Cattle trailer full of horses overturned on I40 west of Nashville

[deckchick]

[QUOTE=Angela Freda;6088080]
Well that’s interesting, I fail to see how SNL, though hilarious, is relevant.
It doesn’t really answer the question of why the pro-slaughter posters consistently say they will be all for regulations of the industry if it comes back and enforcing those regulations… and want us to all shut up and ignore this incident of regulations ignored, broken or unenforced.

Do you or do you not believe that regulations should be enforced, even in this case?[/QUOTE]

What? Where do you get anyone has said to shut up and ignore this incident of regulations ignored, broken or unenforced?

Of course regulations should be enforced, blame the regulators/law enforcement people that don’t enforce rules/laws, not the pro-slaughter crowd.

At this point nobody knows what laws have been broken, and until the driver is charged it’s all just conjecture and hyperbole.

[Bluey]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;6088067]
Yup, they are busy because people want to eat horsemeat and are willing to pay for it. If there were no buyers for horsemeat, if they couldn’t make a profit, there would be no slaughterhouses, no matter how many excess horses there were.[/QUOTE]

Right, people are inventive like that, using all they may find in the environment we live in, including the horses we raise for so many purposes, some of them that one more time thru slaughter.

Kind of sad to see all that go to waste on some utopian idea of how the world ought to be run, forgetting the nature of our world, that is dog eat dog, from the smallest cell to the most complicated organism.
All feed off each other.

Horses have been first that one more renewable, natural resource humans evolved using, long before we could influence our environment as much as we do today.
That we evolved to be so handy gives us riches beyond imagination and so also some carelessly, wantonly wasteful societies.

I say, there may be plenty wrong in this accident, but that some may eat horses somewhere, well, that is stretching this a bit.

[7HL]

@Alagirl;6088039

Ok, one more time, I type slowly:

Business practices have not a damned thing to do with the truck ending up in the ditch.

Maybe we need to start investigating everyones business practices and personal background every time they have an accident. :lol:

What they put on the truck is nobody’s business, horses, pigs or unicorns. You do understand that?!

You should see how tight they pack the chickens in crates headed to Tyson in New Holland. Really cruel. Big trailer rigs with cages and feathers flying everywhere.

Don’t come with the cop-out of ‘horse forum’

HSUS has been mentioned in many of the news articles. It’s not surprising the ARAs are out.

Yes, a semi truck ending up in a ditch is public business. But not for the reason you want it to be.

How about DUIs and speeding. Should we publish everyones names?

A truck hauling rebar steel ending up on it’s side is public business, a driver falling asleep driving an empty rig is public business.

How about cellphone use, putting on makeup, or eating while one drives. All should be stopped. The Federal Gov noew recommends NO CELL PHONES in the drivers area. WHat about CB radios?

Or a truck being overloaded.
Or cargo that is not properly restrained.

Do they ever stack those chicken crates high. If they are in an accident chicken sh!t and feathers everywhere.

Where the truck was headed is irrelevant.

But the public needs to know.

Now, aside from there being horses on the truck, what is discussion worthy of this wreck?

NO.

That the farm does business with a shady feedlot in Texas? Not in this context.

I am sure they would sell all their horses to those that want to rescue them. Pony up the money and take care of them.

Maybe it was a concpiracy by the ARAs. An ARA terrorist put something in the drivers coffee to get him to fall asleep. Now they have the perfect PR event.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Liberty;6088015]

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;6087900]

How would you situate 38 horses on a trailer like this?

If my math is correct for 38 horses, loaded sideways (not slant in order to maximize space), this only gives each horse ~16.5" of room.[/QUOTE]

16.5 inches wide and 102" long…a full 8 foot 6 inches

Wider than most standard horse trailers on the road today…they would be loose loaded fairly slowly and stand sideways(slanted) normally of their own volition…and backward at that…

Tamara

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;6088067]
Yup, they are busy because people want to eat horsemeat and are willing to pay for it. If there were no buyers for horsemeat, if they couldn’t make a profit, there would be no slaughterhouses, no matter how many excess horses there were.[/QUOTE]

except for rendering/fertilizer plants and those that kill for zoos for carnivores

Tamara

[7HL]

Humane Society of the United States = PETA = ARA

Quoting “Humane Society of the United States” HSUS as a reliable source is as reliable quoting a Three Stooges Movie.

[Bluey]

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;6088155]

[QUOTE=Liberty;6088015]

16.5 inches wide and 102" long…a full 8 foot 6 inches

Wider than most standard horse trailers on the road today…they would be loose loaded fairly slowly and stand sideways(slanted) normally of their own volition…and backward at that…

Tamara[/QUOTE]

Any stock trailer longer than 12’-14’ generally has division gates in them, several the longer the trailer is, to keep the weight stable in there.
Even our 16’ one has a gate in the middle.
Would not be good to have all cram in the back when going uphill, some could get hurt then and the weight shift would cause the truck to fishtail around.

[Foxtrot_s]

I’m lost in all this - was it or was it not a double decker, looking at at he photos posted of a DD trailer. How does one get all those horses in?

Polo ponies are shipped packed close together - but moderately packed is safer than too many loose horses…and they are valuable.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Bluey;6088176]

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;6088155]

Any stock trailer longer than 12’-14’ generally has division gates in them, several the longer the trailer is, to keep the weight stable in there.
Even our 16’ one has a gate in the middle.
Would not be good to have all cram in the back when going uphill, some could get hurt then and the weight shift would cause the truck to fishtail around.[/QUOTE]

yes I think the Eby has three cut gates in it…

Tamara

[Liberty]

Bluey (post 183) - quote thingy messed up. That was Tamara’s post, not mine. Just so nobody thinks I feel that 16.5" wide x 8.5’ long horses exist.

Still not seeing how 38 horses could fit humanely on a 53’ long, 102" wide trailer (especially considering the divider gates and step-up section in the nose of the trailer Tamara posted).

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;6088180]
I’m lost in all this - was it or was it not a double decker, looking at at he photos posted of a DD trailer. How does one get all those horses in?

Polo ponies are shipped packed close together - but moderately packed is safer than too many loose horses…and they are valuable.[/QUOTE]

if you are loading the upper decks you use ramps made specially for reaching the upper end…unloading is the same way

Tamara

[luvmytbs]

Since it is public record:

http://ai.fmcsa.dot.gov/SMS/Data/carrier.aspx?enc=4yXa9gpTgU1vkkvlsi6rFhZ8d71eLznCfOmDKvFbzNs=

It seems the driver (whether the same one or not) has a problem with fatique and the company has a problem with vehicle maintenance.
They have another accident on record in which a person was injured.
Further checking into safety vehicle inspections for this company, they failed two out of six and their vehicles were taken out of service at that time.

The DOT is very much understaffed, checkpoints/weighstations on roadways I travel around here are mostly closed.

So we, the public, have to rely on companies to obey the laws, maintain their vehicles and assure they don’t send out drivers that are impaired.

[Angela_Freda]

[QUOTE=deckchick;6088132]
What? Where do you get anyone has said to shut up and ignore this incident of regulations ignored, broken or unenforced?[/QUOTE]

Right here, among others:

[QUOTE=Alagirl;6088039]
Now, aside from there being horses on the truck, what is discussion worthy of this wreck?[/QUOTE]
[my bold]

[Cielo_Azure]

GAO

Report to Congressional Committees

June 2011
HORSE WELFARE

“Action Needed to Address Unintended Consequences from
Cessation of Domestic Slaughter”

This doc is an interesting read. USDA specifically writes about the issues of transport as being the top priority of APHIS to fix through legislation. In effect, shippers don’t use “for slaughter” on their shipping docs until the last leg of the journey. They change the docs just prior to crossing the border. Therefore, the slaughter transport laws (such as the use of double deckers)doesn’t apply to them. See pages 28-33.

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:1y44xF0O-scJ:www.gao.gov/new.items/d11228.pdf+&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEEShC0-Tdin1RC9C4Jzot8yYLQAiNQnCZzVPkBl5RldC6aZR_UScbeiGl4K0ARLNIDJvA2iToI7-e0WhgOGqvsxqr_y9G2HY23RIgOyfh-sNy2v7nfZyxAMTmh7-JTUcGGHvaN8LN&sig=AHIEtbRMvjj1E8j7ARhpZ4-SsJr4Of1jaw

'APHIS’s transport regulation sets minimum care standards to protect horse welfare, but it applies only when the horses are being moved directly to slaughtering facilities, at which point shippers designate the horses as “for slaughter” on an owner/shipper certificate and move the horses directly to slaughtering facilities. Consequently, the regulation does
not apply to horses that are moved first to an assembly point, feedlot, or stockyard before going to slaughter. For example, a horse’s journey to slaughter may have covered several states, from point-of-purchase at an auction to an assembly point, such as a farm; from the assembly point to a feedlot or stockyard; and from the feedlot or stockyard to a point near a
slaughtering facility or a border crossing where the slaughter designation was first made."

The government believes there are huge issues with transport, they know it and have done the research. Funny that the USDA and the GAO know it and have sent a report to Congress writing that action is needed now. This is not hyperbole or speculation, this has been studied and the issues are real.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Liberty;6088189]
Bluey (post 183) - quote thingy messed up. That was Tamara’s post, not mine. Just so nobody thinks I feel that 16.5" wide x 8.5’ long horses exist.

Still not seeing how 38 horses could fit humanely on a 53’ long, 102" wide trailer (especially considering the divider gates and step-up section in the nose of the trailer Tamara posted).[/QUOTE]

IF I was loading a trailer like that…I may or may not pop 38 in there…it would be the sole judgement of the person loading the trailer
based on the load presented as all horses are not the same animal

smaller animals (ponies and such) go in the very front…close the gate

heaviest horses always go over the axles to stabilize the ride…close the gate…
tallest horses go in the very back…close the gate

they need to be in close enough and well matched (from an animal standpoint) specifically so that they cannot duck under the neck of another…that is the greatest risk… when they duck under, they run the risk of upending (and putting on the floor) whomever they tried to go under

you have to match them in temperament,size and weight as well as being aware of your trailer and truck sizes

Tamara

[7HL]

If those that want to make this a slaughter thread want to save the horses from slaughter, buy the horses and take care of them.

Maybe HSUS should start buying horses meant for slaughter and start taking care of them.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=7HL;6088221]
If those (Cielo Azure) that want to make this a slaughter thread want to save the horses from slaughter, buy the horses and take care of them.
.[/QUOTE]

Cielo Azure has as much right to speak on the subject as you or I do…

just FYI

Tamara

[luvmytbs]

@Tamara in TN;6088211

smaller animals (ponies and such) go in the very front…close the gate

heaviest horses always go over the axles to stabilize the ride…close the gate…
tallest horses go in the very back…close the gate

Tamara

Watching the KB’s around here loading horses after the auctions I only recall one who actually used partitions in a big stock trailer.

[7HL]

@Cielo Azure;6088209

GAO

Report to Congressional Committees

June 2011
HORSE WELFARE

“Action Needed to Address Unintended Consequences from
Cessation of Domestic Slaughter”

.

This is why we need to open new and more slaughter facilites in the US. The will and can process horsemeat.

If we do there will be shorter truck / trailer hauls to be processed.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=luvmytbs;6088230]
Watching the KB’s around here loading horses after the auctions I only recall one who actually used partitions in a big stock trailer. :([/QUOTE]

that may be…the answer was if I was presented that problem…

there may be conditions where the horses (thinking BLM specifically,but not totally) are just too dangerous to have someone physically walk the trailer and shut the door behind them…

that is also a clear danger to the humans…

Tamara