I agree with you 100%. This situation seems destined to go south and expectations on both sides don’t meet reality. And yes, I have ever encountered this situation, so I don’t know what is common. I do know this sounds like a mess.
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It does sound like a mess. Hopefully it will turn out ok in the end, for the horse.
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I’m not sure there’s a valid argument here for how the horse is benefiting from this arrangement, as it doesn’t sound like there’s any sort of fitness to be gained from the type of lessons given. Perhaps mentally, as he’s at least getting out of his small pen on a weekly basis.
But the BO is definitely benefiting financially by using the horse, so compensation is due to the owner.
And I say that as someone who is carrying 100% the cost of two horses that don’t belong to me, in exchange for using these saints in my lesson program.
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As I’ve said before, when my friend wants a tune up on her horse, she pays the BO for that tune up. When she wants a lesson (and they do walk/trail rides/liberty), she pays the lesson. Her kid is a lot more handy and exercises the horse at faster gaits, but this is a 20-something year old gelding who has retired from the ring a few years ago due to injury. The horse IS in fact semi-retired and enjoys farting in the field and rolling about.
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BrendJean, if we are talking about assumptions, my friend is following this thread and reading everything. She just didn’t want to post herself as she didn’t want BO to find her. She’s not complaining about board. She’s paid all the boarding increases as they’ve come up. She doesn’t recieve a discount in board/cash/something/anything/ in exchange for use of her horse in paid clinics. And yes, it’s a separate issue. I’ll say it again, and again, HO pays BO for training rides on her horse as needed, and pays for lessons. She doesn’t expect these things for free.
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Yes. It is not going to hurt the horse to pack a kid around for 45 minutes once a month.
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This attack of the horse owner is ridiculous. The BO can RAISE THEIR BOARD. Not guilt trip owners into using the horses for multi hour multi day lessons.
The fact that prices are going up and it’s difficult being a barn owner doesn’t make it ok to profit off a horse without consent.
Set the board rate for what it needs to be, then set another contract with the owner for use of their horse. Other boarders seem to be paying the same rate and their horses aren’t being used. Nobody thinks the BO should eat the cost, everybody expects that there needs to be a contract.
Completely agree that you are going after the owner, this idea that BO can just freely use their boarder’s horses because owning a barn is hard is ridiculous.
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Now having a different opinion is labelled gas lighting. Interesting.
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"Hi, my name is Jane. I have a really busy life so I board my semi retired horse Harvey. I usually make it out to ride him a few times a month and he seems fine and is well cared for.
However, my barn owner says I’m being abusive and that he’s not fit enough for my occasional rides so she’s going to use him in multiple hour long lessons multiple times a week but she refuses to discount my board because she says she’s doing me a favor and owning a barn is hard."
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There is 100% not a hot chance in hell that I would allow anyone to use my horse without something in writing. If my horse was injured during use by someone else, I would need to understand how that will get handled at a BARE minimum.
OP you mention several times that your friend is worried about ruffling feathers or something along those lines. Why does she feel she will get asked to leave? Is that her own insecurities? If so, she needs to set that aside. If the BO would just kick her out because she won’t let BO use her horse…not a barn I’d want to be at. Just food for thought. Encourage her to not give a hoot about that! Horse owners HAVE to advocate for their horses. PERIOD. And your example is a prime reason why. It is very easy to get walked over as in this case. I get that conversations can get awkward but that’s part of the reality of this life. She needs to muster up some gumption and have a conversation about what she feels is needed in this situation. If the BO kicks her out, that is awfully telling.
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I am not attacking the horse owner.
I am if anything having issue with the OP (by all means an uninvolved third party) assuming she is [rivy to details she likely has no actual knowledge of.
Like the financial situation of the barn owner.
The barn rate is the barn rate, the use of the horse is an independent matter which the horse owner has to address with the BO.
As I can see it, the HO might have to move the horse or put him down, and that will have shown the greedy barn owner?
The economics are tough right now, not just for the OP’s friend.
It boils down to this: the horse owner needs to address the situation.
I mean, the BO could charge for the services of pulling the horse out of the stall and such, while the HO asks for compensation for the use in the clinics. It evens the bill out IMO.
Me thinks the OP has put the bug in HO’s ear and came here to get validated.
It just is irritating that she seems to believe the BO has to eat the cost of rising prices, so the horse owner can save money.
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I would love to hear the BO’s side of the story.
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I’m not sure I can understand how you’re looking at this. How much money the barn owner is or isn’t making is irrelevant to me as a customer.
If the barn owner is using the horse, that’s different from simply boarding the horse. I’ve been at barns where certain horses boarded there are used for lessons, and the owner is given a credit on board for each lesson. That’s pretty standard. Otherwise, shouldn’t I pay more for board then the person whose horse is being used for 4 lessons a week at $60 a lesson, since my horse only participated in my own lessons?
Now, whether or not things even out in the end is something to be debated. I think earlier the OP said that the barn owner holds the horse for the farrier. When I was boarding somewhere that I knew the discount, I think it was $5 for a 45 minute lesson. Holding for the farrier was $10. Most horses see the farrier every 6 weeks or so. If this horse is being used in multi-hour clinics, my guess is that the horse owner would come out ahead getting a discount for the barn owner use of the horse.
Costs are going up, and I agree that it’s reasonable for the cost of board to go up. It would also be reasonable to add a surcharge to the cost of the lesson as a use fee for the horse.
It isn’t reasonable and is a bad business practice to use a boarder’s horse for lessons without reaching an agreement that everyone is happy with.
It isn’t the barn owner’s fault or responsibility, but I would think the barn owner will be far worse off if the horse ends up in a different home or euthanized. It’s going to be much cheaper to give the owner $100 off of board every month then it is to provide all of the care of a horse for a month.
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It is a topic of conversation because the OP brought it up as a reason why this situation is so unfair, that the barn owner is making tons of money.
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like I said, I’d like to hear the BO’s side of it.
regardless, instead of making a fist in her pocket, the horse owner needs to initiate a conversation.
the OP seems to believe that the retired old horse is irreplaceable for the BO and their program
I really think the OP, not the horse owner is the fly in the ointment.
I mean, WTF? Because the barn owner does all the work and ‘doesn’t even have staff’ - what does that have to do with the price of tea in China! From a business standpoint, they still have to calculate wages fror themselves!
It seems up until now the arrangement was just fine.
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Gaslighting isn’t “having a different opinion.” Gaslighting saying something is okay, normal, when it’s not. This isn’t normal or okay.
Here we have a barn owner using a boarder’s horse to bring in income, charging the boarder all of the normal fees for all other things (as she should), but not giving her a discount on her board or anything else. That is not normal or industry standard.
The fact that everyone insists that the owner is okay with this, even though according to the OP she is clearly not and just not speaking up because she’s afraid of being kicked out is bizarre.
This isn’t an issue of “different opinions” but of fairly compensating someone for use of their horse.
This thread has really been eye-opening and not in a good way.
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I would suggest that the barn owner raising only this person’s board if they can no longer use the horse for lessons to be a tad unethical.
I can’t even believe that was suggested.
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I must have missed where someone suggested that the barn owner raise board just for this horse.
But the BO IS making money off this horse in lessons. Someone else is paying for all the care and she gets to use it for free in her program.
It’s not relevant if she’s not charging enough board to begin with or if she’s upside down on her mortgage.
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LOL, now the BO is upside down on the mortgage?
it would not matter if the farm is paid up in full and the BO had a trust fund to draw from!
There is a huge resentment toward barn owners I feel. OMG, they are making money!!!
It boils down to the arrangement the horse owner has with the BO. Things change and the arrangement has to be revisited. Simple.
as many people have stated above, they had similar agreements with barn owners for usage of a horse.
It helps of course to spell out expectations one might have - literally, on paper - and have both parties agree/and sign.
In case the HO is reading: Talk with the BO.
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