Barisone Trial Starting Monday, 3/28

[MHM]

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

But this situation was spiraling so wildly. LK was not your average bear. Nor was RG. And MB was a fragile man who was unraveling.

While I think that’s absolutely true, it may not have been that obvious to the casual eye.

All three of them may have been able to look somewhat “normal” for a short period while they interacted with the police, even if they were far from normal under the surface.

Also, if the police had not dealt with MB much in the past, it may have been much less obvious to them how altered he was from his usual behavior.

Unlike someone like the health department witness or the hay guy, who had interacted with him for years, and thus were much more able to recognize the dramatic change in him.

And as someone said upthread, MB on a bad day in late July of 2019 might not have looked that different from a lot of the people the police saw all the time.

[cheval_convert]

Yes to all of this. Much to my family’s chagrin, I learned to set boundaries that protected me. I also learned to walk away from the drama of one family member. I miss her but I am much healthier for it.

[Angela_Freda]

@agequodagis

It seemed to me Prosecution was trying to be a Psych expert when he clearly had no clue. But why no objections to leading the witness and basically testifying? It didn’t seem proper compared to how strict they are with the defense. More appropriate to have a rebuttal expert

I want him to respond “was that a question?”

[Einhorn]

That’s not good for the state.

[Scribbler]

Ah I was taking getting older to mean growing up! Yes sometimes things get more obvious in middle age, as less youthful flair to cover it all up. It’s not fun dealing with at any age.

[Einhorn]

Also the police are used to seeing angry people. Or at least upset people

[MHM]

@eggbutt

Really! Approximately 5 years ago. The woman involved is a friend. She actually said once she backed him down, they became somewhat friendly.

That actually sounds a bit reminiscent of a poster here on the BB.

[supernatural]

Mostly men

[eggbutt]

Nope, they don’t use any social media.

[Scribbler]

@MHM

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

But this situation was spiraling so wildly. LK was not your average bear. Nor was RG. And MB was a fragile man who was unraveling.

While I think that’s absolutely true, it may not have been that obvious to the casual eye.

All three of them may have been able to look somewhat “normal” for a short period while they interacted with the police, even if they were far from normal under the surface.

Also, if the police had not dealt with MB much in the past, it may have been much less obvious to them how altered he was from his usual behavior.

Unlike someone like the health department witness or the hay guy, who had interacted with him for years, and thus were much more able to recognize the dramatic change in him.

And as someone said upthread, MB on a bad day in late July of 2019 might not have looked that different from a lot of the people the police saw all the time.

Also BPD drug addict grifters have a lot of experience lying to authority and putting on a good face. It doesn’t hold up to real scrutiny like here in court but it can be used in passing to deflect consequences.

One of the complications is that when Cluster B personalities really go into overdrivr the things they say and do are being belief for the average bystander so if you try to tell about it people think you are exaggerating or malicious. And the Cluster B types can be good at targetting their harassment so it’s not visible to others

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

@cheval_convert

Yes to all of this. Much to my family’s chagrin, I learned to set boundaries that protected me. I also learned to walk away from the drama of one family member. I miss her but I am much healthier for it.

I too have learned to set boundaries… and boy oh boy did THAT provoke some narcissistic rage. And gaslighting. And repeated attempts to involve third parties and get them to “assist” the disordered person in reestablishing contact.

Getting healthy and choosing your own well being can be a REALLY hard, long process. I have almost zero contact with about half of my family of origin. It’s definitely healthier and better for me. But it’s still something that I have a tough time with, and carry sadness and anxiety about.

It’s really hard to learn to maintain healthy boundaries in relationships as an adult, if you were raised by people who are profoundly manipulative and crushed all your boundaries. For me, I’ve learned to keep my social circle small, and walk away from situations involving volatile and manipulative people. Life is too short, and I worked too hard to have a peaceful and good circle around me to let crazy and manipulative people de-stabilize it.

[MHM]

@Angela_Freda

@hut-ho78

I don’t think MB would have been easy for RG hold down.

After a chokehold he might be

Especially since RG said under oath on the witness stand that he rendered MB unconscious.

MB was probably not too hard to hold down when he was unconscious. Just a guess.

[MHM]

@Virginia_Horse_Mom

@Einhorn

Usually just one, or juries would revolt. And judges too

Interesting. So they will likely pull in one expert witness to rebutt the psych related testimony of BOTH of the experts who testified today?

I hope they only call in one!!

[MHM]

I believe it was 13 men and 3 women for a total of 16. And then they pick 12 when it is time to actually deliberate.

I’m not sure exactly how that is done, but statistically, it sounds like a pretty good chance of an all male jury, or at least a mostly male jury.

[BrendaJane]

@hut-ho78

A little more kindness instead of back and forth could solve a lot of problems.

from whom?
Miss "Finish the Bastard’ ?
Oh…I know, from the guy who is at his wit’s end…

[DownYonder]

@MHM

All three of them may have been able to look somewhat “normal” for a short period while they interacted with the police, even if they were far from normal under the surface.

FWIW, it is absolutely diabolical how “rational” and “sane” and “normal” someone with certain mental health issues can be, especially when dealing with “the authorities.” I have personal experience with someone who totally charmed “authorities” and had them convinced that she was a “pillar of society.” The person was calm, composed, super polite and courteous and respectful toward them and others when in the presence of said authorities. But when not in their presence - OMG, the viciousness and vindictiveness came out full force. She was a master manipulator and authorities had no clue this person had a “dark side” until she (years later) had a full-blown schizophrenic episode.

[OneBellBoot]

I can’t seem to quote on my phone but re: cross of Dr Hasson and the questions being a little aggravating/silly, I agree! Not uncommon for cross though, in my experience. I have, on rare occasion, chuckled at a question on cross. Mostly because it was that or get irritated and I figured the former is a better response, haha.

It sounds like you’re a psychologist as well! I didn’t think I’d ever end up doing forensic work either, but I’ve grown to really enjoy it. Even silly questions on cross.

[MHM]

@Scribbler

Also BPD drug addict grifters have a lot of experience lying to authority and putting on a good face. It doesn’t hold up to real scrutiny like here in court but it can be used in passing to deflect consequences.

One of the complications is that when Cluster B personalities really go into overdrivr the things they say and do are being belief for the average bystander so if you try to tell about it people think you are exaggerating or malicious. And the Cluster B types can be good at targetting their harassment so it’s not visible to others

That really sounds like a pretty accurate description of this whole situation.

Especially the last sentence above, regarding the story about RG holding his hand next to his head in the shape of a gun when everybody else’s back was turned except MB.

[hut-ho78]

@BrendaJane

@hut-ho78

A little more kindness instead of back and forth could solve a lot of problems.

from whom?
Miss "Finish the Bastard’ ?
Oh…I know, from the guy who is at his wit’s end…

Oh, you know, to stop escalating hostility in social media posts.

[MHM]

@OneBellBoot

I can’t seem to quote on my phone but re: cross of Dr Hasson and the questions being a little aggravating/silly, I agree! Not uncommon for cross though, in my experience. I have, on rare occasion, chuckled at a question on cross. Mostly because it was that or get irritated and I figured the former is a better response, haha.

So was the doctor’s response pretty normal for the situation? At one point, it looked to me like he was getting a little huffy, but I have never watched one of these before in its entirety.

Originally he was reminding me a little bit of Carl from Up, but not so much on the cross examination.