusions of the experts who evaluated him clinically?

That literally never occurred to me. I think if I saw an actual video of it, it would underscore the utter insanity of such a thing.

I think it would be useful wrt to whether he did or didn’t aim for RGs head, but even there, the implications of 4 counts of NGRI is the same as for 2 counts of NGRI.

[MHM]

Was there a shift change? I must have missed the whistle.

[BrendaJane]

@MHM

@FitzE

Would there be a first in time/first in right approach with respect to the two FL dwellings? I.e., MB bought his years ago whereas JK bought knowing full well where MB’s home was. If there were issues involved with that proximity, would the first party who bought in the area get to stay put and the party who bought much later with full knowledge of how close they were would need to accommodate?

I don’t know the exact location of their respective properties, but there are two Publix stores in Loxahatchee that are just a couple of miles apart. Maybe they could come to an agreement that each person would only go to one of the two Publix stores.

LOL, agree?
If I were a certain trainer I’d pay somebody - anybody - to pick up my groceries and fill up my truck.
I would expect the certain ‘agreement’ to be used by a certain other party to be abused and used for mischief.

Just sayin’…

[jvanrens]

Again, why do you mention MHG? Why would you think she’s in danger? Again, she celebrated the jury’s decision on Facebook? If she was fearing for her life, do you think she would do that? Honestly…