You are not making any sense.
Just sayin’
Keep taking the smart pills!
ooh, good one…
:rolleyes:
Excuse me while I slink off with my tail between my legs after that ass whuppin’.
[QUOTE=NoDQhere;3355993]
Ambrey, after you have more experience under your belt perhaps you too will begin to see it.
A good judge of horses can indeed “see” much from a picture. Body shape, for instance has much to do with performance. Conformation determines how athletic a horse will be. These are things a breeder puts a lot of time into learning.
Now if your goal is to just enjoy a BIG horse and have fun, buy all means go for it. But, IMO expecting ANY horse to do a job they are not built to do, is NOT FAIR to the horse.[/QUOTE]
Well, I wasn’t going to comment on the person who said “Phyxius, I saw the pic of your horse. He is very cute. I could not say he has a lot of talent for dressage.” From looking at a picture of my horse that is not a confirmation shot and is not a “dressage” action shot. I posted a picture of him in a hunter class, which he won by the way and a picture where you couldn’t even see all of him, but he oddly enough is covered in first place ribbons from a dressage show. So, really I’m not sure how an assessment of his talent could be made from the pictures I posted. Just for kicks I went to your website and there are some stallion pictures you probably want to remove lest people decided from the picture that he’s not talented.
I’m still NOT hearing why it’s unfair to do dressage with a draft. Is it unfair to turn a OTTB into an event horse? Is it unfair to ask a WARMBLOOD to be an event horse? How 'bout another breeder who’s been on this thread saying drafts shouldn’t do dressage who has promoted a drafty cleveland bay stallion a sire for dressage horses?
I really think this is an agree to disagree subject. The people on opposite sides of this issue are NEVER going to see eye to eye. And, I’ll come right out and say to ANYONE who thinks I’m being cruel or unfair to my horse to kiss my a**. I go to the field a different way when I’m riding than if I’m feeding or doing anything else and it’s the only time I have a halter in my hand. My horse KNOWS when it’s time to go for a ride and he always comes across the field to me as soon as he sees me coming. My horse loves his job and I resent every ignorant prima donna who thinks I’m being unfair to him.
And, I’m done with this discussion as it isn’t a discussion it’s a holier than thou mission that has now turned to name calling and personal bashing and I’m tired of the BS. I’ll keep riding and see you guys at the shows. Good luck!:winkgrin:
Why, yes, Equibrit, actually she does. Its part of her signature style. This is typical Ambr dogma, not at all uncommon for her.
And, I’ll come right out and say to ANYONE who thinks I’m being cruel or unfair to my horse to kiss my a**.
Wait, you have a donkey too?!
I’d love it to be an agree to disagree, live and live issue. Some people don’t want to let it be that, though, because the thought of us delusional draft owners thinking our horses can be dressage horses just gets their undies in a knot. And god forbid we encourage anyone else to try it!
As for my boy- if he tops out at second as so many have predicted, so be it 
Hopefully we’ll have a lot of fun along the way! Fortunately, to me self worth isn’t measured in dressage levels 
[QUOTE=Ambrey;3356804]
Wait, you have a donkey too?!
I’d love it to be an agree to disagree, live and live issue. Some people don’t want to let it be that, though, because the thought of us delusional draft owners thinking our horses can be dressage horses just gets their undies in a knot. And god forbid we encourage anyone else to try it!
As for my boy- if he tops out at second as so many have predicted, so be it Hopefully we’ll have a lot of fun along the way! Fortunately, to me self worth isn’t measured in dressage levels :D[/QUOTE]
I know I said I was done, but I lied. I had to tell you that yes, I do. I have TWO mini donkeys. We’ll be competing at PSG next year with the three year old. Okay, so I was being a smart ass about the last part. They’re two rescue donkeys who just eat and pester the mares.
Someone on a percheron board I post on mentioned a shirt someone made for them to wear when some people are a bit, uh snooty. It says “if your nose in the air you must be looking up to my draft”.:lol:
Confusing the likes of equibrit is my signature style? I thought it was my purple breeches.
You have no clue what my “dogma” is because you don’t have the reading comprehension to understand that about half the things you think I say bear no relation to what I’m actually talking about.
Yeah, that last sentence might take a while, take it slow and don’t sprain anything.
This is how I see this issue for the most part:
Professional trainers can take any breed horse with good conformation and develop that horse to the best ability of that horse.
Amateurs will take the same horse and develop that horse to the best ability of that rider.
Great trainers can do this with every physically healthy horse. Good trainers can do this with most horses that are already setup for the discipline making muscle memory work for them rather than against them. Mediocre trainers will not be able to succeed on any horse that isn’t already perfectly suited for the task. With that said: how many GREAT trainers does the average rider have access to:,…,…few and far between. how many GOOD trainers does the avergae rider have access to;…maybe 4-5 within their region or 200 mile radius IF they are lucky. How many MEDIOCRE trainers does the average rider have access to?..more than you can even imagine!
Professionals are in this sport to make a living…otherwise they would remain amateurs. If they are going to invest 5-6 years into a horse they want the odds in their favor the sale of this finished horse will bring them as big of a payout as possible. With a more established WB like the KWPN this may mean 6 out 10 horses will be a success story for them, with a AWS WB this may mean 2 out of 10. That is alot of money to risk over that time frame.
Amateurs on the other hand are in it for the love of the sport. An amateur will take the risk on the “2 out of 10” because they can.
Delusional.
Yes, they can do dressage! Pix to prove it…
Pictures of my big guy (will try this-if it doesnt work, will try again a different way.)
Training level, warming up. Is he perfect-no. Do we have things we are working on-yes. But does anyone posting on this think this horse is not capable/being harmed by doing dressage???
http://www.flickr.com/photos/28520136@N02/?saved=1
Edited to say Critique away!!
All this bickering brings to mind a fun and insightfull speech given by a well known Olympian and dressage trainer at a banquet I attended this year:
“When I went to Germany looking for my first Olympic mount I found him! Even though his back leg was big and swollen, his lips jiggled when he piaffed,…and his mother was a DRAFT horse!?..I had to have him!”
Any guesses who this speaker was?
(mind your manners here as this person is a legend in the USDF)
But not only that, they are choosing their selections from those KWPN very carefully to get that 6 out of 10. And although sometimes they get lucky and get a bargain, often they are paying a premium for the horses most capable of hitting those levels.
And that only makes sense, because that’s their job.
And as much as they might enjoy taking an off breed up the levels, the extra work it would take is taking food off their table. If they aren’t competing and winning, people aren’t dropping their horses off for training and signing up for lessons.
And the same goes if your only goal in life, the one thing that would make you happy, is to ride a horse at GP and win. Years spent on a horse that may or may not make it are years you’re not working toward that goal.
It does make perfect sense. And it’s why Lewin’s trainer has stalls full of the most amazing, gorgeous warmbloods ever to walk the earth (OK, I’m biased). And it’s why her young horse and her young rider WS, who is the talented girl I talked about earlier. are knocking them dead wherever they go.
All stuff nobody needs to convince anyone of, I’d hope
mishmash,
TB/Perch? Nice turnout and happily moving forward! Once you put hind shoes on him you will be pleased with the better balance and push off you will get.
[QUOTE=Ambrey;3356964]
And the same goes if your only goal in life, the one thing that would make you happy, is to ride a horse at GP and win. Years spent on a horse that may or may not make it are years you’re not working toward that goal.
AS much as I love your support on this draft dressage topic I have to Disagree with you on this point:
If your dream is GP and to win at GP first you must define for yourself what win means to you…the score or the ribbon? Personally for me, it is the score!
Secondly, ANY time spent developing a horse “that may or may not make it” is time spent working towards that goal. Remember, THIS IS ABOUT THE JOURNEY 
Registered Percheron
Preferred, he is full Percheron. Note the docked tail. Was originally trained as a hitch horse, but was too hot for the job.
He is usually barefoot, no problems so far. When we get to the point where we can do some serious showing, then may consider it. I have had a two year layoff-my health issues, and my riding needed to improve.
You cant tell it looking at the pix, but was taking everything I had to keep him in ring, and not fleeing to the safety of the barn!
WHAT are you talking about??? WHAT?
The majorities of the WB registires require inspection of mare and foal and for the sire to be approved through their registry or one they consider on the same base they are.
I DO know registires and I know them VERY VERY VERY well.
Please tell me what registires your speaking of?
Ambry, never mind. I realize you really dont know what your talking about and Id rather talk to the wall than try to explain how it works with each registry. Im burned out on this.
STF,
Forget about the registry spin on this thread, it’s been beaten down to dust.
What are your thoughts about the pro vs amateur argument regarding developing the horses of the less popular bloodlines? That discussion is more in line with the OP
[QUOTE=Phyxius;3356752]
Well, I wasn’t going to comment on the person who said “Phyxius, I saw the pic of your horse. He is very cute. I could not say he has a lot of talent for dressage.” From looking at a picture of my horse that is not a confirmation shot and is not a “dressage” action shot. I posted a picture of him in a hunter class, which he won by the way and a picture where you couldn’t even see all of him, but he oddly enough is covered in first place ribbons from a dressage show. So, really I’m not sure how an assessment of his talent could be made from the pictures I posted. Just for kicks I went to your website and there are some stallion pictures you probably want to remove lest people decided from the picture that he’s not talented. [/QUOTE]
Mercy, you seem to have quite the chip on your shoulder. I was only making the statement that a person (with an educated eye) could tell a lot from looking at a picture of a horse. I really wasn’t refering to YOUR horse. And I won’t even insult your stallion. However, our older stallion competed to Grand Prix sucessfully, and is a very sucessful sire. Our young stallion just made his Prix St. Georges debut at 7 years old, sucessfully AND was #5 in the NATION for Mature Stallions in the USDF Breeders Series last year. So really if you want to insult them, you just go right ahead. The proof is in the pudding as they say
Because you don’t want to hear it. There is a HUGE difference between the “shape” of a riding horse and what we refer to as Draft Horses. A Draft horse has not been bred for riding. And they certainly haven’t been bred for sport. A TB is shaped like a riding horse and many TBs are very good jumpers, hence their popularity as event horses. There have been many Warmbloods who have excelled as Event horses. After all they have been bred for sport and that includes jumping. Its all in the conformation. I do not have any experience with Cleveland Bay horses so can’t say one way or another.
Your horse looks very well cared for. I’ve never said you were cruel to him! And I have not said lower levels are unfair. And I’m guessing your horse is competing at the lower levels, but correct me if I’m wrong.
I’m sorry that not everyone is saying what you want to hear. As far as bashing and name calling, seems like you are heading down that road…
