Barisone Case on 48 Hours, 10:00 PM Eastern, Saturday, 9/17

[CurrentlyHorseless]

I think LK is a flawed human being. I also think MB, MHG, and most people, including me, are flawed human beings.

I do not believe, at this point, the accusations that Lauren’s parents contributed to creating the situation or that they have done anything other than try to resolve the situation without violence and stand up for their daughter against the SM hate.

People keep casting me in the role of “defending” LK, but that’s not really my position. I’m discussing my take on the facts of the case, and also expressing my position that I find pummeling and mocking someone on SM, even a flawed human being like LK, is just as nasty and harmful as anything she has done.

Eggbutt keeps accusing me of trying to “control the narrative”. Well, if as one of two minority posters I could control the narrative, that would be mighty impressive.

I suspect that what Eggbutt is really saying, in a roundabout way, is that she wants to be the one to control the narrative. What I don’t understand is what she thinks she is accomplishing by controlling the narrative.

Eggbutt “controlling the narrative” didn’t affect the outcome of the criminal trial, I don’t think it affected the 48 hours coverage, and I don’t think it will affect the outcome of the civil trial.

So what is the purpose? To blackball LK from all trainers and barns? Is it the “pleasure of hate” phenomenon?

[BatCoach]

@CurrentlyHorseless

That’s why they have such a thing about the last couple of holdouts. So frustrating!

But you wear that martyr badge well don’t you? Such a strong holdout of truth you are (s/)! Your world is truly myopic if this is the biggest hill in your life to metaphorically ‘die on.’

If you cared to take in information from other sources (general public) you would see that miraculously, this “CoTH narrative” you like to carry on about is believed by many, dare I say the majority of other people. Why is that I wonder?

I’m not sure why CoTH is your selected social media to turn into your personal battle ground but hey - have fun putting yourself in an imaginary line of fire seen only by you. If it frustrates you so greatly, maybe take a day off?

[trubandloki]

@BatCoach

But you wear that martyr badge well don’t you?

Laugh, when I read that post this was my exact thought. Well, it was actually - Oh my, someone who wears the martyr badge even more so than my mother does. Who knew that was possible.

[erinmeri]

I cannot believe we are still having conversations about what the verdict means. MULTIPLE attorneys have explained this, but again, in layman’s terms:

1. We cannot know what the jury’s reasoning was in reaching the verdict. They could have thought “yep he did it, but she drove him to break”, but they also could have thought myriad other things like “likely self-defense, but that’s off the table, so…” OR they could have been on the cusp of hanging, so they thought “we are split between NG and Guilty - since the majority of experts agree he was insane, can we compromise on that?” and that satisfied them all enough to reach a verdict. So many crazy things happen in deliberations (I know, from having served on a jury for a shooting).

2. While under the law, the verdict may imply that the facts were proven beyond a reasonable doubt, jurors ARE ALLOWED TO DECIDE IN OPPOSITION TO THE LAW. They can, for example, find someone straight NOT GUILTY even if the evidence shows they clearly are guilty (Jury Nullification), and they cannot be penalized for it.

So no, we don’t know that the jury believed the state made their case beyond a reasonable doubt that MB shot her. I personally would not have been able to say that if I was on the jury since I have reasonable doubts.

ETA: when Bilinkas was asked what the verdict means, he said something to the effect of “He cannot be held responsible for his actions.” He did NOT say it meant MB shot her.

[trubandloki]

It is interesting that wanting to protect others from evil can be twisted into something bad by some people.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Scribbler

Does anyone appreciate the irony? Or maybe it’s just stupidity?

National TV broadcasts a whole episode on you basically saying that you precipitated a disastrous chain of events by being an out of control bsc online mean mouthed harasser, threatener, etc. That’s the major narrative and virtually all the viewers find it credible.

So in your defense, you go online and demonstrate this exact same behavior against a professional journalist and multiple random members of the public who commented on the TV show. You just say whatever ugly thing pops into your head and threaten defamation suits randomly.

In other words, you go overboard to demonstrate the exact same behavior that almost everyone (outside your family and a few random trolls or bots) agrees was the root cause of the events.

I hope everyone on the FB threads is clear that they are being addressed directly by LK using RGs account. In terms of True Crime drama, being lambasted in bsc fashion by one of the main players is high drama indeed, and I think likely unprecedented.

Anyhow LK simply can’t stop showing the world who she really is. I honestly thought the radio silence for about forty eight hours before and after the 48 Hours broadcast showed that LK or at least her legal team had finally understood that her online habits were going to tell against her. I was a little surprised anyone was showing common sense this late in the game, and actually thought maybe we’d heard the last from LK for a while.

But no. This case is the one that keeps on giving. I’m glad folks are tracking and screen shotting since I’m sure her minders will make some of this evaporate in the clear light of day.

Gee, I guess I did read a different transcript.

The summary provided by CBS in the promo was addressing threatening SM behavior: if someone posts inflammatory posts about you, can you then shoot them and claim temporary insanity, as Barisone did?

Not without ending up involuntarily committed to a psychiatric hospital.

I thought the episode was excellent. It did not gloss over or excuse her inflammatory SM posts nor did it pretend he didn’t shoot her, or that he was justified in shooting her. Very, very different from “the narrative” presented here.

[Bogey2]

@CurrentlyHorseless

I think LK is a flawed human being. I also think MB, MHG, and most people, including me, are flawed human beings.

Your obsession with MHG is almost as bad as LK’s. Why is that?

[Djones]

is the episode on Youtube now?

[Maria]

When I looked yesterday there were 4 new donations after the 48 hours episode.

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

@Bogey2

@CurrentlyHorseless

I think LK is a flawed human being. I also think MB, MHG, and most people, including me, are flawed human beings.

Your obsession with MHG is almost as bad as LK’s. Why is that?

Details. They give away the game.

[lazaret]

It has no bearing except that anything collected and not shown is within the reach of discovery.

May possibly influence a jury, may appear in voir dire as to whether or not a potential viewer has viewed material about the case.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@erinmeri

I cannot believe we are still having conversations about what the verdict means. MULTIPLE attorneys have explained this, but again, in layman’s terms:

1. We cannot know what the jury’s reasoning was in reaching the verdict. They could have thought “yep he did it, but she drove him to break”, but they also could have thought myriad other things like “likely self-defense, but that’s off the table, so…” OR they could have been on the cusp of hanging, so they thought “we are split between NG and Guilty - since the majority of experts agree he was insane, can we compromise on that?” and that satisfied them all enough to reach a verdict. So many crazy things happen in deliberations (I know, from having served on a jury for a shooting).

2. While under the law, the verdict may imply that the facts were proven beyond a reasonable doubt, jurors ARE ALLOWED TO DECIDE IN OPPOSITION TO THE LAW. They can, for example, find someone straight NOT GUILTY even if the evidence shows they clearly are guilty (Jury Nullification), and they cannot be penalized for it.

So no, we don’t know that the jury believed the state made their case beyond a reasonable doubt that MB shot her. I personally would not have been able to say that if I was on the jury since I have reasonable doubts.

ETA: when Bilinkas was asked what the verdict means, he said something to the effect of “He cannot be held responsible for his actions.” He did NOT say it meant MB shot her.

Ekat has not contradicted my interpretation of the verdict. Her latest pronouncement was that she was not convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that MB shot LK. So what? Ekat was not on the jury.

She then continued on to say that ‘even if that’s what the verdict meant (that the jury determined that he shot her), it was irrelevant because the jury in the civil case would start over from scratch.

Of course Bilinkas is not going to fill in the details of the “conduct” for which Barisone was not held responsible. You don’t want to hear it, he doesn’t want to say it.

[smoofox]

Struggling to catch up here in-between barn things as I savor my coffee and wait for the farrier…

@Joanne

The syntax is familiar.

The sheer stupidity of posting something like that when your civil case is upcoming… is mind-blowing. The complete cluelessness - or maybe it is a sense of power that no one can touch you - is just sad.

@CurrentlyHorseless

@BigMama1

@CurrentlyHorseless

I thought the 48 hours episode was a very neutral, balanced take of the situation. It was very, very different from the picture painted in these threads on COTH.

Did you watch the right show? Because if you watched the same 48 hours the rest of us did, you saw Lauren lie yet again, you were reminded of her plan to ruin Michael, you heard straight from her father’s mouth she decided to destroy a man simply because she didn’t feel she was getting enough attention, you saw written proof she claimed Michael was abusing and / or sexually abusing children, you watched her come across as the narcissistic nightmare who created this whole situation herself.

Maybe you should watch again. Don’t forget your glasses this time.

No, I didn’t watch it. I read the transcript.

I thought it was an excellent, neutral overview of the feud and the shooting.

Big difference there. Huuge. When you just read the transcript, you put your own inflections and tone on things. When you watch people on camera saying their own words, there is a different tone, meaning and intent. Add in expressions, body language etc. - and it is obvious that simply reading the transcript is not an indicator of anything other than the words that were said.

If transcripts were all that was needed, there would be no need for trials… or to put anyone on the witness stand…

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

Fantastic post.

Honestly, COTH really is a quite civilized forum and well moderated. Compare comments here to even just Twitter and Facebook. There are much more nasty comments about LK on those platforms in response to the 48 hours video. And even though many of those comments are nasty (a lot of people talking about how she deserved what she got)… and not something I would personally post… the comments don’t violate certain rules.

People need to get some perspective

Well said. This forum is TAME - despite all the sneering insults to the contrary. The nastiest comments on any of the Barisone threads here came from LaLa herself… some were so bad that the entire thread got nuked. YankeeDuchess would then often proclaim that poor LK was being persecuted in the midst of a barrage of LK posts that were beyond vile and crazy. LK does not need any reason to go off on a tirade… no need to poke at that bear… she offers up her wisdom for free.

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Warmblood1

If you have such a problem with people posting opinions that differ from yours and even consider it “harassment” or “bullying,” you must really have a problem with LK’s behavior then. Oh, wait.

No. I’ve pointed out the hypocrisy of behavior of the mob mirroring so closely the SM behavior of the person they love to hate.

Oh good Lord… the “mob” you sneer at would have to work for months to cobble together enough frenzied vitriol, lies, threats and nastiness to even come close to “mirroring” the SM behavior of LK. And I do not hate her. I feel very sorry for such a troubled person who inflicts her wrath on others and revels in it… and was doing that long before the tragic events of August 2019.

@trubandloki

Is this as factual as everything else you have said?
Because you are wrong. At least in this thread.

And the other current thread.

Aw geez. Apparently I have not been elderly mobbing enough. Must. Up. My. Game.
Only… horses. Farriers. Vets. Clients. Assorted other inconveniences of a 24/7 horse job…

[lazaret]

@CurrentlyHorseless

If someone posts inflammatory posts about you, can you then shoot them and claim temporary insanity, as Barisone did?

Nope.

The actual summary text is “Did social media posts drive an Olympic horseman to shoot his own student?”

There is a significant difference between what you’ve stated and what was actually said.

[erinmeri]

@CurrentlyHorseless

I thought the episode was excellent. It did not gloss over or excuse her inflammatory SM posts nor did it pretend he didn’t shoot her, or that he was justified in shooting her. Very, very different from “the narrative” presented here.

1. you didn’t watch it!
2. the show explicitly said “what happened next is unclear” - and did NOT say definitively that he shot her.

[ekat]

@erinmeri

the show explicitly said “what happened next is unclear” - and did NOT say definitively that he shot her.

Easy to see how you could accidentally scroll past this sentence.

[Sdel]

@lazaret

There is a significant difference between what you’ve stated and what was actually said.

As usual….

[Scribbler]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Scribbler

Does anyone appreciate the irony? Or maybe it’s just stupidity?

National TV broadcasts a whole episode on you basically saying that you precipitated a disastrous chain of events by being an out of control bsc online mean mouthed harasser, threatener, etc. That’s the major narrative and virtually all the viewers find it credible.

So in your defense, you go online and demonstrate this exact same behavior against a professional journalist and multiple random members of the public who commented on the TV show. You just say whatever ugly thing pops into your head and threaten defamation suits randomly.

In other words, you go overboard to demonstrate the exact same behavior that almost everyone (outside your family and a few random trolls or bots) agrees was the root cause of the events.

I hope everyone on the FB threads is clear that they are being addressed directly by LK using RGs account. In terms of True Crime drama, being lambasted in bsc fashion by one of the main players is high drama indeed, and I think likely unprecedented.

Anyhow LK simply can’t stop showing the world who she really is. I honestly thought the radio silence for about forty eight hours before and after the 48 Hours broadcast showed that LK or at least her legal team had finally understood that her online habits were going to tell against her. I was a little surprised anyone was showing common sense this late in the game, and actually thought maybe we’d heard the last from LK for a while.

But no. This case is the one that keeps on giving. I’m glad folks are tracking and screen shotting since I’m sure her minders will make some of this evaporate in the clear light of day.

Gee, I guess I did read a different transcript.

The summary provided by CBS in the promo was addressing threatening SM behavior: if someone posts inflammatory posts about you, can you then shoot them and claim temporary insanity, as Barisone did?

Not without ending up involuntarily committed to a psychiatric hospital.

I thought the episode was excellent. It did not gloss over or excuse her inflammatory SM posts nor did it pretend he didn’t shoot her, or that he was justified in shooting her. Very, very different from “the narrative” presented here.

This response misses my point.

Virtually everyone in the various FB comment threads walked away from the 48 Hours documentary (as well as viewers of the trial on YT) with the impression that LK was an out of control harasser both online and IRL. And many said so in the comments.

To rebut this impression, LK (using RGs account) engages in even more of the same behavior, directed at a professional journalist as well as random posters on FB. Her comments on NJ were definitely unhinged. That’s not how you positively influence your image with the media.

In other words, she continues to show the world who she is. And is at this point her own worst enemy. Her parents follow a close second because of the evidence we now have that they actively participated in the campaign of harassment of MB, as well as lying and threatening on SM.

[ekat]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Ekat has not contradicted my interpretation of the verdict. Her latest pronouncement was that she was not convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that MB shot LK. So what? Ekat was not on the jury.

I am not sure why you are bringing me into this conversation but, here’s what I’ve said about the verdict:

You are free to interpret the verdict however you want, as you like to remind us repeatedly. And no, I wasn’t on the jury, which is why I said the following:

@CurrentlyHorseless

She then continued on to say that ‘even if that’s what the verdict meant (that the jury determined that he shot her), it was irrelevant because the jury in the civil case would start over from scratch

Correct! YES, the Criminal Verdict has less than zero meaning on the ongoing civil trial. All of it starts over from the beginning.

Now, can we move on, much like the cases are?

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Bogey2

@CurrentlyHorseless

I think LK is a flawed human being. I also think MB, MHG, and most people, including me, are flawed human beings.

Your obsession with MHG is almost as bad as LK’s. Why is that?

It’s telling that you call me obsessed with MHG when I occasionally mention her.

As the 48 hours episode stated very clearly, at the heart of the situation was the animosity between two women, with MB in the middle. Not a romantic triangle, but a triangle with MB and two women.

And if I mention the third player other than MB and LK I’m “obsessed”?

One of the recent court filings has quoted from a recorded conversation between MB and MHG. According to the legal filing, MHG says, twice, “I’m going to effing kill her.”

In this short snippet, it is MHG, not MB, pushing to get a lifetime ban for LK. The proposed plan is not just that MB and MHG gild their own complaints, but that MHG wants to coordinate complaints coming in from “everyone here” plus others on her “list”.

From the tiny snippet of the recordings that I’ve seen it was MHG that wanted LK gone, and she was exerting pressure on a man with an unstable mind to get rid of her.