Bush opens up a can of whoop a$$

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Duffy:
Hehe M O’Connor…Health insurance was never my thing (hated it), but what DMK is saying, methinks , is that your health insurance premiums for this next year have already been decided. Nothing that has happened over the past months will affect it for, say, what?, another year or so?

Also, since the anthrax, etc., at least so far, seems to be orginating in the workplace, then the claims from such would be covered from workers compensation liability insurance. I’m sure that made SO much sense, right!?!?! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But Duffy - you only get the big bucks if you can explain it in 3000 words or MORE!!!

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> . Choke up Bin Laden or suffer the consequences. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Do you really think the Taliban can send some police to 123 Terror St. and incarcerate Bin Laden? Their only hope is that the man turns himself in or dies in his sleep. Honestly, the people of Afghanistan really can’t win this one. They can face the wrath of the USA or the wrath of Bin Ladens numerous supporters.

Ride it Like You Stole It…

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by magnolia:

I think the Bush vs Gore thread was the longest thread ever on the BB, mainly discussed by the same people posting here<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just knew there was some reason not to open the Bush vs. Gore thread when it appeared…

NP Fisher, I believe when I was listening to reports about the impending destruction of the buddhas (earlier this year?), that the Taliban had no specific issues with buddhism, merely with ANY religion that was not theirs.

Dogshuchu

I’m confused, in addition to the statement attributed to an unamed CNN spokewoman via the WSJ on the site I cut and pasted from, Fox news is reporting that as fact.

Do you think it was a hoax by the WSJ?? Upon your comment I did go read the statement on the CNN site, thank you.

For others here’s what CNN has on their site:
<There have been false reports that CNN has not used the word “terrorist” to refer to those who attacked the World Trade Center and Pentagon. In fact, CNN has consistently and repeatedly referred to the attackers and hijackers as terrorists, and it will continue to do so.>

SLW

My mom is a big Tom Clancy fan, as is my brother. Perhaps you would enjoy the Clive Cussler books as well. A lot of suspence and intrigue with a little romance thrown in. I really don’t know what your book list says about you…

Fabio and some peeps, now that sounds like a fun night to me.

Ride it Like You Stole It…

BTW, here are the articles that HeyYouNags mentioned in today’s Washington Post.

U.S. Was Foiled Multiple Times in Efforts To Capture Bin Laden or Have Him Killed

Sudan’s Offer to Arrest Militant Fell Through After Saudis Said No

The gist of the articles is that, essentially, the U.S. (and even that pesky Clinton administration) had been trying to get Bin Laden since about 1996, but weren’t successful for a number of reasons.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kellybird:
Here, I go, opening my mouth again~

Now for some nit-picking of my own…

Quote: “Originally posted by Snowbird:
Why would you be embarrassed if he’s doing a good job? Is it just that your disappointed because he is not as stupid as you estimated because he has not been merchandised like a package of cookies?” Endquote.

KBird Reply: The ability to speak in coherent sentences is now known as merchandising? I have no problem with Bush not being as well-spoken as other people I know, but I do have a problem when people use this as some sort of defense. Like having a higher-than-usual vocabulary or IQ is some kind of handicap…and that being average and mediocre are the new national goals. “Jus 'cause he don’t talk like a college perfesser don’t mean he’s a bad guy!” KIDDING

Quote by Snowbird “…Now, if you want to discuss embarrassment, I was embarrassed by the use the last President had for Cuban Cigars. I was embarrased by his behavior having some little girl.” Endquote

KBird Reply: She was 23 or 25, please don’t refer to a not-so-bright intern who falls in love with an older man a “little girl.” No one held a gun to her head and told her to perform certain activities for him, and if they had, I’m sure she would have leaked that info herself, instead of relying on ‘good friends’ to do it for her.

As for some reasons the Europeans didn’t like Bush? No it’s not because they are artistic people who appreciate a “package” that Bush doesn’t present and Clinton did–and why the preoccupation with the package? they disagreed with him on real issues. Just because a group of people–the Europeans in this instance–dsiagree with our leader, it does not stem from their collective shallowness. Perhaps they honestly thought his slashing of the Kyoto accords was a bad move? Maybe they don’t find our insane waste of electricity, gas, and other resources so attractive? Maybe they are insulted by the abuse we put our great expanses of land through? Capital punishment just doesn’t sit well with their sensibilities? The list goes on. Not saying either side is right, but please don’t write off any one who doesn’t wave a flag and scream “Proud to be an American” as someone against logic, especially if they don’t live here! Europe is not shallow, and I can’t imagine that they’d take kindly to be called such.

~KBird<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kellybird, you are a remarkable going-on-16-year-old. Your perceptiveness, rational outlook, and open-mindedness show through your every word. Truly, I think your post demonstrates that going-on-16 intelligence and compassion is often superior to the geriatric variety.

We were taught to not be emotional, we were expected to be controlled and not react. Your Dad is like the rest of us, we just didn’t discuss what was bad that happened. Why? bother it was over and life had to go on. That’s how we prevented all this stress syndrome stuff. We also didn’t look at what the children did right that was expected and only what was wrong was worth discussing. The War veterans never talked about what they saw or what they did or what they experienced. It was the way of our generation, what you felt was private and never to be exposed to the world or even anyone else. Bet your Dad said to you “we don’t wash our dirty laundry in public”.

I probably still have our ration books someplace because I am an uncontrolled pack rat. It was just a different time that taught different things, all this self analysis and self criticism was unacceptable.

But, I remember being limited in the amount gas that could be used per week, and food rationing. I’ll bet no one here remembers why at noon every Saturday the sirens went off! It was to test the sirens and make sure they worked in case of an air raid. This whole country was blacked out every night and there were wardens to check and make sure that no light showed out of the windows so that if a collaborater wanted to signal and give the enemy a landmark to negotiate by they couldn’t. You still have the test programs on TV that are left over from when we were afraid and then simply it became available for “emergencies”.

Yes! this country has not always been so carefree and safe and comfortable. So count your blessings and fasten your safety belt because we will endure and we won’t let anyone take away our freedom at any cost to anyone.

And, you’re so right YES! your Dad cares a whole lot, he’s worked really hard to help create this wonderful safe place so that his children would never have to know the worst that can happen. We kept our mouths shut because we didn’t want the children to worry.

Give him a big hug and let him know you understand. We haven’t even gotten close to a real state of alert yet and it might be coming but it’s worth it, whatever the costs. Bless this country and pray that our leaders will be wise enough and act at the right times to keep all the children safe.

I heard bin Laden today in his tape which usually is about two weeks prior to a disaster he creates. The leaders of Islam are terrified of him because he has seduced their youngsters into his beliefs and they don’t know what to do about it. They want us one more time to take the lead so they can blame us for what’s wrong and take the credit for what’s right. But, from all I’ve heard they are even more afraid of him and his soldiers than we are. He is a revolutionary who rules by terror and so are all his followers, they want to take what we have and they don’t want to build it for themselves. Israel is an excuse not a reason, the tolerance of the Saudi for us, is a reason to punish them, and so he will steal their children.

When our leaders tell us to go on with our lives and ignore the terror, it’s because that’s our best weapon and why your Dad, and your Grandfather react they way they do, that’s what we really believe is the best answer to every bully. There’s no better way to treat a bully than to pretend you didn’t even notice.

[This message was edited by Snowbird on Oct. 07, 2001 at 10:25 PM.]

And by the way, good luck in getting US consumers to agree to pay higher prices for consumer goods - globalization means lower prices, because we can make use of sweatshop and other forms of cheap labor to produce our sneakers and jeans. As such, US exploitation–errr,employment of foreign labor and resources is a great part of what enables us to live in the style to which we are accustomed.

that Japan spends less on health care because of the way they live. The traditional Japanese diet is mostly rice, vegetables and fish and they also use alternative medicine for chronic conditions. In the last 10 or 20 years, many Japanese have adopted a more “western” diet, which consists of lots of Montana steaks, and their rates of heart disease have risen quite a bit.
Betsy (in Md.) who also likes tofu …not like a granola health girl, but like a Japanese snack.

Weatherford… thanks for posting the link. Interesting article. But doesn’t it still come down to al Qaeda, which is essentially bin Laden’s group? I agree that we need to find our what state possibly sponsored it all, but if bin Laden is in Iraq instead of Afghanistan… well, I believe that will be found out. I dunno… maybe I’ve been thinking about all this too much and am not making any sense… but I still have faith that our military and our intelligence community will sort it out and they, along iwth our leaders, will act appropriately.

naive? maybe… but I like it at the moment.

If Dressage is a Symphony… Eventing is Rock & Roll!

News? Hmm… Lewinskygate was at least a few years ago. That’s awfully old news… and has very little to do with terrorists and Afghanistan, yet it’s been mentioned an awful lot on this thread.

Whatever. Sure, just chalk it up to my bad taste.

So does anyone actually want to talk about issues? Or are we going to go back to nitpicking again? We all know how everyone feels about nitpicking…

Pt and CWP, there’s just something about the outside of a horse that’s good for the inside of a woman!

Lions and Tigers and Bears, oh my!!

I understand that when you are young and inexperienced in the big world it’s easy to philosophize abstractions and believe the answers you have found are the only right ones.

However, I promise you that as you grow up you will find that the joy of this country comes from debate and not name calling. It is so easy for children when found speechless to resort to the usual recriminations and detail analysis to prove some abstract and illogical value system. I’m not so bad, because there are some who are worse! Didn’t your Momma teach you that good old American saying! “Sticks and stones my break by bones but names will never hurt me!”

I don’t know about what you learn in school but in my day we had a proposed hypothesis and then extended it so we could visualize the ultimate conclusions of the hypothesis.

You are quite right, I do feel that you have never endured life without all the comforts and from your cozy little desks it is easy to create an imaginary world full of imaginary playmates who are what you wish them to be.

Your morality makes you feel so good and so superior, but what really is your morality? Does it give you justification for bad manners and a lack of civility? So throw away my ideas if you will and rather than discuss the conceptual differences, call me names and be demeaning and insulting does that make you right? It only exposes you’re own real indifference to the kindness and generosity you choose to discuss as long as it’s in someone else’s responsibility. I am if nothing else tenacious and you do not humiliate me, you embarrass yourselves.

So I do not believe in beating up our government…what a crime I have perpetrated! So I believe that a cultist or a sociopath is not to be defended or protected but to made responsible for his/her actions.

Yes! in this real world I keep a rifle for an emergency so I can live until the police get there. But, shame on all of you, we have had the most uplifting period in the past 40 years of seeing those people who gave up their time and some their lives to help each other. And, why not for the money! not for the glory! not because they were trying to buy a good seat in heaven but just because they cared there were human beings who might have been alive and needed help.

I was in college when Karl Marx and his dreams of Utopia hit the college scene. I have seen the effects and so have you. Bin Laden and people of his thinking are not interested in a democracy, and there is no price we can pay to buy them. They believe and have a vision that let’s them endure more horror in one day than you will ever see on the screen.

Reality check please! How much money do you think we need to spend to buy Bin Laden? How far should we go? They have oil and they could have all the money they want! So what else should we offer them? Do you seriously believe that if we gave them the state of Israel it would stop there?

MY GOD! children these are terrorists and bullies who will pick at your weak spots until they are raw. How much will be enough? The White House? the Statue of Liberty? the Captial building?

George Bush whatever he may speak like, is intelligent enough to be surrounded by great minds who respect him. He is not just George Bush anymore he is the “President of the United States of America”. This is your country that has given you shelter and comfort and opportunity. If there was someplace better then we wouldn’t have an immigrant problem at all.

Whoever told you that it was the government who was responsible to you? It isn’t you are the government and under law the majority which is centrous makes the rules. Democrats and Republicans will disagree on principles regarding little personal issues but in this they are united,both, have had lesser Presidents and greater Presidents.

So you go ahead and make fun of my thinking if it makes you feel more important because that does not diminish me. You go ahead and make sarcastic comments about punctuation and speech habits if that makes you think you got something for the time you spent in college. It doesn’t change a thing.

This government is of the people, by the people and for the people and you are the people so get used to it. Elect liars and cheats who make you feel good and you will get what an electorate deserves when they don’t respect and honor the government. Elect Madison Avenue packaged people and you will prove that Andy Warhol was right. Will the can of Campbell’s soup take the place of God? Brave New World must have been on your reading list still, remember “Georgie Porgie Ford and Fin, kiss the girls and let’s begin?” When I read it I identified with the savage, with which group do you indentify? On the Island of the Alphas there always was war, so do you prefer the brain conditioned worker bees and babies raised in hatcheries?

Just maybe if you had a really open heart and mind (which you think you have) we wouldn’t have bitter and self centered politicians who are willing to say or do anything just to get elected.
Just maybe you could be a little more tolerant and cerebral.

YES! this is your world and you are making it in your own image. I hope you like what you get!

[This message was edited by Snowbird on Oct. 01, 2001 at 10:43 PM.]

…Patricia Highsmith, heidi, but two thumbs up on the others.

DMK, I read virtually no non-fiction any more, except stuff like Stephen Jay Gould (now there’s a smart man!) and other eco-related things…and of course, Steinkraus, de Nemethy, et al.

They do have gas masks for horses Erin!

I remember seeing pictures of them on the Milk-cart horses in England during the second world war

Think loonnnnggggg nose part

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SLW:

Were my 17 year old here posting she would be, like I, standing side by side with Snowbird. Ditto my father who is but a year younger than Snowbird.

SLW<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well that is sad indeed. I have to defend Republicans here and say that there are indeed nice and intelligent people who can take part in a conversation, debate or argument without resorting to pettiness or downright MEAN comments who are Republicans. I just haven’t seen any in this room (yet).

Betsy (in Md.)

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Who was it that posted we should drop food to the Afghans? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I do believe that was our friend the lovely Hobson! I’m so glad our government has chosen to do that for the people of Afghanistan. I hope they are getting the food, not the Taliban people. Is there even a precedent for dropping food on “enemy” lines?

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Maybe God will hear our prayers and one of the boxes of food will land right on bin Laden’s head and squash him like a bug. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Teehee. Good one snowbird. First, I hope he gets a bag of those Olestra chips and munches them all down and gets a big case of “intestinal distress”.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pt:
Wouldn’t it be nice if such situations as the WTC, and even the Israeli-Pakistan conflict, could be presented to some form of international tribunal that actually had the recognition and power to make its determinations stick. That would mean each nation might perceive themselves as giving up a part of their sovereignity, but it’s still a long way from “world government” and in a small world, we need the rule of law more than ever.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This could exist if only the UN had more teeth. One wishes that a certain nation whose name we won’t mention would be a better-behaved participant in global issues. The US is not the best neighbor in the world when it comes to promoting global peace…I mean, we won’t sign on to no-brainer stuff like anti-land mine treaties, and treaties banning children in the military? What’s up with that?

It goes for democratic and republican administrations alike that the US has for some time undermined the UN’s ability to enact meaningful treaties that would reduce conflict in a number of ways. And we KNOW why the US does not like the idea of an international tribunal–the existence of one would mean that Dr Kissinger gets pounced on immediately by Spain and Belgium (who would like to see him arrested NOW–you’ll notice that Henry never travels to Spain), and is indicted for crimes against humanity. THAT would shine rather too bright a light on the history of US foreign policy.

Anyhoo, I wish you’d stop calling me a liberal, pt. I prefer “subversive pinko lefty radical bleeding-heart tree-hugger.”