The Taliban has offered to turn OBL over to a neutral country. We have rejected that offer and negotiations out of hand.
How will our response play in the Muslim world?
It certainly seems like a stupid reaction on our part to me. We are, after all, engaged just as much in a propaganda war as a fighting one.
Methinks the can of whoopa$$ will mostly hurt the innocent. I bet 70% of the Afghanistan population has no clue bout what is going on.
I’ll bet that NONE of the Afghani people has a clue what’s going on, because 1) the Taliban controls the media, 2) so many of them can’t read, and/or aren’t allowed to even learn to read, 3) they’re too busy looking for something to eat, and 4) a significant number of them are standing on the border while their OWN military beats them back into the country with sticks!
That said, I’m NY Democrat from a long line of Arkansass Democrats (Go, Razorbacks) and I was impressed with Dubya’s speech (As in “Dub-yuh” not “Double-you”). He’s no Anne Richards, but he’s more coherent than his Daddy.
PS to Robbie: Tony Blair? Tony Blair? All yours, darlin’; those public-school boys can be a little perverse. 
I didn’t see the speech, but I will accept that Hillary Clinton was stiff, unenthusiastic, however you want to describe her.
But have you stopped to consider that of EVERYONE in that room, she is the ONLY ONE who has been where George W Bush is now? She knows the briefings he’s had, she knows the price of what actions he’s proposing. She knows what is likely to happen from intelligence reports that she was privy to as 1st Lady, that the current crop of senators and congressment weren’t. Furthermore, she’s a senator from the state likely to be the target of future retaliations. One might excuse her from being less than “Oh YEAH! Let’s go kill some ragheads!” Out of curiousity, what was the physical reaction of New York’s OTHER senator? Was it shown???
BTW no one has mentioned Laura Bush’s reactions (on camera) to her husband’s speech. Are Mrs. Bush and the girls still under wraps at the secure location they were whisked to on 9/11? Just curious, haven’t seen or read anything about them since the attack.
~Kryswyn~
“Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo”
OMG, DMK is so d###ed insightful! 
I am pleased and proud to call you my friend. Isn’t this kumbaya thing great now…This from a NOT tree-hugging liberal…
What can I say…It’s late and I’m punchy.
Actually Ted Nugent did not write that letter though it has been attributed to him and yet another version was attributed to George Carlin which he in fact did not author. Either way it is an intriging letter!!!
SLW
I thought it especially titillating when a pigeon flew smack dab into Fabio’s nose a couple of years back while riding a roller coaster.
Please don’t even put them in the same catagory.Blair has sold UK.down the river.I dont think any of the wars over the past 75 years have done as much damage to the rural way of life as he has.In a few short years,he and his AR buddies have,one way or another completely ruined the country way of life that I was so proud of when I first came stateside in 1982.My family and friends are reeling at his total lack of compasion for rural areas and people.
Yes, he is a MEDIA WIZARD,he knows how to WOW the press,and it seems the American people.
Yes.he can run his mouth about the fight against terrorism,worldwide.Lets hope he will include cleaning up the awfulness in his own back yard.
He can be a very big MAN in the new world order,with the US behind him.
I’m sorry but I find him quite repulsive,the tragic events here, have given him a chance to ride on Bush’s shirt tails for a while and in doing so “puff his little chest up and be OH so important”.
In all honesty I was’nt too impressed with Mr.Bush to begin with.As each day goes by I am finding my respect for him is greatly increased.
Mr.Bush’s speeches just get better,I think that he will bring those that have terrorized the world to justice But it will take time and diplomacy to do the job properly.
The British as always will support him to the best of our ability.But you can bet your life that Tone &Cherry wont miss out on a single photo op.
God Bless America.
fernie fox
“I have lived my life-it is nearly done-.I have played the game all round;But I freely admit that the best of my fun I owe it to Horse and Hound”.
Yes! well I suppose it is a difficult choice for those of you who already have everything you want but my guess is this is a call to get you share voluntarily and get something for your money which is more than you will get from your taxes.
I find it so strange that while you are all so willing to share the government treasury with the terrorists of the world just so they won’t make your life incomfortable; but you cannot understand the need to spend to support the growing needs of those devastated by September 11.
Do they still teach sociology and economics in college? The government raises money by taxes and those taxes depend on income. Therefore if you don’t spend and you are hiding in your homes guarding your treasures the general tax rate will simply have to go up to make up for what you didn’t spend.
I think Hobson’s idea is the best compromise possible. Please do go out and buy-buy-buy but then donate those items you don’t need to those who would be really grateful to have them. That is truly the American way. Do you really think that Broadway will survive if we all stop going to see the plays because it’s just so inconvenient and uncomfortable.
Who do you suppose pays for all that food we are donating to Afghanistan? Didn’t you realize that when you pay your taxes you are a true philanthropist. I had the impression that you all were more than willing to pay taxes to support the other countries of the world so they wouldn’t be mad at us.
This is a really fun way to pay your taxes, you get to have all the fun of shopping and then unload all that stuff somewhere else so it won’t clutter up the house.
OH! YES! Weatherford the bully roars like a lion in the dark but it’s really just a boombox and the bully is really a yellow livered coward who can only beat up on women. The peacock struts to show how strong he because he can carry that big tail but that doesn’t make it so.
I really must confess I cannot comprehend this reverence for cultists who have declared that every American male is their target. I may find fault with our males, but I wouldn’t want to be without them. Who else can we send to war?
Maybe the game the next generation will play will be cowboys and terrorists. The only problem I can see is the Indians were a much more worthy opponent.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by M. O’Connor:
prevails against the crazies, we won’t be needing any of those fancy pre-green prospects/ eq horses or jumpers…the school horses may come in handy to go back and forth to town on, though…<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Amen! Hummm, since I’ll be riding to town, 13 miles each way, my horses hooves will wear down and I can ditch my fabulous farrier! Already SAVING money!!!
SLW
Nor, for example, should the incidents at My Lai (and the subsequent cover-up) have happened. Nor should Watergate, or any other number of political fiascos. 
The press are a safeguard against our government officials, elected leaders, military personnel, etc., doing something stupid and getting away with it. Likewise, there should be safeguards against the press doing something stupid.
But muzzling them completely and going only by official government accounts is, in my opinion, too drastic and removes one of the checks-and-balances that helps keep the higher-ups in line.
All very interesting stuff. One of the important features of the world’s great religions is their conservative nature–which is to say, they really do a good job when it comes to preventing economic evolution/transformation that outstrips the local resources’ ability to sustain new systems.
But this particular talent of conservative religion is limited to pre-modern, pre-industrialized culture. When modernization crashes into the culture, the old religions are really at a loss, and that’s where you get fundamentalism, as the devout adherents cling desperately to a structure that appears to make sense in the face of what they perceive as cultural annihilation.
The whole nice thing bout America is that we can and should question our leaders, no matter how unpopular. Many of the people on this BB who choose to make fun of Bush’s speech patterns have indeed offered alternate solutions to bombing a nation which already looks like a firing range.
I do not mock Bush, I just wish that at some point he would consider an alternate to war, at least entertain this notion of non-violence. Feed these starving people, make them strong enough to turn on their captors. Get them on our side.
We always seek to end these conflicts violently (of late, we do a little violence and stop…). Why not bomb them with bread, ideals of liberty and kindness? Help them to support their own revolution. If we bomb them now, and for some reason can not stomach finishing the job (Vietnam anyone?), we will assure that these people will never escape the starvation, and cruelty from their “leaders”.
Snowbird, I know you always want us to speak out, but frankly, many people are frightening me right now. People I remember as rational tell me I’m as bad as the terrorists for not wanting to blow up Afghanistan.
This whole thing saddens me. I’ve said what I stand for. I hope to GOD the only blood shed in this are the evil ones who bombed our nation, and the evil rulers of Afghanistan who think so little of women that they kill them for no reason. I hope not one US soldier dies, and I hope not one innocent Afghani bystander dies. If that makes me un-american than so be it.
We have been on this earth for thousands of years. God gave us this wonderful place, and created us in his image. It is time we learn how to deal with our issues by not killing one another, and we, the USA must take the lead and set that example.
Ride it Like You Stole It…
Actually, Jihad can be a positive thing. Many muslims are on a “jihad of the heart” with themselves to better follow the teachings of the Koran.
Jihad is not just about violence.
Anyhow, not a fan of Bush, but Hillary looked ill throughout his speech. Maybe she was really sick or something?
Ride it Like You Stole It…
that DMK has not already said better? So, I won’t even try. Thank you DMK.
I was just listening to NPR and there were clips from Mr. Bush’s speech and I was not even really paying attention, I am busy goofing off at work here, but I was wondering…when is he going to learn how to pronounce terrorist? Then just two minutes later I read Erin’s post. Heheee…boy did I laugh. Come on, it’s not a mean thing to say. I make fun of my husband all the time and I think he’s brilliant!
Betsy
You know… this thread had an early reference to peeps… Any ideas how to best combine Fabio and Peeps?
Good recovery there Inverness!
Incidently, have you ever heard the Drachensburg Boy’s Choir from South Africa sing? Heavenly they are. I love hearing a good choir sing myself - very stirring isn’t it?
It’s so much more amusing when you vent your vitriolic prose. I do enjoy your vehemence. It’s so much better to have an opinion, any opinion than no opinion at all.
Cowboys and Indians was as American as apple pie, back in the days when there was no TV and rarely a radio. Shoot all there was for music was a wind up victrola. A wonderful make-believe thing played outside in the fresh air, usually with sticks at best. By the way have you ever had the chance to play hopscotch ot jump double dutch ropes. That was our most favorite thing for girls.
Everyone had the opportunity to be on either side it wasn’t selective certainly not as violent as todays hockey or football games. I don’t think anyone ever thought of the Indian side as “indigenous natives” but rather worthy equal opponents. It was a way to build social experiences learning about each other and if you could play together then you would work together.
It was an opportuntiy to vent excess energy and pretend wars. No guarantee who would win, but rarely an injury in sight. I find that much healthier than children spending endless hours playing all those games where the sole function is to kill or anniliate the opponent which is OK! because it’s not real.
It’s so funny how times change isn’t it? Now, my grandchildren know that a grandmother like me would never buy them any part of one of those beastly games that blur the difference between make-believe murder and reality.
And yes! I am a horse person guilty of the same traits I think we all have to share, willing to admit my weakness and flaws. By careful study and analysis I have concluded the above and found very few horsemen who didn’t laugh and agree I was right.
As to the C Shows, I am aware that most here on the BB are not within range of my shows and I have always carefully avoided any effort to advertise.
I do however appreciate the commercial from you, since it is not self glorifying that way and it does confirm that you certainly are well aware of who I am and therefore I cannot be attacked for being nameless.
I hope you will not begrudge me the pleasures of enjoying life out of the lofty circuits of the elite. I’ve been there and done that and find it not very satisfying for my tastes. If you enjoy it then by all means I would not criticize you. Not many have the calling to give up all to pursue a dream. I myself prefer the compaany of dreamers at the lower ranked shows than the egocentricities of those who always want more winning at any cost.
Sadly, Snowbird, your views on insurance are a tad simplistic, but certainly do reflect days gone by…
The concept of not insuring high risk health insurance pools is in most cases against state law, and more recently, against federal law. Now of course, left unregulated, markets will seek to be most profitable and not leave themselves exposed to such risks, but the government has said that is Not A Good Thing, and insurance needs to be available to all who can afford it (of course that concept is a good for a giggle).
Now if we want to talk about profits and the high cost of health insurance premiums, this is where we enter the vicious circle. Given that health insurance premiums are high, the people who are most likely to opt out and pay rent instead are those that most likely will not need it. We call these people the “good risk”. Funny thing about rating pools, if you take all the “good risk” out, you are left with the “bad risk” (older populations, populations with chronic conditions, smokers, drinkers, those with poor dietary habits). Add to this the Insurance Axiom that the older the insured population is, the sicker they get. Voila, upward spiral your premiums, because the American population is on a bell curve to “old” and the bulk of the uninsured are much more likely to be the good risk that reduces the average cost.
As for the quandary of life insurance payouts, that is going to be a interesting indeed. Most insurance (health and life) have an exclusion against “Acts of War”. Now to think that a insurer is NOT going to pay the life insurance policy on someone who died on that horrible day is to not have a good grasp of the situation. Yes, they will pay. They will pay because the people who make these decisions are the same as us - people who experienced a horrific event and will do anything in their power to make it better, even something as small as paying out the policy.
On a more practical level, they will do it, because if they did not pay out on policies, and the government didn’t actually order them to (unlikely), they would be run out of business by people refusing to continue to do business with them.
The real battle (for those who follow these things) will between the original insurer and their reinsurers. Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus and insurance companies have insurance… This battle will hinge on - of all things - whether we are in a “war” or not…
As for premiums going up - life and health, it is likely. Health insurance costs were spiraling out of control starting about 4 years ago, and since health insurers run a 12-18 month lag on this kind of data, they were really caught in a hole starting in 1999. They’ve been catching up ever since. Life has always been a very stable, competative business so that will probably not suffer as much. In either case, most states require that a certain percentage of every dollar be spent on claims (called a loss ratio), and some states are very stict in that regard. In any event, and ASA/FSA has to certify the past and expected loss ratio for the insurer before any rate increases can be approved.
I know! Let’s have the press publicize everymove the US makes and then the terrorists can know ahead of time what we are doing and initiate evasive moves! Just like Desert Storm. Live war, all war all the time! Good idea. What a novel concept.Maybe Mr Clinton can establish phone contact with Bin Laden and just TELL him what is going on here. Remember, loose lips, unzips!
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